Commando Archive

One question, Before the cu we could not use pups on are HW , the devs made it that way so we were not overpowered. Now after the cu its like they keep the same codeing on the pups for us. Did they mean to do that? Or was it just a overlook on there part.

I think it was overlooked, like how most schematics dont match up to their CL level. Some weapons are low level but take the same or more resources/components they did pre-CU. Take some low level grenades and the Launcher Pistol/Rocket Launcher for example, these were used pre-CU...but now because you get less bang for your buck due to new CLs, they're not worth using...

The Devs need to seriously look at our damage numbers, even with elemental damage there is no way on earth we are a 5 in offense.

I was in a group doing an NK-3 run last night, i was being outdamaged by our rifles guy, which is understandable, but also by swords, carbines and pistols... this was using mypost-19 proton rifle and maxed on hw speed and accuracy tapes.Switching to my PFT and getting in close, i waseating through my action bar at a ridiculous rate compared to damage rate,when pistols were laying down heavier fire for a longer period. (edited bit... i forgot to add, from 10m further away)

I'm going to try and arrange another run-thru and grab screenies of the combat logs and weapon details... if i can convice anyone else to go.

We're already paying withlimits in our range with the PFT and SAC cost on all our weaps, so surely we deserve something in return?

Message Edited by uselessn00b on 07-06-2005 10:37 AM

It make sence my furry friend... boost the elemental dmg...If it's the case, i am ruined ! All thoses weapons that i have... I shoud destroy or file and forget ?

It coud be also bethat they forgot to code someting, like the TKA Combo, witch i am sure they forgot to code that its suppose to do more thant 1 hit ! Actually, you lose action for a skill worse than the default attack. and that profession is linked to Commando... also no more spin in TKA, need to be Pikemen 0100 or better, we are stock, stealing other skills all the time !

"The Devs need to seriously look at our damage numbers, even with elemental damage there is no way on earth we are a 5 in offense."

Thats just it. With my improved legshot, I am almost -always- the #1 doer of damage in all my guild groups...and we have jedi, pistoleers, smugglers, riflemen, etc. Only if im doing solely crowd control do I most likely get outdamaged...

That damage I do? 2,300 max every 3 seconds with my PFT as well as my Proton Rifle when I use Improved Legshot. Thats good damage, and personally speaking, thats a 5 in my book. BUT, thats ok with the carbineer element I choce for my template...imagine a melee commando or a commando starting out? Swordsmen and Riflemen (to my knowledge) can do that approximate damage...but within their own profession, they only go outside their own for more versitility with specials, and more mods to boost their combat level. Commandos require those outside professions for our damage...because of how uniqueness, our profession works inversely. Without the right template, we're a dead horse.

Even if AoE was 100% and working, thats not damage dealing as we'd still get outdamaged anyways (mainly on single targets). The best benefit would the ability to do damageon lots of targets at once that no one else can do, which is in itself potentially unbalancing. Theres a lot more negatives to this odd vision of a commando, than positives. The core of the problem stems from the gigantic disparity between damage that a regular commando can do versus that of a fully ranged templated commando that invested in strong attacks, and if our AoE ability is considered that of a damage dealing ability, given that EVERY useful master weapon thats craftable does the same function...commando's really get the short end of the stick...

BTW, Ill be MIA for a day or so, havent been on much due to constant necrosis raids for my proton rifle (took 13 raids and a week worth of time on my part and guild's, which im grateful for). Also working on the commando guide as well as updated issues/state/etc/revamp ideas/wishlist/etc/misc

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StarNick wrote:

That damage I do? 2,300 max every 3 seconds with my PFT as well as my Proton Rifle when I use Improved Legshot. Thats good damage, and personally speaking, thats a 5 in my book.

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The way Commando is layed out really doesn't lend itself to a true Commando role. I think it should be completely over-hauled into something more like -

Demolition, Heavy Weapons, Small Arms, Covert Operations

Therefore a commando wouldhave their -

Demolitions:Grenades and other explosives as well as harm minimisation from such weapons

Heavy Weapons:burning, melting, detonating at range etc. As is now but fixed AoE, each Heavy Weapon cirt at a different level of Heavy Weapons. Assault armour cirt.

Small Arms: An ability for each type of small arm and one h2h when holding a weapon (maybe useable with hvy weap as well) Because a Commando should be able to use any military type weapon. Battle armour cirt.

Covert Operations: Behind enemy lines type tactics and survival. Maybe even crafting of basic Commando weapons, or maybe not. A survival line from Scout instead of the useless h2h line pre-req would be put in. Recon armour cirt.

Pretty much 100% chance nothing like this would happen but it sounds like a good idea doesn't it?

Bulwark:

"BUT, thats ok with the carbineer element I chose for my template...imagine a melee commando or a commando starting out? "

Thats my point . We're a 5 in damage if we take up another profession (and my PFT is a lot stronger than my elite carbine), but only with that other profession. We have "innate specials" but very weak actual specials that a pure commando can use, sometimes our weapons can do some nice damage; max damage, opposed to other weapons...ive noticed its many times a good 100 points more...but the speed brings us down in DPS, and SAC prevents the spammage of high powered attacks.

The problem, is once again we have a double negative that cancels out our usefulness. We can stand for the slow speed so we can't pull off high powered attacks AND fast attacks, thats a given trade-off for damage dealing. However, we're hit with both the highest SAC (light years ahead of some nicely made rifles and carbines...some folks won't buy those if they're over 100 SAC, which is our cap), and our trade-off is one sided...no where does the damage dealing w/ only commando skills enters the equation. As for utility? Thats only an extra 400 damage (MAX I may add, I usually get 270 or 370 dot damage) which usually accounts for 1500 damage of a CL 80's amount of damage it took, which after resists is only one extra shot if you used marksman specials. AoE? With marksman specials, this would come in handy and do lots of damage...just not to single targets...and it seems from the beginning it never was intended to be 100% AoE either, meaning it'll be rather weak.

Its almost convoluted in a way...we're damage dealers with another profession, but alone we're gimped. This is the hole that the Devs dug for themselves in regards to not having commando specials, and was something we were concerned about in Alpha...and those concerns proved correct; the devs (who told us not to worry...) didn't get it right with balancing good damage dealing power in commando and those same commando weapons with other elites without the use of specials. You raise the innate damage to match that of rifles or swords with specials, if you use other elite specials your damage goes through the roof. Looks great on paper, but in actuality it kinda sucks...

Message Edited by StarNick on 07-07-2005 12:37 PM

Message Edited by StarNick on 07-07-2005 12:39 PM

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Tyyylowyspetily wrote:

I guess maybe I'm getting a little bummed out becauseI use that rifle with only marksman rifles 2 to better effect than any of my heavy weapons.

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I'm right there with ya. I find I rarely use my commando abilities, and that's only if I want to apply a fire dot. And in reality, the state efffects I get from other professions are much better at doing what I want to do without pulling in all the mobs around the one I want to hit.

And even if my laser rifle wasn't as powerful as a PFT, an inexpensivepowerup will more than compensate.

Other than apply stopping shot to multiple mobs, is there anything a master commando can do, that a master pistolier can't?

It goes beyond that. We are not especially accurate, and our speed mods are aweful. I finally reached 138 heavy weapons speed as a smuggler/commando... using +25 in SEA's and force sensitive ranged speed. I finally topped 300 accuracy, using force sensitive accuracy and +25 heavy weapons, +25 general ranged acc, and this after dipping into pistoleer accuracy for an additional +55 GRA. Accuracy being linked to damage and all, this is a big kick in the *a-hem*... Anyway, what exactly is it that commando is supposed to be good at? I have a rifle that has a max damage of 1100 before a damage P'up. This is certainly on par with my PFT, it has lower action cost, and I can hit out to 64m with it. If I want AOE I can use fanshot, and dispatch multiple opponents withina quarter of the time, and without running out of action in the process.

Well, I've been looking for ways to go commando with my Alt, but the profession is just broken for more reasons then you mention here.

I really wanted to go Commando too just because it seems like such an awsome profession. The problem with Commando (to be simple) is that it is no different then any of the other Ranged professions except you have slower speed and lower accuracy and no defense.

The best Commando weapon has a DPS of 300ish and a max range of 25m. How is that any difference then Pistoleer? At least with Pistoleer I get specials and can add other ranged professions to increase my speed and accuracy with a pistol.

That is the problem with commando. In order to get the "power" that your profession is suppose to have, you have to get Rifleman or Carbineer. In which case, why do you need commando? Why would you pick up Rifleman for "Improved Headshot" to be used by a Flame Thrower with a 300 DPS and a 25m range when you can use a 300 DPS Rifle and have a 65m range?

So, if that is the case, why did I pick up Commando? I should just take Rifleman, stack it with Bounty Hunter and have 2x the accuracy, speed, and defense then I have with Commando in the mix.

This is the problem with almost every profession in the game right now. As long as every weapon is has the same DPS why would you use anything other then a rifle in combat? Heck, I am a Master Bounty Hunter / Master Pistoleer / 0003 Rifleman and all I use are rifles. How stupid is that?

I feel for you commando's because your entire profession is defined by the other profession you have. It's a sad state.

"That is the problem with commando. In order to get the "power" that your profession is suppose to have, you have to get Rifleman or Carbineer. "

Aka our No 1 issue! We'll be able to cross the flame incap bug out now...hopefully if Blix can iron out the AoE, maybe our second biggest one...

Only time shall tell