Commando Archive
Thread: Commandos: All factors taken into account, here are your overall DoT changes.
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DarthTaosin
Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:26 pm
#1
In light of new experimental data I have removed this post.
I will compile another one tommorow.
Summary: It's not as bad as it looks. It's still bad, but not horrible.
Tao
Message Edited by DarthTaosin on 02-12-2004 02:01 AM
DarthTaosin
Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:31 pm
#2
Oh, and these numbers are for dabblers, 0-0-4-0 Commandos.
For a master commando the difference is 500%.
Tao
Twentytolife
Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:32 pm
#3
Summary of the above.
You were much better off yesterday as a commando than today 
DarthTaosin
Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:33 pm
#4
All I ask is, why such a huge change?
Balance is not wrought with grand sweeping changes such as this, but rather with incremental changes of smaller degree.
Yet, we see grand sweeping changes in the name of balance.
I chalk it up to poor management.
Tao
Aidn
Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:38 pm
#5
Very nice post, thanks for the information. My main concern is not PvE, but PvP. When I am fighting a rifleman or a TKM that is in very high end composite armor, I now will stand no chance. I hope that in the next publish, we get at least one other working weapon (E-Web?) to counteract this nerf. I know thatsome people will say that the increased damage makes up for the DoT changes, but thanks to resistences it does not in many cases. I hope that TH and the DEVs will try and work on revamping the Commando next publish along with all the other changes,as we badly need it.
DarthTaosin
Wed Feb 11, 2004 9:40 pm
#6
You are welcome Aidn.
Earlier I was very, very angry. I am still angry, but I think if I take a break from SWG for a while and come back for publish 7 I will be able to play this game at least until WoW comes out or I get to betatest it. If WoW isn't all that good, then it's back to SWG for me. But that's a big if.
And I am not implying that commando's are the only fun class to play in SWG, I am simply implying that the methods by which the dev team has gone about these changes are less than ideal, and in some cases, simply wrong.
Tao
DarthTaosin
Wed Feb 11, 2004 11:31 pm
#7
I want to add one more thing.
I do agree that commando DoT damage pre-nerf was too high.
In that light, I agree with the idea of a nerf.
I do not agree with this 500% DoT nerf to Master Commandos.
It is indicative of:
- A probable degree of ignorance regarding previous changes, I.E. "Why were they made this strong to begin with if it wasn't as intended?"
- A possible lack of knowledge by the dev team of true damage output potentials in their game.
- A possible lack ofcaring what players will feel from the changes the dev team makes.
- A possible lack of understanding what makes a game fun.
There are other things, but I wanted to address those ones mainly,
Tao
P.S. I added some more as they came to me.
Message Edited by DarthTaosin on 02-12-2004 01:16 AM
cajundeef
Thu Feb 12, 2004 12:48 am
#8
This really really bites. I spent ALOT of time getting to commando and have only been master commando for about 2 weeks now and have been working on TKM to agument it, now i have to rely on TKM to get a reliable DoT and effectiveness? Just great. Thanks Devs. I held back any laments and whinning about nerfing Commandos as i had hope that they wouldnt do something stupid and here it is. So much for being able to help out my guildmates and other friends when they want to PvP or do such. Might as well become a pikeman, i could hurt the air around me more than missing or getting a *edit* DoT.
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DarthTaosin
Thu Feb 12, 2004 2:27 am
#9
If anyone has achieved experimental results higher than what I have posted for today's experiments then please add them here, it will aideveryone's understanding of the true changes.
It may be a bit early to simply claim that the 375%-500% decrease is concrete for solo players. It depends on many factors, which I tried to address.
But......... There is another factor which I did not address.
The armor hole bug... I call the armor hole bug a bug, because that's what I think it SHOULD be called, but in fact I remember reading that it was working as intended. It is when you hit something through all armor and do full damage, and I believe it is still out there.
Before this patch, when using the FT, if you hit the enemy and the armor hole bug was in effect your applied DoT would be exactly that of your combat log damage.
If you don't already see what I mean, here it is, laid out like a blueprint: If you knock down an enemy now, and hit it for max damage of 20,000, while at the same time getting the armor hole, and if the DoT still applied as such, you would effectively have a 20k DoT, or, the same as before.
Hence, these corellations mystify me, and I must do more experiments to find out the true nature of the changes here. This could all add up to something, but I cannot yet determine what. This is why I want you all to please record your info here if it is of worth to this cause, and all info concerning Commando DoT is,
Tao
Message Edited by DarthTaosin on 02-12-2004 01:27 AM
CyberData4
Thu Feb 12, 2004 2:40 am
#10
Don't forget to mention that we do more damage with our flamethrower now. If I have to take that in exchange for the DOT changes then I take this. Yes it sucks that we can't stack 4 dots, but a saavy player will learn how to adapt. I'm doing some pretty decent damage with my speed sliced flamethrower.
So basically the damage we do with our dot has been taken from our dot and shifted to the actual damage when we fire flamesingle.
I'll take it
Our real concerns should be getting them to fix the heavy acid rifle, grenades, and adding a line for the launcher pistol.
ArkanIrami
Thu Feb 12, 2004 3:33 am
#11
For all those that say we are still functional in PvsE:
3.0 speed flamethrower, approx 400-800 damage versus Giant Kimogila with 80% heat resist and medium armor? (ill check the armor rating tomorrow).
Flamesingle2 did around 500 damage every 7.5 seconds.
DoT ticked for 50 points.
Normal attack did 50 points of damage every 3 seconds.
I was in a group with a guy that's halfway through bounty hunter, he was doing more damage each normal attack with his light lightning cannon at 64 metres thanI was doing with my special at 16 metres.
The funny thing is he asked me to come down because "a commando would really give us the edge." lol. When fire extinguishers come out in a week or so, I predict that they'll lay in vendors unsold for months; what's the point of swatting a mosquito if you can just wait for it to drink its drop of blood and leave?
ArkanIrami
Thu Feb 12, 2004 4:09 am
#12
I've also field tested the incredible initial damage boost we get now. A mob with 15% heat resist and light armor nullifies the damage boost. At that point the DoT is worthless too, ticks for less than 300 damage. A mob with light armor and 15% heat resist is not a high level mob; It's barely even a mid level mob.
This is not a balance. This is not a DoT damage to initial damage swap. This is a nerf, and a fairly brutal one at that. Our DPS starts to take a hit at mobs that con blue, and that hit increases exponentially as the mob level does. A novice elite preofession with a set of bazaar mabari armorweave on now takes less DPS from our flamethrower, our only worthwhile weaponthan before patch; masters of elite professions with good comp (70-80% heat resist)and buffs will not feel us at all. The damage they take from a master commando will be neglible, will not even be worth using a stim to heal.
If anyone has a combat log for a master commando versus other elite profession, please post it here, I'm very interested in what the raw figures are now.
CyberData4
Thu Feb 12, 2004 11:42 am
#13
A mob with light armor and 15% heat resist is not a high level mob; It's barely even a mid level mob.
If our heavy acid rifle worked properly we could use that on heat resist mobs and be good to go. The problem is not the current state of the flamethrower, the problem is commandos dont have other weapons to fall back on.
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