Commando Archive
Thread: Every age has its wars, and every war has its legends.
And since I can't edit......the fact that we have nothing still to show for our unarmed IV pre-req is why some people regard commando as also a spec ops soldier, because we could use some nifty knives....but wouldn't be able to use them effectively without more skills in said areas. Besides, what would stop the devs from turning the camo kit into a specials that had mods on it, much like conceal? Then give commando a Novice Ranger bonus to camo, and would you say it was unbalancing? The novice skills are horrible, like comparing headhot to advanced headshot...no comparison. But since you rangers are broken and also are being considered for merging, how about this to satisfy you....
Hand-to-Hand Combat: Basic Techniques--> Leg Immobilization-->Vital Organs--> Counter Techniques--> Spec. Ops Soldier
This would give the user a knife that would have a natural weak bleed DoT, and the specials that would come with it would focus on snares, roots, and bleeds. Also, a stance that would come with it would allow the user to increase their movement spd by 200% and add +400 to defense. It would have a 4 second timer on it to use, then a 20 minute cooldown timer.
So does this satisfy you? I respond better to options than out-right disagreeing.
Tyreal18 wrote:
. Besides, what would stop the devs from turning the camo kit into a specials that had mods on it, much like conceal? Then give commando a Novice Ranger bonus to camo, and would you say it was unbalancing? The novice skills are horrible, like comparing headhot to advanced headshot...no comparison. But since you rangers are broken and also are being considered for merging, how about this to satisfy you....
It's not just about being "broken". You've yet to provide a logical argument for WHY commando's need or should have stealth. Do you think everyone should be able to use the plasma flame-thrower? No? Well that's how I feel about everyone having stealth. The fact that camo kits were given to everyone pissed Rangers off, so why would we want anything else like that? Regardless of whether they'd be effective with the flamethrower, that's something that you consider yours. TN and stealth are things we consider ours.
Secondly, we're not being "considered" for merging. One comment from a developer was blown out of proportion. Tiggs directly spoke to a member of our community and said we weren't getting merged. So there's no need to propegate the rumor of merger that's based on the fact that one developer didn't out and out dismiss the idea. although much, much dumber ideas were also suggested and not shot down, so that doesn't prove anything.
Hand-to-Hand Combat: Basic Techniques--> Leg Immobilization-->Vital Organs--> Counter Techniques--> Spec. Ops Soldier
This would give the user a knife that would have a natural weak bleed DoT, and the specials that would come with it would focus on snares, roots, and bleeds. Also, a stance that would come with it would allow the user to increase their movement spd by 200% and add +400 to defense. It would have a 4 second timer on it to use, then a 20 minute cooldown timer.
+400 is a bit much again. BHs have the defensive stances in their lines, and it doesn't make sense to have two profession overlap so much . and +200% movement speed? again, I can't see this as being balanced with other professions.
now the knife idea is interesting. i could see that being cool, but I'd be worried about reaction from the fencer communties (focus on bleeds). snares and roots aren't as effective in melee fights, so I'm not sure how usefull that would be.
But here's an idea-- a special with the knife that would completely disable the target's armor for a brief period, as well as a short-term, but powerful snare as well. That way, you snare them, break their armor, and back up for a powerful attack witha flame thrower.
again, I'm simply trying to look out for the rest of the game, as most of the suggestions are based around "what you want" rather than what is reasonably close to what your professions is about.
i'm sorry if you respond better to options, but I can't see a way to balance what you want with the rest of the professions. bleeds are a fencer skill (and also a BH skill). defensive bonus specials are also in BH as well as in melee profs (CoB). It just seems like you're asking for skills that other professions have. I don't think it reasonable for you to have that without other professions having access to what's unique to your profession as well. fair's fair.
Phenix1050 wrote:
Tyreal18 wrote:
. Besides, what would stop the devs from turning the camo kit into a specials that had mods on it, much like conceal? Then give commando a Novice Ranger bonus to camo, and would you say it was unbalancing? The novice skills are horrible, like comparing headhot to advanced headshot...no comparison. But since you rangers are broken and also are being considered for merging, how about this to satisfy you....
It's not just about being "broken". You've yet to provide a logical argument for WHY commando's need or should have stealth. Do you think everyone should be able to use the plasma flame-thrower? No? Well that's how I feel about everyone having stealth. The fact that camo kits were given to everyone pissed Rangers off, so why would we want anything else like that? Regardless of whether they'd be effective with the flamethrower, that's something that you consider yours. TN and stealth are things we consider ours.
Secondly, we're not being "considered" for merging. One comment from a developer was blown out of proportion. Tiggs directly spoke to a member of our community and said we weren't getting merged. So there's no need to propegate the rumor of merger that's based on the fact that one developer didn't out and out dismiss the idea. although much, much dumber ideas were also suggested and not shot down, so that doesn't prove anything.
Hand-to-Hand Combat: Basic Techniques--> Leg Immobilization-->Vital Organs--> Counter Techniques--> Spec. Ops Soldier
This would give the user a knife that would have a natural weak bleed DoT, and the specials that would come with it would focus on snares, roots, and bleeds. Also, a stance that would come with it would allow the user to increase their movement spd by 200% and add +400 to defense. It would have a 4 second timer on it to use, then a 20 minute cooldown timer.
+400 is a bit much again. BHs have the defensive stances in their lines, and it doesn't make sense to have two profession overlap so much . and +200% movement speed? again, I can't see this as being balanced with other professions.
now the knife idea is interesting. i could see that being cool, but I'd be worried about reaction from the fencer communties (focus on bleeds). snares and roots aren't as effective in melee fights, so I'm not sure how usefull that would be.
But here's an idea-- a special with the knife that would completely disable the target's armor for a brief period, as well as a short-term, but powerful snare as well. That way, you snare them, break their armor, and back up for a powerful attack witha flame thrower.
again, I'm simply trying to look out for the rest of the game, as most of the suggestions are based around "what you want" rather than what is reasonably close to what your professions is about.
i'm sorry if you respond better to options, but I can't see a way to balance what you want with the rest of the professions. bleeds are a fencer skill (and also a BH skill). defensive bonus specials are also in BH as well as in melee profs (CoB). It just seems like you're asking for skills that other professions have. I don't think it reasonable for you to have that without other professions having access to what's unique to your profession as well. fair's fair.
Beides Phenix's argument, none of those ideas make commando unique, If we getall those other skills, from other proffessions, where is the uniqueness in commando? It fails to make commando's iconic.
Instead off defensive states, like COB and duelest stance? what about offensive stances? I am pretty sure I saw Starnick mention this somewhere, and doubly sure he raped it from someone else. 
Okay then, in the hopes to come up with ideas for commando while still retaining its "role," let's go ahead and define the class roles:
Rifleman: Long-range damage dealer
Swordsman: Close-range damage dealer
Carbineers: Area Damage and Suppression
Pikeman: Area Damage and Support
Pistoleers: Single States
Fencer: Close-range Area and DoTs
Smugglers: Single Target Mezzing
Bounty Hunter: Tanking, Single Target Damage
Teras Kasi: Tanking, Single Target Damage
Ranger: Hunting, Stealth (should be better)
Squad Leader: Group Support
Combat Medic: Group Healing, DoTs
Commando: Armor Disabling, Area Damage/Area States, Vehicle Destruction (in progress)
Okay, so to not step in anyone's shoes, we'd have to go along the way of disabling armor to really shine in damage dealing, or add in a certain offensive special that has been knocked around here for quite some time....since prolly the CU went live lol. If combat vehicles were added then we'd have to be the main destroyers--if not, devs would see some effigies burnin' hehe.I added in Area Damage/Area States since that is what we are now, and is subject to change.....hopefully. So now that we know who is supposed to do what, maybe we can get back on track instead of arguing...or whateverwe've been doing hehe
Time for another edition of Ryu's Thoughts! (tm)
While I do like the idea of commandos being beefed up, there is that nebulous problem of other professions crying about how we're getting special treatment. You know as well as I that the dev response to that will be to nerf us all to Hell, perhaps even worse off than we are now. Meanwhile, the other professions will all start to get higher versions of themselves, and we'll be back in the same boat we were to begin with.
Also, the addition of more of these "alpha" classes, as has been mentioned before, will just make the game more of a pain in the ass for the casual player. Where would be their incentive to PvP knowing that Alpha Commandos, Jedi, and god knows what else will be there to chew them up and spit them out? PvP has already taken a significant nosedive because of Jedi.
HOWEVER...
Look at the very topic of this thread.
Every age has it's wars, and every war has it's legends."
Message Edited by Ryubushi on 06-15-2005 05:38 AM
Personally, though, I'm not sure I like the time gating on the progression. By doing special quests, you unlock extra abilities for your character. Do you really need to add artificial delays into the system? Why not just make the quests hard enough to be their own gate. Maybe you need to infiltrate the DWB to kill a dangerous criminal or something similar. Such a quest would be difficult enough that it would require some level of planning and grouping to complete it but you wouldn't have to wait around for 3 weeks after finishing it to move on. In my mind, such delays just get boring.
Another thing worth considering--base the quest entry on multiple professions, either simultaneous or previous experience. Once you have mastered a certain set of professions (probably keeping at least one of them at the master level), you open up a quest series. By completing those quests, you gain the extra abilities. This would be something like having an elite group of Commandos who also have experience in Smuggling joining a special detachment of the Rebellion/Empire. Might be cool.
Nemo0 wrote:
I like the idea. Just make sure that most professions have some way of getting similar rewards.
Personally, though, I'm not sure I like the time gating on the progression. By doing special quests, you unlock extra abilities for your character. Do you really need to add artificial delays into the system? Why not just make the quests hard enough to be their own gate. Maybe you need to infiltrate the DWB to kill a dangerous criminal or something similar. Such a quest would be difficult enough that it would require some level of planning and grouping to complete it but you wouldn't have to wait around for 3 weeks after finishing it to move on. In my mind, such delays just get boring.
Another thing worth considering--base the quest entry on multiple professions, either simultaneous or previous experience. Once you have mastered a certain set of professions (probably keeping at least one of them at the master level), you open up a quest series. By completing those quests, you gain the extra abilities. This would be something like having an elite group of Commandos who also have experience in Smuggling joining a special detachment of the Rebellion/Empire. Might be cool.
They stalled to long in implementing this if they were ever gonna which is no. If not.... how do you classify the denial of an elite prof to the people that just played the game and could have easily ground jedi but said no 'cause it lacks pen1le tenacity. So now I have to grind even if I have ground harder than some of the longest non-ebayed fooktards that must be 1337... Um no. Take your packages to Core Systems where they belong. We want ourselves to be balanced. This is something that concerns core systems and not Commando as a community in the slightest.
please be nice, and do not be condensending in this thread. This is a thread for ideas, no matter how wacky or wierd, the last thing i want is for people to not voice there opinions,
SO BE NICEESPECAILY GUEST FROM ANOTHER PROFFESSION.
Message Edited by Cpl_Fisher on 06-15-2005 09:36 PM
Cpl_Fisher wrote:
the last thing i want is for people to voice there opinions.