Community Relations Archive
Thread: *** A Formal Plea to TH, Tiggs, the Devs and SOE: No Flames, Just Talk! ***
ActiveNick wrote:
Jedi are underpowered (Yes, Master Defender works great, but the other 4 jedi profs need help).They are not getting the 1.5x times stronger character they have worked hard to get and many feel cheated. Several Jedi skills and templates remained buggy or imbalanced (powers, enhancer, etc.) and too many rumors are flying around. The Jedi community is turning on itself as it feels like 5 professions instead of one united front. On top of that, the respec has introduced hordes of new MBH characters that while it recreates the feeling that jedi should be hunted, it often borders on harrassment and ruins the playing experience of many Jedi. Low-level Jedi have trouble grinding since groups of friends, even same guild or same faction, give visibility. And the list goes on and on...
I agree whole heartedly with what you said except for th at point. Jedi are not underpowered, and its ironic you're stating the 'state of hte game' and you bring up jedi...
If the devs really want to help, if anything I guess, keep the jedi but I don't want them waving their magic wands in my face
teh_n00b123 wrote:
ActiveNick wrote:
Jedi are underpowered (Yes, Master Defender works great, but the other 4 jedi profs need help).They are not getting the 1.5x times stronger character they have worked hard to get and many feel cheated. Several Jedi skills and templates remained buggy or imbalanced (powers, enhancer, etc.) and too many rumors are flying around. The Jedi community is turning on itself as it feels like 5 professions instead of one united front. On top of that, the respec has introduced hordes of new MBH characters that while it recreates the feeling that jedi should be hunted, it often borders on harrassment and ruins the playing experience of many Jedi. Low-level Jedi have trouble grinding since groups of friends, even same guild or same faction, give visibility. And the list goes on and on...
I agree whole heartedly with what you said except for th at point. Jedi are not underpowered, and its ironic you're stating the 'state of hte game' and you bring up jedi...
If the devs really want to help, if anything I guess, keep the jedi but I don't want them waving their magic wands in my face
Thank you for your post. I truly respect your opinion and i can see how that statement can be misleading. But try PvPing or PvEing with a Jedi that has no defender skills. DPS is way too low, force and action costs are too high, and many skills are broken. I do not want to turn this into a Jedi discussion, because it is not. Just take a peek at the Jedi forum in the stickies, lotsa info there.
Yeah Jedi is totally broken.
I have a mid level template x-4-x-4 LS 4-1-x-x Def. 1-x-x-x healer + the novices and I can do more damage with my pistol (and I have zero pistol skills)than my fourth generation Light Sabre. And I cannot improve the DPS on my sabre because premium pearls are not dropping since the CU. Grinding Jedi is a nightmare now. I can either group and face a rentless barage of BHs or go solo and out of your face with my LS and ekk out 10k jedi xp an hour. Think about trying to get 1.6 Mil and 3.2 Mil xp boxes at 10k an hour. And the only way I can acheive that level of grinding is by using just about every CM speical in the book.
That is broken, this is underpowered, that is overpowered...
Don't you realise this is not a question of particular professions or the game itself at all? It is the the attitude and the circumstances. I have serious doubts any kind of pleas can change that.
Not all is simple. Take a careful look at the situation. This is common for modern hi-tech market, including software.
First side: E3 is launching shortly. The contract says "release a patch with masses of E3-related content at the E3 launch date". Mr Lucas (or rather an executive down the line) will get very upset if the patch is not released.
Second side: Whoever in the team had a bright idea about CU and was sure everything will be sorted out in february, is now tearing his ears off in despair, but cannot do anything - the CU is live and the workload on bug fixers is incredible. There is not enough time for anything.
Third side: The original teams attitude persists. Startups often do not realise (on the administrative level as well as on the workers level), that the moment they are hired by a mega corporation, the work standards have to change. Maybe i should not blame the team for that though - it might be that they are on a Cinderella position within soe. Underfunded or underequipped. Understaffed maybe.
Fourth side: As most of the clientelle are kids and teenagers, the client base tends to misunderstand the situation and often goes into unrealistic demands, flames and such. The team sucsessfully learned to ignore the client base because of that.
We ALL are hostages of this situation. The clients, the development team, even customer support for that matter. We could have been more decent from the start and not disgust community relations staff with bucketloads of bulls**t and flame. The development team could have concentrated on bugfixing, releasing new content only on particularly important occasions (like the E3 launch). The customer support service could have hired more competent people.
Do I see any way out of the situation? Not really. Maybe after another wave of criticism after the recent fiasco (long downtime the day E3 launches) in reviews the project will close. Maybe it will be stuck in theis semi-playable stage for a few more years and close after that. What i would personally like to see though, is a complete change of the top desicion makers for swg development team. Maybe some bright administrator can gracefully make his way through the circumstances i mentioned earlier.
It will fall on deaf ears like the rest, sadly, and probably get you a ban. I suggest posting constructive stuff elsewhere, such as allakazam's forums, as SOE moderation is anything but moderate.
JackGil wrote:
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...It will fall on deaf ears like the rest... ...I suggest posting constructive stuff elsewhere, such as allakazam's forums...
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This is a formal plea for information. Star Wars Galaxies is a game full of richness which rests on a very successful franchise, and while it has a lot to offer, it also has a lot to lose, and lies in a state of despair right now. Star Wars fans are passionate and devoted people, and many of them have been avid followers since Episode IV in 1977, 28 years ago, myself included. Most of us play this game because we love Star Wars. I was never a MMORPG fan before SWG, I peeked at UO and EQ by reading reviews and browsing their web sites a few years ago, gave AC a try for about 2 hours, and that was it. It was SWG that sold me to the notion of playing a MMORPG on a regular basis, and while newer games like FFXI, WoW and EQ2 have emerged with the promise of a different experience, I am and will most probably remain a SWG player for a long time. And whether you are new to SWG, a SWG veteran or a fan of MMORPGs in general, I'm sure you care about this game just as much as I do.
I want to make a formal plea to Thunderheart, Tiggs, the SWG developers and SOE in general in the name of all your devoted fans and players. I am in no way a true representation of the player base, nor have I been elected as such, but by reading on all the forums here, I am sure I can safely speak for most of us with the words I utter here.
We love this game, but we are worried. We do not know where it is going. It seems like many of our pleas for changes and communication have gone unanswered, feedback we provided seems to have been ignored. Let me get things straight by the way: I love the new combat upgrade. Granted, there are several imbalances left, several bugs that need to be fixed, and omissions that need to be rectified, but overall I see it as a very positive change, and I'm having a lot of fun. As I said, I cannot speak for all players but I feel I have a good grasp of the game and between my 4 accounts with about 15 fully developed characters on 4 servers (including Test Center), I have played many professions over the past (almost) 2 years and currently play as Master BH, Carbineer, Pistoleer, Fencer, TKM, Smuggler, Commando, Ranger, Scout, CM, Doctor, Armorsmith, Shipwright, Artisan, Merchant, Tailor, Dancer, Musician, Entertainer, Image Designer, and I aslo dabble in several other combat and crafting professions. Oh, and yes: I also have a double-master pre-CU Jedi Knight.
I am one of those who tries to stay positive and I remain hopeful that this game will get better and thrive. What mainly worries me and many others is how little communication we got recently. For the longest time we have been waiting for the combat upgrade, as it was positioned as the answer to many problems through various "state of the game" posts by SOE. Now we finally got the CU, a great new expansion (I loved JTL and I love ROTW), a new publish with new content and a few fixes. Previous to that we got some GCW changes and it may not have been the full revamp we were expecting, but it was a step in the right direction.
But what's next? We have no idea. The game has several problems and we seem to be getting no information about them. You are not telling us what is the direction here. We used to get several messages about the state of the game, future revamps, issues you would acknowledge, and we would at least get some reassurance from you that our words were being heard, and that you'd do your best to address what concerns us. Correspondents are quitting left and right due to this lack of communication, many people are quitting in frustration, others simply shrug and keep playing halfheartedly, but have this nagging feeling that something bad and worrisome is going on. Now that we live in the post-CU world of SWG, I may not submit an exhaustive list of problems/concerns, but I can easily name the following issues (in no particular order) as the top ones that seem to be recurring:
- Jedi are underpowered (Yes, Master Defender works great, but the other 4 jedi profs need help).They are not getting the 1.5x times stronger character they have worked hard to get and many feel cheated. Several Jedi skills and templates remained buggy or imbalanced (powers, enhancer, etc.) and too many rumors are flying around. The Jedi community is turning on itself as it feels like 5 professions instead of one united front. On top of that, the respec has introduced hordes of new MBH characters that while it recreates the feeling that jedi should be hunted, it often borders on harrassment and ruins the playing experience of many Jedi. Low-level Jedi have trouble grinding since groups of friends, even same guild or same faction, give visibility. And the list goes on and on...
- Entertainer-based professions feel neglected and abandoned. So many of them respec'd to combat professions as they do not see what their role in the game should be anymore. Most of their skills are now useless or provide little value, the 8-toon groups limit their ability to do good shows and have fun, they can no longer accompany combat characters out there unless they have some combat too, most of the combat-related props (weapons/armor) are now denied to them and they are utterly defenseless, confining them to cities and cantinas. They are still paying a high skill point cost (aside from a slight reduction in ID) and have been relegated as a pure social profession that requires a player to sacrifice their combat and financial viability in order to keep entertaining.
- Crafters feel neglected as most new content is combat-oriented, new ROTW rewards offer better items than they can craft, the CU left them vulnerable and defenseless and the also removed a lot of differentiation between combat-oriented crafted items. Other crafters like tailors, droid engineers and architects are crying for more schematics and new crafting options to make their wares more desirable and valuable.
- Several professions have long been neglected and often ignored and have been in need of long expected profession revamps. The CU had often been touted as the answer they were awaiting, and while some benefits were gained for a few of them, a lot more work still needs to be done. At the top of that list, we of course find the Smugglers, Rangers and Squad Leaders. Creature Handlers have also seen their game viability severely reduced for a long time now, and the CU is no exception.
- The Combat Upgrade that went live too early while so many things needed to be fixed and balanced. Several dungeons/areas remain unbalanced, being either too easy or too hard, including the Warren, DWB, Geonosian Lab, Corvettes, Krayt Hunting and Nightsister caves. A lot of loot fails to be dropping anymore, or drops unsatisfying content/quality (GDk loot, Krayt pearls, etc.)
- Dedicated correspondents keep providing valuable feedbacks and proposals from the community and yet it seems as though their words are ignored. Many quit, most are getting flamed by their respective communities as angry mobs decided to shoot the messengers since no one is talking to them. Correspondents post post post but it seems to be a one-way street for now.
- The respec was a good idea at first but has also created several problems: too many MBH, players that feel cheated since others got for very little cost what required a lot of effort, time and money for them to achieve, a player population that abused the respec mechanism to convert a few easy and affordable low-level boxes into normally-expensive high-level boxes, something that severely imbalances things, especially considering how fast it allowed most Jedi padawans to progress. Add to that the fact many never got a warning about their final respec and are now stuck with unwanted/broken templates. And now that it has ended, most fear that upcoming changes might break their final template of choice or leave them wanting a different one since most fixes will be introduced after the respec has ended.
- The poor state of the Galactic Civil War and PvP in general as we still wait for the real revamp. Factional armor was a good boost, but it remains so costly in resources and faction points that most either cannot afford it or simply avoid it. Most factional bases simply remain ignored as players see little motivation to take them down. More work needs to be done.
- A dedicated Test Center community that feels abandoned as they are taken down every time some serious changes or publishes need to be tested. Many of them dedicate the majority of their game time to TC and they feel like they do not matter anymore and their continuous efforts were in vain. They seem relegated to testing hotfixes and minor patches while they signed up for real testing.
I could go on and on, as there are too many issues to list and this affects *all* professions and almost *every* aspect of the game. There are a lot of amazing things that work well in this game and make it great, but these issues simply overshadow them too much and cannot be ignored or overcome easily.
I beg the other SWG players to do the following:
- Feel free to comment in this thread.Say if you agree or disagree, and add your own feedback to mine in this plea for information. But make sure to contribute, avoid simple bumps or /sign as the devs delete those. Let's keep this a real post.
- Please, I beg you: DO NOT FLAME, TROLL OR RANT IN THIS THREAD. Even if you disagree with some of the things I mentioned, please respectfully say so, but do not taint this thread as I would like to keep the discussion civil, mature and constructive. we all know TH, Tiggs and the devs hate to post in flame threads and would just end up ignoring it. Let's keep it clean, show we are willing to be positive and work with them, and await for their answers.
Well, TH, Tiggs, and all of you devs and SOE representatives, what we would formally like to know can be summed up with the following:
- What is the direction of the game? What's on deck for the coming year?
- What publishes do you have in the works? A long time ago TH gave us an overview of what the next 4-5 publishes would be. It would be awesome if we could get the same today.
- What do you ackowledge and what do you disagree with? Which issues do you pledge to work on, and which should we just accept for what they are. We do not need promises, just a general idea.
- When and how will you address the many bugs and imbalances that still plague us? Again, no promises or fixed dates needed, just an overview of what's to come.
- What is the status of our various professions? Something along the lines of answering 3-5 questions/profession per week would be great. You've done it before and we loved it.
- Whether players have a Jedi, are pursuing Jedi or never want one, I'm sure everyone is dying to know what you guys see for the future of Jedi characters, and what is to be their role in the game, PvP, PvE and the GCW.
- What are the plans for the GCW?
- What are the plans for future expansions, and what style will they be? (open planets like the original 10 worlds, restrictive immersion-filled theme parks like ROTW, or both?)
That sums it up. You do not have to answer everything at once, but a trickle of valuable and steady communication will go a long way to please and appease us. The ball is in your camp now. ![]()
Respectfully,
Nick,
a devoted Star Wars fan and SWG player. ![]()
SunSpy wrote:
You had my interest until I got to your first point. "Jedi are underpowered". Whatever...Jedi crybabies are the biggest problem in this game today. Jedi act like nothing else in this game needs any attention. Jedi act like nobody else in the game has anything wrong. It's all me, me, me and its killing this game. If you need an example look at the respec boohoo posts...all Jedi...and many trying to pretend they were "trying out another template" when we all know exactly what theywere really doing.
Thank you for your post,I understand your position and value your opinion. Please try not to get too emotional over this as I clearly championed almost all professions in my post. Jedi Master Defender works great, that is true, and since a majority of Jedi are master defenders, that is why many perceive Jedi as too strong already. Unfortunately the other templates with no defender have many many skills that are either broken or out of balance on the weak side.
I also fully agree with you that many Jedi do not make our profession proud. Hopefully I am one of those who tries to raise the bar. I roleplay a DJK, do not wear any Jedi Title, I do not flaunt my skills uselessly, do not taunt or give anyone flak for not being a Jedi, do not shout "DUEL ME PLZ" at starports and I stay in character in spatial about 90% of the time.
I also agree the respec system was abused and I feel ashamed to be associated with a profession like this that was supposed to be hard to achieve. If it means anything to you, I was already a double-master DJK template (full 250 sp) before CU and only used the respec to experiment with different templates until I found one I prefered. I did not have any respec problems and I am not asking for more (I posted this original message before Tiggs answer to the respec problem).
Also, I never said nothing else in the game was wrong. I clearly indicated many many areas of SWG that are non-jedi related where flaws and serious problems exist, including other combat profs, enterftainers, crafters and communities. I know it's easy to generalize about Jedi based on the sorry state of the current Jedi community, but please, do not include me in a generalization that definitely does not apply here.
Message Edited by matlock065 on 06-01-2005 01:12 PM
but i agree, currently, jedi are very weak