Commando Archive

Thread: Regarding Our Question for the 19 Answers 6/2/04 Posting...Final Review

garvin
Thu May 27, 2004 11:15 am
#1

A few weeks back we came up with the following question possibility to submit to TH:



As Commandos, we have heard that many of our issues will be covered within the Combat Balance, but beyond that we have no details on the specifics being addressed. With the acknowledgement that everything is subject to change, can we have specifics on how the CB will affect specifically our Profession and which of our issues (included those issues in our Top 5) will be addressed prior to the CB, during the CB, and post CB. Specifically we would like to know about the plans for non-functional lootable Heavy Weapon Skill Mods (effect skills not present in Commando Profession since Beta), Grenade Bugs (Damage and Incap the user as well as suggested status effects proposed), HAR issues.


The more I think about this question...the more I havea strong feeling we are going to get a "non-specific" combat balance related answer...OR...On the otherhand, it may be close enough to the CB going into testing that we may actually get a more useful response...it's a big gamble...


On that note...I was thinking we might consider a more "specific" question that get's more to the point to submit...something like:


Bomb Droids are configured not to damage the Bounty Hunter or Smuggler User when caught in it's blast radius and has no HAM cost. Many other area attacks in game do not damage the user when caught in the damage radius area, but they do typically include a HAM cost. Commando grenades on the otherhand will damage the user if caught in the blast radius and when combined witha very highHAM cost, often incapps the Commando user (that's why we call them suicide bombs). The Ideal range of our Grenades is also occasionally within the blast radious. Can our Grenades be configured along the same lines of not damaging the user if caught in the blast radius, and along the same lines, can we see the extremely high HAM costs lowered significantly to be on par with other similar ingame items?


Other improvement suggestions to take into consideration for our Grenades include adding Status effect possibilities(dizzy, stun, blind, kd, etc).


TH could end up giving us some answer like "Grenades will be addressed in the Combat Balance" or we could get lucky and the programmers could decide to make the fix sooner rather then later. At least we'd have one fix out of the many we need and we can move on to the next item to be fixed. We would also be able to further expand on the idea of fixing grenades and adding "status" effects while they are at it...I think with the new question we'd have less chances of getting a CB response then we would with the first.


Any Thoughts? I will be offically submitting the final version of our question on Monday or Tuesday of next week...

Message Edited by garvin on 05-27-2004 11:40 AM



Garvin Lansdowne
Retired Commando Correspondent - Current Blue Glowie
Master Commando / TKM || Architect / Shipwright / Master Droidsmith
ShadowStyrkeGuild.com: A WoW Guild Website

Ster
Thu May 27, 2004 11:31 am
#2
....come with a cost HAM. Typo here Garvin


The problem Garvin is that it seems like all of our questions are invariably about damage and or weapons. All of the weapons are getting a revamp, hence why they took the new vibros out of the game, which makes it easy for them to give us the combat balance answer.


Another problem with the first question is that you are essentially asking about 3 items:


1) Weapon Skill Mods

2) Grenade Bugs

3) HAR Issues


He could just take the easy way out and not answer any of them or go with the combat balance again. If he answers one, then the community will complain that he didnt answer the others.


The second question focuses on grenades, which is our second issue listed in the first question, which might imply that it is our greatest concern at this point. I dont think we should give the impression that grenades are our top priority, unless that is the communities opinion.


I might not understand how these question things work though. We sent him our top 5 issues, so I guess we pick one of those top 5 issues to ask about? At any rate I am sure whatever you do is fine. You have done very well for us in the past.



Ster Nemor... The last of the Mononokians
Master Commando
Master TKA
Pistoleer 0030
garvin
Thu May 27, 2004 11:52 am
#3

Thanks for pointing out the typo...I made the fix...


In regards to what we can ask...we can ask pretty much anything we want...heck, we could as TH's favorite color if we wanted...it's all up to us...


From looking at TH's responses, especially this weeks, I've noticed that the questions that are more narrowly focused seem to get a more direct response rather then questions surrounding the profession as a whole...


That's why I thought focusing on a specific issue rather then a more general one might work to our advantage...we could choose to slant the question towards any of our specific issues...HAR, reduced DoT, Rocket Launcher Changes, Broken Skill Mods, Master Box, etc...I speficially thought it might be a good time for Grenades because of the Bomb Drodis...I want to use their design as our building blocks...if they don't do damage to the user, neither should our Grenades....If they don't have a HAM cost, our Grenades should at least have a lowered one if not none at all...and so on...


I am not specifically targeting any of our Top 5 as being more important then the other because in an upcoming patch the Devs have set asside time to address every professions Top 5...that day is coming...the question is, what do we have the best chance at getting the Devs to fix in the mean time...What already has comparable items in game that we can use as a model for what we want (Programmers like comparable items rather then building from scratch)....


When it comes to the HAR and Rocket Launcher, I see these weapons needing Complete Revamps...When it comes to our Grenades I see them needing "tweaks"...It's my belief we have a better chance at this point (before the CB) at getting tweaks over revamps...


I'm pretty much 99.9% sure we shouldn't bother asking about getting "new" items prior to the CB as the Devs have made it pretty obvious that they don't want to add anything new to our profession prior to the CB...that's why I thought we'd use Grenades...they aren't new...they are comparably broken when looking at other ingame items...and thus, any changes would be considered "fixes"...





Garvin Lansdowne
Retired Commando Correspondent - Current Blue Glowie
Master Commando / TKM || Architect / Shipwright / Master Droidsmith
ShadowStyrkeGuild.com: A WoW Guild Website

Pure_Fusion
Thu May 27, 2004 11:54 am
#4
How about extending the grenade issue with area of effect including the user, to ask about the area of effects of the other heavy weapons (rocket launcher, particle beam cannon). These are either non-functional or extremely limited, and it would be nice to see them fixed/increased. Would be great to actually hit a group of something with the rocket launcher, it does have grenades in it after all.



____________
Neglexis Dalton, Farstar - Master Commando
Neglexis Dalton, Lowca - Master Commando (retired)
Neglexis Dalton, Test Center - Master Commando
Raptor2k1
Thu May 27, 2004 3:12 pm
#5
Either one works for me, though I'd like to hear what they have to say on grenades a bit.



Kyeran Halkyon

Master Gunfighter and Demolitionist of the Old Republic Navy
SWG Commando Forum


garvin
Fri May 28, 2004 12:09 am
#6




Pure_Fusion wrote:
How about extending the grenade issue with area of effect including the user, to ask about the area of effects of the other heavy weapons (rocket launcher, particle beam cannon). These are either non-functional or extremely limited, and it would be nice to see them fixed/increased. Would be great to actually hit a group of something with the rocket launcher, it does have grenades in it after all.



I thought about that, but that might lead to the same problem other professions are having with their questions...they try and focus on too much in their question which seems to make TH respond to all of them with one answer instead of each issue seperately...


If we prepose a change to fix our Grenades, Rocket Launch and other Heavy Weapons we may end up with an answer that roughly translates into "That is a lot of changes, we'll have to take them all into consideration..." They might feellike it's an "all or nothing" sort of request...


But...maybe if we focus on one specific issue, our Grenades, we stand a better change of them saying "Well, if that one change will make you happy for now, we'll see what we can do"...then when we get that, we move on to the Rocket Launcher next, then the other Heavy Weapons, and so on...we move issue to issue instead of trying for them all at once...


So do folks want me to go with the original question, the new question, or something completely different? It was awhile ago that we came up with the original question and some ideas may have changed...





Garvin Lansdowne
Retired Commando Correspondent - Current Blue Glowie
Master Commando / TKM || Architect / Shipwright / Master Droidsmith
ShadowStyrkeGuild.com: A WoW Guild Website

Hellshot
Fri May 28, 2004 12:29 am
#7
What I think might be best to do is for garvin to run the grenade question past TH real quickly this week. If he says that it will likely get a combat balance question, I would suggest that we ask about if and when heavy weapons skill tapes will be removed and if they will be replaced with skill tapes for existing commando skill mods (e.g. ft speed/accuracy). Also, if grenade experimentation tapes will be removed from the drop table.



Ancient weapons and hokey religions are no match for a rocket launcher in your backpack.

Lowca- Col Hoopo Gringo 0/0/2/0 Commando, 0/0/0/2 Fencer
Test Center - Ahab Crestingrunner Master Commando and stuff

First player to wear Mandalorian armor
Noitcopa
Fri May 28, 2004 12:36 am
#8
Just a thought, but you may have hit on something there. Both the questions can be answered with a CB. Soooo.... why not ask them to give us an idea of what is being coverd. For example, take our top 5 and ask them, "which of these 1,2,3,4,5 is being addressed in the CB, which will be hit before, which will come after?" Those CANNOT be given a "see CB" response. Not that I expect an answer anyway, notice we were left our of the 5/26 draft? Nice. Anyway, just an idea.




"It is in self-limitation that a master first shows himself." - Johann von Geothe
Gamble
Fri May 28, 2004 12:44 am
#9


I would suggest a slight addition to the second question:


"We would like to see this handled before the CB but if it falls to the rebalance, how do you see it working in the CB."


Something like that would give a more, specifics required instead of a 'we'll get to it with everything else' type of answer, at least in my mind. Overall though I like the second question as I feel it's more likely to be answered than the first.



000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
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000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000-------\\\\\ Pirate Lords
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Ster
Fri May 28, 2004 12:50 am
#10




garvin wrote:

From looking at TH's responses, especially this weeks, I've noticed that the questions that are more narrowly focused seem to get a more direct response rather then questions surrounding the profession as a whole...


That's why I thought focusing on a specific issue rather then a more general one might work to our advantage...we could choose to slant the question towards any of our specific issues...HAR, reduced DoT, Rocket Launcher Changes, Broken Skill Mods, Master Box, etc...I speficially thought it might be a good time for Grenades because of the Bomb Drodis...I want to use their design as our building blocks...if they don't do damage to the user, neither should our Grenades....If they don't have a HAM cost, our Grenades should at least have a lowered one if not none at all...and so on...






Yeah your probably right on that one. I say stick with the grenade question then with whatever revisions you pull from the board.




garvin wrote:

Thanks for pointing out the typo...I made the fix...





No problem.




Ster Nemor... The last of the Mononokians
Master Commando
Master TKA
Pistoleer 0030
LuapLink
Fri May 28, 2004 3:21 am
#11
Not sure which question to go for but if you go with the skill mods one you should point out that when they revamped the Jabba Themepark they strangely added the useless 'Demolitionists belt' that has mods for Grenade experimentation and assembly.



Orba Bunsen - Master Snuggler/Pistoleer(Test Center)
Oorba - Master Fencer/Brawler/Swordswookiee(Test Center)
Abor Ava - Master Commando(Test Center)
kenrw24
Fri May 28, 2004 5:24 pm
#12
Go with your best hunch Garvin, you deal with TH more than we do. I'm sure you know far better than I what would most likely get some actual information from him. Info, new info is what I truly crave!
LordVisivius
Sat May 29, 2004 5:01 am
#13
Garvin,


I say we go with the grenade question.Like you suggested, we're more likely to get a fix and/or a decent response other than CB rebalance on this question than the other. I think we do need to focus on a specific item rather than a "here's everything that's broken, when are you going to fix it all?". Grenades would be a minor tweak that may get fixed soon rather than 6 months from now with a revamp. Go for it Garvin.



Visivius Alca'Vacho

Master Doctor
Master Swordsman
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