Community Relations Archive
Thread: Question for Developers: Is using or creating Appearance mods out of EULA?
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gera
Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:29 am
#1
After Tiggs announcement about 3rd party programs, I believe it was about 3rd party macros. However,
Just because if we don't like your art department works, or developments art decisions, using our tools changing our appearance folders or musics or effects, is it against EULA?
Currently I created some self-changes inside game such as:
Lightsaber textures: They are not realistic at all, they did not glowin any game or movie like in conical shape, nor should in game. Edited DDS files to make them static single line rather than "coNical" and "coMical" shape.
Force Meditate: That is really more unrealistic when Developers thinking Jedi should be in hiding and still doing all of their effects "show-off" and Developers stated(to Jedi correspondent) any Jedi movement should be show-off movement.Changed DDS files with blank ones, removed sound and explosion glow under meditate. Now it is just like Teras Kasi Meditate, silent and peaceful as it should be.
Swoop bike to Speederbike: We knew how Speederbikes goes in movies, why was it slow at all, just because we see swoop in Episode 2 does not change the fact Speederbikes were fastest. Same for keeping my speed.
AV-21 to AB-1: Actually AV-21 is a complete unrealistic, no Star Warsy just a ferrari copy of real life. At least with now AB-1 I can feel myself in more Star Wars enviroment without loosing terrain negotiation & speed (also unrealistic such large vehicle to have that much terrain negotiation)
2H Saber Animation changes: There are much more beautiful animations in animation.tre file for 2H then current. I really wonder how art team can be that much untalented (or lazy) to find them.
Music: Updated many scores to John Williams original scores with more "combat enthusiastic" sequences.
Composite armor / BH armor to Mandolarian Armor: Even mandolarian armor is in game, wondering where the hell composite armor came from. Which movie ? I would rather see many BH mandolarian armor around me than unknown robotic creatures.
On armor issue, did you notice how lazy art department is to create "face showing" armors? Really, there is no SINGLE armor that shows face since first art team. New Rebel armors are such stupid changes. However, I changed Recon / Assault / Battle armor helmets to "Rebel ROTJ helmet"
- Changed all Clone Armor to Stormtrooper Armor. There is no clones in this timeline. Nor any non-broken armors of them.
Trandoshan Rifle to E11 Carbine: "Star Warsy" means anything to you?
New T21 toPre-CU T21: No more stupid extensions
Removed Force Run tails: I didnt see any comet behind Obi-wan& Qui-gon Jinn while they force running.
Hooded Cloaks over Jedi robes: YES, Development team could not do it, thanks to 3D programs, everything possible in few minutes. I believe they are just don't want to move their fingers.
Changed some gloves to others to be wearable over bracer parts: That is a stinking property. How come I can not wear cold weather gloves over a cold weather jacket.
Changed Lightsaber Colors (such as Sunrider's Destiny to Baas's Wisdom): Ugly green word meant anything? If I will see this green everywhere I would rather see "dark blue" color.
All those changes are seen noone but myself. But I feel myself playing in Star Wars universe much more immersed. They are just "home-made" art changes and not effecting anyone but me. If "STAR WARSY" feeling is "respected" even by a little, modding is the way to go because there is too much non-Starwarsy, more "21st Century EARTH" elements in this game.
And not to mentionArt Departments laziness about Armor selection or new clothes making (no offense SWG-Goliath) but really something HAD to be done for me to love this game as a "Star Wars" game much more.
I don't believe I break EULA, because I do not change any transmission going from my client to server or change any data effecting game play. But something needs to be "more Star Warsy" in this game for me to be playable a bit more...
Message Edited by gera on 09-01-2005 01:35 PM
Tiggs
Thu Sep 01, 2005 2:55 pm
#2
gera wrote:
After Tiggs announcement about 3rd party programs, I believe it was about 3rd party macros. However,
Just because if we don't like your art department works, or developments art decisions, using our tools changing our appearance folders or musics or effects, is it against EULA?
Message Edited by gera on 09-01-2005 01:35 PM
The 3rd party progam post was not only for macros but all programs. Changing anything with game play is considered against our EULA or TOS agreement including changing art, music ect.
fishbrains
Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:01 pm
#3
Tiggs wrote:
gera wrote:
After Tiggs announcement about 3rd party programs, I believe it was about 3rd party macros. However,Just because if we don't like your art department works, or developments art decisions, using our tools changing our appearance folders or musics or effects, is it against EULA?Message Edited by gera on 09-01-2005 01:35 PM
The 3rd party progam post was not only for macros but all programs. Changing anything with game play is considered against our EULA or TOS agreement including changing art, music ect.
anything with gameplay? So voice chat programs?
Red-Dwarf
Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:03 pm
#4
As a minor quirk of history- be aware such mods can cause crashes in SWG and...welll....embarass Tiggs when she has to ask if people have certain mods in launchpad chat. 
GlargTheKelfn
Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:04 pm
#5
what about the big stickied thread ( here ) of how to change your in game music without violating the eula? is that one NOW agsint the rules? maybe it should be unstickied then 
hehehe
heheheMessage Edited by GlargTheKelfn on 09-01-200505:06 PM
Message Edited by GlargTheKelfn on 09-01-2005 05:06 PM
Bucke-Thead
Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:37 pm
#7
Tiggs wrote:
gera wrote:
After Tiggs announcement about 3rd party programs, I believe it was about 3rd party macros. However,Just because if we don't like your art department works, or developments art decisions, using our tools changing our appearance folders or musics or effects, is it against EULA?Message Edited by gera on 09-01-2005 01:35 PM
The 3rd party progam post was not only for macros but all programs. Changing anything with game play is considered against our EULA or TOS agreement including changing art, music ect.
^^ That's the game I want to play
nikko11
Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:57 pm
#8
affect sounds and artwork on your own client should have no effect on others, and doesn't actually affect anything, so you couldn't get caught.
However, it might cause problems in Launchpad scans or something, so I wouldn't recommend it.
However, it might cause problems in Launchpad scans or something, so I wouldn't recommend it.
Swan-Jedi
Thu Sep 01, 2005 4:09 pm
#9
fishbrains wrote:
Tiggs wrote:
gera wrote:
After Tiggs announcement about 3rd party programs, I believe it was about 3rd party macros. However,
Just because if we don't like your art department works, or developments art decisions, using our tools changing our appearance folders or musics or effects, is it against EULA?
Message Edited by gera on 09-01-2005 01:35 PM
The 3rd party progam post was not only for macros but all programs. Changing anything with game play is considered against our EULA or TOS agreement including changing art, music ect.
anything with gameplay? So voice chat programs?
Good question, and also what about Fraps (other in-game movie capture software is availible
) Is that now in violation?
sciguyCO
Thu Sep 01, 2005 4:11 pm
#10
GlargTheKelfn wrote:
what about the big stickied thread ( here ) of how to change your in game music without violating the eula? is that one NOW agsint the rules? maybe it should be unstickied then
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that (as minor and cool as it is), that the poster is wrong in this section (bolded part is excerpted from the EULA, the italics is why it doesn't apply to the music mod):
You may not use any third party software to modify the Software or to change game play.
When you are changing the music you are not using a third party software program, aditionally you are not changing the way the game is played
When you are doing an appearance mod, such as turning your protocol droid into vader, you will be using a third party program, to extract from the .tre file, but not to modify the software. You will be using the same method described here. This does not overwrite, change, or editany game files, it merely prioritizes the read process the game uses, to use these files first.
A lawyer could (and possibly would) argue that using Windows explorer to create a "music" directory, and to move mp3 files into it (which is checked first prior to extracting the music from the tre files) is using third-party software to modify the SWG directory structure. Sure it's software that every user of SWG is required to have (since we can only run SWG on Windows, and you can't make Windows run without explorer), but it's not software written by SOE.Therefore: third party.
And despite the poster's assertion, it does change how the game is played. Not in any hard-numbers sense, but it could be argued that the music provided with the game was chosen for specific gameplay reasons to set a particular mood, and changing that music changes the gameplay experience.
Please note: when I say "could argue", I'm not saying "argued by me". I think cosmetic client-side mods are harmless. However, I am not SOE, LucasArts, or a lawyer, so my opinion on whether it's against the EULA doesn't matter. Technically, it is (although SOE has the choice on whether to vigorously enforce it or not).
Yoiaholic1
Thu Sep 01, 2005 4:33 pm
#11
Before this is even an issue that SOE pursues I think that the EBAY JEDI need to be removed from the game. Selling or trading accounts is forbidden in the TOS and EULA.
Seriously, how many of you know a character that has been sold multiple times? The problem is that jedi accounts never die and that leads to the huge population problem people experience with jedi. There aren't a lot of us, but the number NEVER decreases as the overall game population changes.
Please Tiggs, look into this before (or even concurrently) a huge deal is made about people that made a client side change to game graphics.
KupyiLabe
Thu Sep 01, 2005 5:03 pm
#12
Tiggs wrote:
gera wrote:
After Tiggs announcement about 3rd party programs, I believe it was about 3rd party macros. However,Just because if we don't like your art department works, or developments art decisions, using our tools changing our appearance folders or musics or effects, is it against EULA?Message Edited by gera on 09-01-2005 01:35 PM
The 3rd party progam post was not only for macros but all programs. Changing anything with game play is considered against our EULA or TOS agreement including changing art, music ect.
Would you mind specifying the clause in the EULA and TOS that forbid this? You may be on legally shaky ground here (IANAL).
EDIT: To be clear, modifying data files is not modifying software, and art/music changes may not fall clearly under that clause. I think SOE would be well-served to make sure that they are in fact prohibiting what they think they are before making these posts (normally, I am a complete dev supporter but this is ringing my FUD alarms).
Message Edited by KupyiLabe on 09-01-2005 07:11 PM
1963explorer
Thu Sep 01, 2005 5:06 pm
#13
You shall not: reverse engineer, derive source code, modify, decompile, disassemble, or create derivative works of thissoftware in whole or in part.
Any copyrighted software has this, or similar, in it's software license. (And many countries have this stated in their copyright laws.)
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