Commando Archive
Thread: Well...At least someone has fixed Grenades... (semi-rant)
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garvin
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:04 am
#1
Ok...since becoming your Correspondent I have tried to avoid (at least publically) from falling back into my pure rant ways...sometimes I succeed...sometimes I fail...
The last 2 nights something has been really bothering me and I thought I'd share it with you all...this is not meant to upset all of you or create a rant thread, but rather express that our fix requests to our grenades need to come sooner rather then later (I have not received any confirmation of a timeline on our fix requests yet)...Hopefully the Devs understand that this is one of our biggest issues and address it soon (like before publish 10)...
With the latest patch to TC, NPC's have started using specials and switching weapons...this is overall a good thing since it makes them more interesting (and challenging) to fight in many ways (they hit a lot harder then before)...
But there is something bad...very very bad...that I've witnessed on TC that leaves a bad taste in this Commandos mouth as well as an air of resentment towards this latest change....
The last 2 nights I have been running my usual Blood Razor NPC missions on Lok to make a bit of fast cash...with the latest patch they now will switch weapons as well as use specials...one of the weapons they tend to use is "Fragmentation & Imperial Detonator Grenades"...It's cool to see them use grenades...but one thing I noticed...I got within 3m of the NPC as they used their Grenades and guess what...NO HAM COST & (worst of all) THEY DO NO DAMAGE TO THE NPC USER!!! Our grenades damage us if caught in the blast radius but they don't damage the NPC if the same thing happens to them????
I'm all about making things more fun and interesting, but let's be fair here...we've practically begged for fixes to our Grenades, and the Devs delivered...to NPC's and not to us yet...UGGGGHHH!!!!
Other then that...the other thing that bugged me (as I'm sure you will ALL agree)...NPC's have no delay for weapon switching...I witnessed the NPC's I was fighting go from pistol to axe to unarmed to pistol to axe repeatedly with no delays...sometimes with only 1 second inbetween each switch...anyone can test this by running close to a Blood Razor, then as soon as they equip a Melee weapon, run quickly away and they'll IMMEDIATELY go back to their pistol with NO DELAY....
I thought the AI Enhancements were suppose to make them play more like a live player...but if this is the case, why do they get advantages we don't? Shouldn't they suffer the same penalties...
I'm sure it's more complicated then that...Nobody want's to see an NPC keep killing themselves because the AI choose the wrong weapons/grenades at the wrong time...or get stuck in a 5 Second Weapon Delay loop that makes them not attack...but come on...I feel like these NPC's are teasing us with issues we hold dear...if it's good enough for them...it's good enough for us!!!
Ok...rant done...got that out of my system...time to bring this up yet again in the Correspondent Forum!!!
Message Edited by garvin on 07-29-2004 09:18 AM
Ster
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:10 am
#2
/applaud
I completely agree with you Garvin. If we suffer penalties then so should the NPCs. There is no reason for us to be so heavily affected by grenades and the weapon switching delay while the NPCs have no problems what-so-ever. This also shows that they could do a quick fix to grenades very easily since they have already implemented them to NPCs. So this begs the questions, why havent they done it for us? If the high HAM issue and damage to the user is so small and insignificant, then why don't they impose the same penalties to the NPCs?
jessedredd
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:11 am
#3
Npc's finally get some love and they shake it in our faces. Stupid npc's, I'm gonna kill a whole bunch of them tonight. That will show them. Flaunt there stuff like that, humph.
*wanders off toward teh GAT*
Restrik
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:16 am
#4
garvin wrote:
Ok...since becoming your Correspondent I have tried to avoid (at least publically) from falling back into my pure rant ways...sometimes I succeed...sometimes I fail...
The last 2 nights something has been really bothering me and I thought I'd share it with you all...this is not meant to upset all of you or create a rant thread, but rather express that our fix requests to our grenades need to come sooner rather then later (I have not received any confirmation of a timeline on our fix requests yet)...Hopefully the Devs understand that this is one of our biggest issues and address it soon (like before publish 10)...
With the latest patch to TC, NPC's have started using specials and switching weapons...this is overall a good thing since it makes them more interesting (and challenging) to fight in many ways (they hit a lot harder then before)...
But there is something bad...very very bad...that I've witnessed on TC that leaves a bad taste in this Commandos mouth as well as an air of resentment towards this latest change....
The last 2 nights I have been running my usual Blood Razor NPC missions on Lok to make a bit of fast cash...with the latest patch they now will switch weapons as well as use specials...one of the weapons they tend to use is "Fragmentation & Imperial Detonator Grenades"...It's cool to see them use grenades...but one thing I noticed...I got within 3m of the NPC as they used their Grenades and guess what...NO HAM COST & (worst of all) THEY DO NO DAMAGE TO THE NPC USER!!! Our grenades damage us if caught in the blast radius but they don't damage the NPC if the same thing happens to them????
I'm all about making things more fun and interesting, but let's be fair here...we've practically begged for fixes to our Grenades, and the Devs delivered...to NPC's and not to us yet...UGGGGHHH!!!!
Other then that...the other thing that bugged me (as I'm sure you will ALL agree)...NPC's have no delay for weapon switching...I witnessed the NPC's I was fighting go from pistol to axe to unarmed to pistol to axe repeatedly with no delays...sometimes with on 1 second inbetween each special...anyone can test this by running close to a Blood Razor, then as soon as they equip a Melee weapon, run quickly away and they'll IMMEDIATELY go back to their pistol with NO DELAY....
I thought the AI Enhancements were suppose to make them play more like a live player...but if this is the case, why do they get advantages we don't? Shouldn't they suffer the same penalties...
I'm sure it's more complicated then that...Nobody want's to see an NPC keep killing themselves because the AI choose the wrong weapons/grenades at the wrong time...or get stuck in a 5 Second Weapon Delay loop that makes them not attack...but come on...I feel like these NPC's are teasing us with issues we hold dear...if it's good enough for them...it's good enough for us!!!
Ok...rant done...got that out of my system...time to bring this up yet again in the Correspondent Forum!!!
What ticks me off (aside from learning that now), is that wehn you kill them, and then loot them; they're going to have crapy CDEF weapons or maybe 1 level above 
and they always suck
Syzygy-Gorath
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:18 am
#5
Ster wrote:
/applaud
I completely agree with you Garvin. If we suffer penalties then so should the NPCs. There is no reason for us to be so heavily affected by grenades and the weapon switching delay while the NPCs have no problems what-so-ever. This also shows that they could do a quick fix to grenades very easily since they have already implemented them to NPCs. So this begs the questions, why havent they done it for us? If the high HAM issue and damage to the user is so small and insignificant, then why don't they impose the same penalties to the NPCs?
That's not necesarilly true. A for-instance: it seems that NPCs will damage one another with AoE weapons/attacks and will get a TEF against their own faction. So, uh, not quite so simple as we might otherwise think. But it'd be great if grenades didn't shred us if we got too close…sure, it's realistic, but then again so would CMs being diseased/poisoned by their own weapons, and after several months of playing an MCM I never saw that happen (and yes, I threw from within my burst radius.)
Bennifer
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:32 am
#6
Dev- We fixed grenades, and weapon switching, yeah we just gave it to the NPCs, WHAT!!! thats not what the community wanted??!!?? Im shocked, we always listen to the class in need of fixing, like jedi, they are so weak we will dedicate 3 more major publishes to revamping them
Skeptic666
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:33 am
#7
LOL NPCS are Generated by SOE would you think they would give them all our nerfs?
I think not!
JeepJedi
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:48 am
#8
Give 'em hell Garvin!
From what I have heard, some of the NPCs are opening up a major can of whoopass on players. That's all well and good, but these "advantages" that they have that we have ... some of which we asked for, asked for smells of poodoo.
They really need to get on the stick here.
/agree
If an NPC is using grenades against you, wouldn't it stand to reason that you should be able to loot said grenades when you wax that NPC? Helps the whole loot thing along a bit.
garvin
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:54 am
#9
As for looting the grenades...looking that the damage stats, they are less then what we can buy from a WS (I saw an Imperial Detonator do 178 pts damage to me before armor absorption)...so looting them might be a waste...still, they should have the same effect on the NPC as they do us when using them...
Ajo79
Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:01 am
#10
Hehe, gotta love it. NPCs get a grenade fix before Commandos. Laughable. Hope you can make the devs wake up, garvin.
Yoda2397
Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:07 am
#11
Yes, this is irritating! I realized this last night, the NPC's don't have to wait 6-12 months for a combat revamp, but we do! Honestly, did anyone actually ask for this? Why on earth are the NPC's getting a revamp when Smugglers, CH, Commandos, etc. have been begging for a revamp for months?! I mean it's kind of nice to have a little variety with how NPC's fight, but good grief! There are bigger and more importantfish to fry! 
JeepJedi
Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:14 am
#12
I'd rather loot a crap grenade most of the time (with the hopes of getting a good one), than a CDEF most of the time.
But I see where you are coming from.
Daarek_Novabinder
Thu Jul 29, 2004 11:36 am
#13
I want a combat revamp as much as everyone else, but let me play devils advocate for a moment.
We've been whining, complaining, and petitioning for us to get a revamp. Other proffessions that feel like they have been shafted have also been asking for a revamp to their tree. SOE instead of fixing us, fix the NPCs and make their life easier.
First off it is my belief that this isn't a "Screw you" to the commando playerbase, but rather to make the game more enjoyable for everyone who plays. While four professions have gotten the shaft and continue to receive it, there are another twenty-eight that continue to enjoy themselves as if nothing is wrong. From a business and priority standpoint I'd rather please more customers then less, and in this case SWG really did need a morale boost.
Also, while you believe they diverted resources away from us, that may also not be true. Just because you work for a company like SOE doesn't mean you can do EVERYTHING on a dev team. Some guys do art, others do programming, some work on evets etc. The point I'm trying to make with this is that it probably never took away from our revamp because the guy that worked on this either did it in his own spare time, or he has nothing to do with player class balances.
Am I upset? Slightly. Jelous is more like it, but I do believe that our love is coming and I can't wait for the day.
We've been whining, complaining, and petitioning for us to get a revamp. Other proffessions that feel like they have been shafted have also been asking for a revamp to their tree. SOE instead of fixing us, fix the NPCs and make their life easier.
First off it is my belief that this isn't a "Screw you" to the commando playerbase, but rather to make the game more enjoyable for everyone who plays. While four professions have gotten the shaft and continue to receive it, there are another twenty-eight that continue to enjoy themselves as if nothing is wrong. From a business and priority standpoint I'd rather please more customers then less, and in this case SWG really did need a morale boost.
Also, while you believe they diverted resources away from us, that may also not be true. Just because you work for a company like SOE doesn't mean you can do EVERYTHING on a dev team. Some guys do art, others do programming, some work on evets etc. The point I'm trying to make with this is that it probably never took away from our revamp because the guy that worked on this either did it in his own spare time, or he has nothing to do with player class balances.
Am I upset? Slightly. Jelous is more like it, but I do believe that our love is coming and I can't wait for the day.
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