Commando Archive
Thread: February ends and still no Beta
Knightcrest wrote:
In relation to the subscription comments. I as well as Aeuralis have noticed a drop in population.... well it seems that way. While reading through the rest of the posts a couple more things came to mind.
1) How many of these new subsriptions stick around when there are no medics healing in med centers... just healing tumblers and ignoring the new players confused by the system? People that have experience can grind professions in a day. How many new players will have someone to partner up with in a game that has skill progression at such an insane rate. Novices and Mid levels have a hard time in many aspects due to the master vs. novice ratio. I am willing to be that a good many of these new subscriptions won't stick around because of the way atmosphere and the extreme "grind till you drop" mentality that the game system's current state promotes above all. Not many group with them and take the time to help.
Can't go into details (NDA), but this will change big time...On my server I never have problems finding someone to heal my wounds or BF.
2) I get sick of these "masters" that don't know a damn thing about their profession because they skipped past those boxes. How many CM's took the time to learn what warning shot from marksman on their route to 600+ tickpoisons did? Or did they just train ranged support I-IV all at once because they had combat xp banked? There is less longevity to play time as I mentioned above, there is no real awe to being a master at something because it is so quickly attained. I remeber the first time I threw up my master commando tag and it was an achievement back then. People felt value to seeing that tag, now you see it everywhere.
It's already been stated that beginner professions will play a MUCH bigger role in the post-CU game play and that Master Boxes should be much more rewarding...people will actually WANT to be a Master of a profession AND will utilize what they get from their pre-reqs. Our pre-reqs will make MUCH MORE sense post-CU. I doubt we'll even hear "we cost more pts, so we should be at least this much better" if things go the way I hope. Balance will be the key.
3) Coronet seems way down from normal on any server I have toons on... well a good percent of the population is now spread out a ton. Some are in space for JtL, even more are out throwing grenades at quenkers/baz nitches, and anyone stop to think how many (seeing as many phases as the village has gone through) are out having to stay ungrouped and alone because they are waving glowsticks at critters? Why go to C'net for buffs? There are 20 scattered around in player cities doing the buff bot thing in Medical Center cities, afk, and just having to pay a minimal fee at the door. Many have quit I assure you, these new subscriptions may be rising but that is the effects of the holidays which came to an end and a lot were slowly trickling out their Christmas money. How many of these new subscriptions are continuing to log in on a daily basis?
As I said previously, I only heard past statistics...haven't heard anything recently, but new forum users seem to appear all the time...I actually know a few newer players and talk to them frequently...until they visited the forums, they never noticed any of the problems we often bring up. On the servers they play, they don't see a drop in the population because they are use to the level they started with.
4) There is a serious lack of info coming out. Frankly, the new weapons info was cool to look at (even if it was 1000 places in the forums already under the heading .tre pics etc), but spreading it out 2 in 3 weeks? Umm no thanks, they were pictures of no relevance as it does not give any information about the CURB. New weapons are expected, we need to hear some of the unexpected to keep interests peaked. The armor FF was a good example. Good info on top of pics. The two weapons FF's should have been one and were a stall tactic. Where is the announcement that Tyrant taunted a smuggler with and has yet to be delivered? What is the deal with some of the changes being popped out (even if most are good) with no discussion or warning? Where are these quick fixes for proffesions that were to be coming out before the CURB?
In between those few weeks there have been posts from TH and Tyrant that have been CU related...Tyrant has actually been much better lately about getting word out regarding the CU...we've also started seeing some of the CU docs go public...Weapons and Armor aren't the only things we've heard about. Before the Armor doc we heard about the HAM changes and some other overall CU changes coming...Communication picked up in January and February especially.
5) I noticed a bug on my friends list last night, I now haveseveral that I can not delete after they quit because that "name does not exist" since they deleted their toons before quitting. My friends list is down from 84 or so to 13 left. Very sad... guild from 14 to 3 active. Tell me subsriptions are on the increase, I will believe it. Listen when I tell you though that those subscriptions are not hanging around long... and more veterans are leaving daily due to the lack of communication. I do realize sometimes some posters flame them and forget they are people as well behind the forum nicks... it is inappropriate and wrong. It is also inappropriate to continually ignore the need for information for their communtiy veterans to have hope and new information to keep their interest peaked. Excited players are much more likely to be more positive about their favorite game rather than a simply content player on standby always having a shadow looming wondering when a trickle of information will come.
A lot of my friends have left as well and my guild shut down (use to be 30+)...I've made a lot of new friends (people tend to seek you out when you are the Correspondent), but still I miss my old buddies. But of those friends, the one's I still chat with outside the game, MOST of them are planning on coming back when the CU goes live. Most went to play other MMO's but are seeing that many of the things that made them most upset at SWG are small compared to the other issues that other newerMMO's are facing. People come, people go...I personally expect a huge return rate when the CU goes live (I'm also thinking that SOE will likely market to those that left). I just wish we'd could speed things up to get the CU live so they'd have a reason to return. Some of the information that has gotten out has already helped...how many "I've returned" posts have we seen recently in various forums...I've definitely seen a rise...
If they are changing "everything", can we now expect grenades to work properly with the CU instead of post-CU? No more 9 second throws, missing frequently, killing ourselves and applying no state to the target?
Will they do ANYTHING in the "waiting for CU time" to make Commando more competent and productive?
We've asked, and the answer is "No." So they can't fix any broken commando thing, but they can change crafter critical fails that were not even a requested item. Strange their logic is.
Latenighter wrote:
How long is a bit?
If they are changing "everything", can we now expect grenades to work properly with the CU instead of post-CU? No more 9 second throws, missing frequently, killing ourselves and applying no state to the target?
Will they do ANYTHING in the "waiting for CU time" to make Commando more competent and productive?
We've asked, and the answer is "No." So they can't fix any broken commando thing, but they can change crafter critical fails that were not even a requested item. Strange their logic is.
((looks over shoulder to see if TH is waiting with his NDA sniper rifle))
Ok...here is what I know about Grenades...Back in August when I was at the summit, I cornered Blixtev and asked him what he thought of our Grenades...he stated, and I quote "Commando Grenades Suck!" Right there I knew I liked the guy...So I asked him if we'd see any Grenade changes (wasn't planned at the time) make it into the CU...he said that he'd work to get at least 2 of our grenade issues into the CU if time permitsand if it doesn't go against any other CU changes (stacking levels and the fact that our grenades damage the user)...He couldn't say if these changes would definitely make it in, but promised me to try...
Later, after we started seeing the docs get posted online, I noticed no mention of any Grenade changes...I asked Blixtev what the deal was...He told me that certain grenade changes WERE being included into the CU and specifically he remembered our chat (wink wink)....He said more, but I'd definitely be violating the NDA toreveal what I was told.
Then recently grenades were brought up again in a CU forum thread...Apparently, and we don't have details yet, more focus has been put on our Grenades and we should apparently be "very happy about the changes"...More info is supposedly coming soon and I hope to learn what that means, but it may end up something we find out about when training starts.
So you can consider Grenades another aspect being "addressed" by the CU ((looks over shoulder again))....
As for our other changes coming...I for one was more then surprised by some of the Commando changes coming...and just when I thought all the Commando surprises were revealed to us in the CU forums...they blew me away just last week with yet another that I'm still in shock over...I have been dying to spill the beans over this revealation more then any other before, but have been forced to bite my tongue like all the rest of the testers and our fearless Correspondent. I've wanted to even drop a hint, but there isn't really a way to do so without being to obvious. I will say this though, the world of Commando possibilities just become MUCH MORE interesting...
Message Edited by garvin on 03-01-2005 11:33 AM
[ PHO | Kauri ]
garvin wrote:
((looks over shoulder to see if TH is waiting with his NDA sniper rifle))
Ok...here is what I know about Grenades...Back in August when I was at the summit, I cornered Blixtev and asked him what he thought of our Grenades...he stated, and I quote "Commando Grenades Suck!" Right there I knew I liked the guy...So I asked him if we'd see any Grenade changes (wasn't planned at the time) make it into the CU...he said that he'd work to get at least 2 of our grenade issues into the CU if time permits and if it doesn't go against any other CU changes (stacking levels and the fact that our grenades damage the user)...He couldn't say if these changes would definitely make it in, but promised me to try...
Later, after we started seeing the docs get posted online, I noticed no mention of any Grenade changes...I asked Blixtev what the deal was...He told me that certain grenade changes WERE being included into the CU and specifically he remembered our chat (wink wink)....He said more, but I'd definitely be violating the NDA to reveal what I was told.
Then recently grenades were brought up again in a CU forum thread...Apparently, and we don't have details yet, more focus has been put on our Grenades and we should apparently be "very happy about the changes"...More info is supposedly coming soon and I hope to learn what that means, but it may end up something we find out about when training starts.
So you can consider Grenades another aspect being "addressed" by the CU ((looks over shoulder again))....
As for our other changes coming...I for one was more then surprised by some of the Commando changes coming...and just when I thought all the Commando surprises were revealed to us in the CU forums...they blew me away just last week with yet another that I'm still in shock over...I have been dying to spill the beans over this revealation more then any other before, but have been forced to bite my tongue like all the rest of the testers and our fearless Correspondent. I've wanted to even drop a hint, but there isn't really a way to do so without being to obvious. I will say this though, the world of Commando possibilities just become MUCH MORE interesting...
Message Edited by garvin on 03-01-2005 11:33 AM
Thanks Garvin.
You are one who we can always count on to "commit" news. You tied in my concern on grenades nicely, because the issue of the 'nades not being fixed properly was "time." Well, with all the delays, there has sure been enough "time" to get it fixed right. So that is promising.
On the item that puts, you into "shock", why is Ryubushi's Electron Cannon Mega-tank so hard to comment on? We KNOW the Dev's had that idea first, because all good ideas are the Dev's ideas, and that is what the "secret project team" has been slaving away on.
All I can say is it's time to let some of the broad brushstrokes be seen. You'll make yourself sick holding in all those hints!
garvin wrote:
garvin wrote:
aeuralis wrote:
cybersword26 wrote:
I find aeuralis statements very distrubing. Garvin and now starnick praising SOE no matter how long delays are that all of it will be worth it. Now to hear the utter disappointment by the newest sandbox tester saying that there is little communation and the devs are not listening to the testers. If the devs knew what was best for the game then why do we even need a CU, its was there design wasn't it. Looks like we are going from one broken system to another.
Let me qualify my statements for a moment. I don't know that they arn't listening to us, they just aren't posting responces to our questions. As for your last statement, I don't think the the CURB when it gets released will be a broken system. I ,at the moment, I have some very big questions about it. Questions that i don't have reasonable answers to.
I have to disagree here...the Devs ARE responding to our questions...Blixtev recently responded to 2 of my biggest issues over in the CU forum (he even dropped hints on interesting Commando changes I never even expected)...The Devs have been very forthcoming with responses to many Sandbox questions...more so then I've ever seen them do publically...We've had direct responses from the actual programmers responsible for the CU. There doesn't seem to be a day that doesn't go by that some CU programmer is responding multiple times to various Sandbox tester questions/concerns. There was a period around the holidays that communication slowed down, but recently we in the CU forums found out why (which is what I think might be addressed in a public dev post that MIGHT come this week...again...MIGHT be posted...my guess is that it would be on Thursday or Friday since that seems to be their typical announcement days for an announcement of this type). Being new to the Sandbox you may not have noticed a lot of the past interaction, but you should be able to see that Blixtev alone has been very forthcoming. We have, in the past, tried to avoid getting to much programmer responses as we don't want to pull them away from actually doing programming on the CU, but occasionally folks like Blixtev pops in to answer a few questions...more so then he probably should. That combined with the Dev/Programmer interaction via the Correspondent forum (which unfortunately you can't see) shows a huge increase in SOE/Player interaction.
Now that is not to say that i will not have answers to them soon. Do you watch the DEV TRACKER? If you do you will notice that there are alot of DEV posts that you cannot see in the last week. I cannot see them either, they have been posting in the correspondents forum alot. My hope is that by the end of the week they will get around to answering the concernsthat the communityhas. But that may not happen. One thing is certain that the CURB will work. The question is it a system that we can live with?
PS: My concerns are not about commando because i have not seen the new plan for commando but i should soon.
Just to add to this...last week there were over 30 Dev/Programmer responses (not posts, but actual responses)to our questions/concerns (all the testers) in the CU forums...And that's not including posts by TH or Tiggs. How often do we see that type of interaction in the public forums (something I definitely wish there was more of). So SOE interaction is there. There were much more then 30 posts made by the devs in the Correspondent forum on top of that). Of those posts, there were several that were Commando specific in response to my concerns/questions and some of the concerns of others.
The Concerns that I speak of aren't because of what we know...it has some to do with what we don't know because we need to wait to see how it works when testing starts...My concerns have mostly to do with being impatient to gain understanding on a few things while waiting for testing to officially start. Blixtev more then responded to my concerns in a way that made me feel more comforable in waiting a bit longer...
See my responce in the commmandodisscussion post. I think if i posted it here it would break the NDA.
Calling in orbital bombardment?
Skill to use all ranged weapons proficiently?
Radar invisibility?
Howitzers?
Foxholes?
Underslung Carbine?
This list can go on and on and on and on and on.
But you get the picture.
garvin wrote:I also call it the CU (when I'm not refering to it as CUFKATCRFKATCB....I've never referred to it as "CURB"...that started over in the CU forum by one of the Correspondents I think...personally, to be honest, I don't think CURB does the Combat Upgrade justice...it kinda feels like it's being trivalized...to me, the CU is actually more of a game re-write even more then an Ugrade....As someone put it earlier...it's almost like we are seeing SWG 2.0...
CURB = Combat-Upgrade-Revamp-Balance. Nothing intended to be derogatory in that.
But, OUCH! So now the CU is going to be the "Combat Rewrite"? The big announcement is a NAME CHANGE!!!!!!!! [runs screaming for the door]
QFE
Latenighter wrote:
CURB = Combat-Upgrade-Revamp-Balance. Nothing intended to be derogatory in that.
Latenighter wrote:
garvin wrote:
I also call it the CU (when I'm not refering to it as CUFKATCRFKATCB....I've never referred to it as "CURB"...that started over in the CU forum by one of the Correspondents I think...personally, to be honest, I don't think CURB does the Combat Upgrade justice...it kinda feels like it's being trivalized...to me, the CU is actually more of a game re-write even more then an Ugrade....As someone put it earlier...it's almost like we are seeing SWG 2.0...
CURB = Combat-Upgrade-Revamp-Balance. Nothing intended to be derogatory in that.
But, OUCH! So now the CU is going to be the "Combat Rewrite"? The big announcement is a NAME CHANGE!!!!!!!! [runs screaming for the door]
Nothing derogatory about it at all...It's just not a Revamp or Balance any more...the Revamp AND Balance are just part of the tons of things going on in the Combat Upgrade...so to say Combat-Upgrade-Revamp-Balance doesn't, at least to me, convey the full scope of what's coming...There is nothing wrong with saying CURB, I've just never preferred it....I make a lot of jokes and tend to rant on many an occasion, but I'm also completely amazed by the sheer scope of the CU...
As for renaming it yet again...you never know...as I said, I'm surprised they aren't just calling it SWG 2.0...that's pretty much what it is...nothing will be the same (and I pretty much mean everything is changing)...
garvin wrote:As for renaming it yet again...you never know...as I said, I'm surprised they aren't just calling it SWG 2.0...that's pretty much what it is...nothing will be the same (and I pretty much mean everything is changing)...
Even non-combat professions?
Based on some of the crafting changes being discussed on the Dev Tracker, SOETyrant's comment to the smuggler's, and the glancing comments of the Alpha team, that could the "reason" for the delay. Just sifting the tea leaves.
Message Edited by Latenighter on 03-01-2005 04:42 PM
Latenighter wrote:
garvin wrote:
As for renaming it yet again...you never know...as I said, I'm surprised they aren't just calling it SWG 2.0...that's pretty much what it is...nothing will be the same (and I pretty much mean everything is changing)...
Even non-combat professions?
The combat changes effect non-combat professions both indirectly...and directly
now when you say that...what does Force Sensitive come under? neither? or one of them
garvin wrote:
Latenighter wrote:
garvin wrote:
As for renaming it yet again...you never know...as I said, I'm surprised they aren't just calling it SWG 2.0...that's pretty much what it is...nothing will be the same (and I pretty much mean everything is changing)...
Even non-combat professions?
The combat changes effect non-combat professions both indirectly...and directly