Commando Archive

Sorry, but I'm kinda angry here. Under no circumstance should any non-heavy weapon have an AP value of 3. It completely defeats the purpose of having heavy weapons when a rifle that can be used by anyone willing to invest a week's work to get to Rifleman does the job just as well, without requiring any skill advances beyond novice to be effective, no limitation on use, half the refire delay, and a plethora of single-pool special attacks with extremely high damage multipliers and no way to rapidly heal the targetted pool. This condition must be remedied, and with alacrity. Heavy weapons should be the be-all, end-all of anti-armour artillery. Nothing should be able to even compare. As the system currently stands, however, a novice Rifleman with a T21 is a superior anti-armour unit than a Master Commando, regardless of the Commando's weapons or secondary skill sets.

There are three potential solutions to this problem:
A) Reduce AP values on the T21 rifle to AP2, reduce Laser rifles to provide clear distinction.

B) Introduce a fourth level of armour piercing, available ONLY, with no exceptions, to heavy weapons.

C) Hard-code all heavy weapons to ignore all armour, regardless of armour rating or AP values, and instead are modified only by resistances. This should be accompanied by a LARGE increase in damage, to compensate for the loss of AP damage multipliers against light targets.

Note that for purposes of this post, Launcher Pistols, Flamethrowers, and Heavy Acid Rifles are not considered heavy weapons, regardless of XP given.

So... The T21 insults you with it's high armor stats eh??? Well not to mention that i totally agree with you, the thing that insults me is the fact that these stupid pple just dont get it. IM INSULTED BECAUSE THE T21WAS EVEN RE-INTRODUCED INTO THE GAME BEFORE YOU DEVS FIXED OUR CURRENT WEAPONS. That is the real slap in the face here. I mean come on these Rifleman alrdy have high powered weapons that deliver huge damage. FIX our flamethrower, acid rifles, and ALL of our weapons before catering to another profession.

Iatip Ehievea- Novice Commando (Master Gnort Slayer) seeing that is all i can kill with my weapons

I agree that it's ridiculous. Now Riflemen are better Commandos then Commandos are. Something's wrong with that picture, isn't it?

A fourth solution to this problem presented itself, although it's not my idea, and I can't remember whose it is. If it's you, show me the post and take credit. Also, I don't know about the feasability of it from a coding standpoint, but the idea still has merit.

D) Make heavy weapons have a sort of reverse armour piercing, where the higher the enemy's armour rating, the more damage the weapon would deal.

That said, a few more things need to be clarified about this. First, the damage should not be reduced by low armour rating. This would be silly. It should be increased by a high armour rating, at approximately the same scale as normal AP works, but hitting an AR0 enemy with a heavy particle beam should not cause a mild tingling and disorientation, but rather a sizable cavity in the body. The other thing to be clarified is this: DO NOT CONSIDER REALITY. I repeat, REALITY HAS NO BEARING ON THIS MECHANIC. It is for game balance purposes exclusively, so any and all attempts to give this a realistic spin will be met with a referral to this original disclaimer and a healthy dose of scorn.

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Issik wrote:

B) Introduce a fourth level of armour piercing, available ONLY, with no exceptions, to heavy weapons.

C) Hard-code all heavy weapons to ignore all armour, regardless of armour rating or AP values, and instead are modified only by resistances. This should be accompanied by a LARGE increase in damage, to compensate for the loss of AP damage multipliers against light targets.

Note that for purposes of this post, Launcher Pistols, Flamethrowers, and Heavy Acid Rifles are not considered heavy weapons, regardless of XP given.

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Clearly B and C is the way to go. Unfortunately, armor-ignoring weaponry would make perfect sense for Commando weapons, would not do obscene damage to unarmored targets, and in general is outstanding in every way. Coding timemay well preclude this from ever being introduced.

I agree, B or C would be my ideal options, or possibly D, although I don't like it. C would be a far more civil and balanced option, allowing Commandos to do the heavy work, like AT-ST bashing, while still being balanced in PvP. I like B better though, simply because it provides the realistic, balls-to-the-wall savagery of utterly eradicating an infantry unit in a hail of explosive shells. If push came to shove, though, I'd definitely have to pick C, simply because it would prevent all the ub3r-l337 haxxor guys from skipping over to Commando to deal out hellacious damage on a wholesale basis in PvP. What can I say, I like exclusivity.

I too like C, because it would Really help against the Heavy Armor things, since hardly anything can damage them. But, it would probably be hard for the devs to code that kind of thing, D would be even harder to code I bet. About the 4th level of armor, like Super Heavy? I would think AT-ATs would have that, and there would have to be some kind of Master Commando weapon with level 4 AP, like a Proton Torpedo or maybe some kind of huge mortar shell. The Rifleman issues are crazy, especially about the part with no way to heal the mind wounds during a fight, even with a good combat medic. I do think that rifles would be themostaccurate and deadlyanti-person weapon, more slow and accurate than any other, so perhaps one thing they could do is speed up the commando weapons - where snipers are slow and precise, commandos could be just spraying fire all over i.e. the Flamethrower. But that doesn't seem to be like a real "commando" does it? Just get the devs to freaking rename them Heavy Weapons Specialist already! They're never going to make enough changes to make them Anything like a real commando!

AT-ATs should definitely have AR4, and a healthy dose of HAM, as well. Of course, there should be a weapon to deal with these behemoths, and I like the idea of a Proton Torpedo or a Concussion Missile as a weapon. Give them low charges, absolutely posistively no more than ten, and make them difficult to make, but not impossible. They should then do obscene damage, to the tune of several THOUSAND, and place the certification at Master Commando or at Heavy Weapons IV. This should hopefully keep them rare, but available, and the high certification and ridiculously tiny number of charges would prevent them from being use as anti-infantry weapons by every Tom, **edit** and Harry who grabbed 40k Combat XP on the way to wherever. Also, no Area of Effect. It's just not necessary for the purpose, however unrealistic it may be, and would prevent abuse against groups of PvPers.

The T21 still remains low basic damage. We don't need higher AP, only the same and much higher base damage.

Don't disagree that one weapon of a class with 4 other working weapons shouldn't be looked at before a class with no working weapons, though.

It only takes about 8 hours to get Rifle specialist, so about 12 hours for Novice Rifleman.

If Commando weapons ignore armor, then something needs to be done to other class' weapons that don't ignore armor, and get damage bonuses.

I think it will even out somewhat, with the rate of fire. Commando weapons should be slow, but do good damage. A commando may be able to take 5k damage a shot, but has to wait 15 seconds to fire again. This makes the commando very powerful, but the drawback is the inability to engage multiple targets rapidly and the use of weapon charges.

I agree the commando should be the only class able to use highest armor piercing weapons. Rifles should have higher piercing than pistols or carbines though.

I don't know about you, but i'd rather get punched while holding a flame thrower than a T-21.

Look at all sides, we can handle someone running up on us cuz our weapons work well at close range aswell and don't take a damage multiplier. And if someone runs into my 20meters while I got my flamer out...it's the Colonels own dark rotisery on their *ss.

It sucks getting slapped while holding a rifle, no matter who you are, you panic when someone suddenly appears standing ontop of you after they teleport in through the power of lag. With a launcher pistol and a solid point blank shot, I can keep my cool. And hey, get this...We have grenades that multiply damage when they hold out their rifles. You wonder why we need unarmed, well, that's our unarmed hit right there...and we don't even have to switch weapons.

Yeah they get AR3 but they also get the dog crap beat outa them by pistoleers... read some of the horror storries of riflemen getting off two or three shots before being fired at, and still losing to a pistoleer. With 75% reduction of damage, one hit kill shots are rare, but if they do happen Kudos, we will get em too.

Riflemen vs. Riflemen sucks to have a T-21... Base damage isnt that impressive, and if you try a special, youre sappin your own life away, cuz some guy with a DL20a will likely kill you after you blow your mind load on a headshot three or a mindshot 2 and it misses.

I'm a commando, **edit** proud to be, and I will always be one, but not are we only commandos, we're also master marksmen. So if you can salvage six more points, you too can have a T-21, thats what I did, not because I want to one hit kill some poor chump sitting at a mission terminal, but because g*dd*mn*t, I wana see that towering steel monster fall at any cost, even if it means half my mind points.

Theres two sides to every coin, and right now, riflemen and commandos are both getting poked with our pants down... So instead don't be upset we werent first to get fixed... perk your little heads up and whipe away your tears, cuz this means we're all gettin what we deserve, weapons capable of competing with pistoleers!

We're commandos! Bad *ss*s by nature... We have already weathered through almost two months of this...and I don't take it as an insult because they can out damage us, I take it as a harbringer of hope, that some day soon, every other class will b*tch that we are now the killers we were designed to be.

And I ask you now, what's easier... buildin up a few more points to become a pistoleer, carbineer, or rifleman...

Or mastering an entire profession and burnin up more skill points than any master rifleman or master pistoleer can salvage.

I can pick up an FWG and be a pistoleer in an afternoon... Hell I did it with rifleman and a Dl20a. They can't

So to hell with the armor rating and who now beats us now, last I saw, chefs we're stickin it to us...

Now stand tall, and look mean!

WE ARE COMMING INTO POWER SOON ENOUGH....until then, ah hell, stick with the chubas

Oh... sorry about my rant. I'm a commando, and have a lot to be proud of...

(This rant was a chance to look at both sides and by no means warants a flame)

Um, did you guys not read the Patch Notes for 8/20/03? Unless it was UnNerfed again in yesterday's update.

T-21 Rifle update: Reduced armor piercing class from heavy to light.

T-21 Rifle update: Increased fire rate.

T-21 Rifle update: Reduced the overall damage per second.

T-21 Rifle update: Increased chance to hit.

no, it's going back to armor pierce 3 and everything is being reversed.