Commando Archive

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Brilyn wrote:

< if buffs are overpowered and TKM, Rifleman,etc can take out buffed players much faster then Commando...whats that make Commando? Balanced? >

Um...... Yes?

Let's see...

Pistols Speedcap at 1sec. They do x damage per second. 92 SP Pre-Req at Master.

Carbines Speed Cap at 1sec. They do 2x damage per second. (not really, but we'll pretend they do. ) 92 SP Pre-Req at Master.

Rifles Speedcap at 1sec. They do 4x per second. 92 SP Pre-Req at Master.

You forgot Commandos speed cap and DPS. 169 SP Pre-Req at Master.

You see this as 'ok'?

As in your original post, you seem to be neglecting some facts, and then focusing on others. You originally claim that the problem is with "Buffs", now it's speed cap. I agree with you that both are not proper or balanced. Yet, with BOTH buffs and speedcap issues, who gets the complete short end of the stick? Maybe acknowledge the fact that Commandos cost almost twice as many SP to Master (And the MOST Combat based SP FYI)compaired to Elite Classes. Yet most people like to ignore that FACT when compairing.

You see this as 'ok'?

< What kind of damage do some of the less skill point intensive Elite classes do to an unbuffed player? >

I've a real simple answer to that: too much.

Bingo! So saying that, they obviousely do too much damage for a profession costing 92 SP as opposed to a 169 SP costing profession.

< Commandos NOT sizing up, DPS to Skill point requirement ratio,in comparison to other professions IS an issue! Buffed or not. >

Ah, 'the grass is greener' arguement.....

There's two ways to go with that:

Either "we're crap compared to them" or "They're overpowered compared to us".

Many Commando here don't take that stance. We have issues that should be adressed. COMMANDO issues. Not just Buffs or Speedcaps...yes, those are issues for the whole community. But, too many people like to disreguard the skill points we have to invest for what we get. Ask yourself, "Would I spend 169 skill points, all combat, to have a flamethrower that's0AP and'ok' in some situations. Have a Heavy Acid Rifle that costs more heavy weapon experiance then the flamethrower that is much less effective, has no DOT, and will rarely be used. Have a tree dedicated to expensive consumables which are inaccurate, cost a lot of HAM, Busted Skill Tapes, and have a good delay. Have a tree dedicated to use an item that is specialized for rare situations and can incap you faster then any Carbineer skill?". I think you must have...thus the Master Weaponsmith and Carbineer (Carbineer? You got a thumbs up for that...try Commando! *smile*)

You need to step back and look at the system as a whole. Most of us have...even so...we should have the best potential...as of now, yet to be seen!

Yes, your profession has issue. The lack of AP on your non-disposable weaponry is a big issue, imo. Heavy Weapon Specialists? HUGE issue...looks like they gave AP out like candy on halloween...we got the rocks! Where are you Great Pumpkin?

If Riflemen speedcapped at (for the sake of Arguement) 3 seconds, the disparity between the damage output of the two professions wouldn't seem so huge, would it? If Master Rifleman cost 169 SP, maybe not. But yet the compairison continues...why? There's nothing special about Commando except we have to constantly compair ourselves with 92 SP professions for effectiveness. The original poster refelcted on this and his frustration. You acredited his frustration to Buffs, Speedcap, and ultimately Combat Revamp type of thing. Sure, that's known, but even so. Commandos should NOT be equal in certain aspects of the game, yet people keep trying to use slight of hand, smoke and mirrors, and irrelivant things to make us accept something lesser them we deserve.

I'm not here to knock you, or 'pick sides' or any of that childishness. I saw that in your other posts. I'm not here for that either. I just want you and others to understand that most of us here don't wan't to be UBER. We don't want to be the absolute best in everything "Combat". Most of us just want for our investment of skill points to reflect that. It's not childish to make an investment and expect at least equall return. At this time, knowing most combat professions are unbalanced, Commando is especially unbalanced. So please understand, when a Commando comes here and expresses his/her confusion and frustration, and gets and answer like yours, "Hopdog, that would be an issue with the Buff system then, wouldn't it? Not with the Commando Profession.", seems to downplay the REAL issues we have. That's all.

I'm just offering an alternative perspective is all. Hope I've done tha same! Keep those weapons rolling out Bro!

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Slainte'

you have this all wrong when you said


< we should have the best potential >

Um.... make up your mind.

That statement conflicts *strongly* with your other statements, like:

"I just want you and others to understand that most of us here don't wan't to be UBER."

And:

"We don't want to be the absolute best in everything "Combat"."

what bravenirish most likly meant was that for example in RL a Green berat is the most elite soldir in the U.S army and in a arms fight you can take a Green berat against a (say a black belt) and most likely a Green berat would win. Now if you took a reg army foghter guy and had him dual in RL the black belt might win (if in close combat)

ok I know this is a game a “sci-fiction” type of game and I strongly agree with Hyperdice on his topic.

And I under stand you don’t want to drop wep’ smith so why don’t u make a new char on some other shard and try it out from the getco like thunderheart did and then you might be singing a different toon.

Thank you Hopdog,

The quality of our weapons?

Brilyn wrote
“I want to discuss "stuff". I want to make better weaponry for Commandos. I want to see if *some* of your issues can be addressed by a competant WS, rather than simply assuming the Devs need to fix everything.”

Okay my flamethrower (our only viable weapon)
638 min damage
1161 max damage
28% wound
attack speed is 5.1
If you need more info on it just ask, but I think its far from the low end as to its quality.

A fellow imperial and me decided to defend our base. It was in the process of being attacked by a master TKM. We were all fully buffed and in composite armor. My friend got his flamethrower from the same master weapon smith as mine and was similarly sliced. My friend got two hits (flame single 2) in before he was knocked down, dizzy and died. Meanwhile I was busy missing two times and hit him once with flame single 2 before it was my turn to get knocked down and killed. I tried to stay ranged but server latency didn’t help. We also had our two AT-ST’s helping but with all of our combined firepower and that of the base npc’s we didn’t even take half his HP down (he lost between a quarter and a third of his health and mostly to our AT-ST’s while we had him distracted). If you really think crappy weapons are to blame wouldn’t that affect melee weapons too.

Brilyn also wrote
“While it may only cost 92 SP to get the Master Carbineer Badge, it costs significantly more to be an effective Carbineer. (note this is not an invite for the predictible: "but we spend 169 and STILL aren't effective". I get what you're saying, I just disagree with your focus on SP.)”

It’s hard not to focus on when the difference is so drastic and the bottom line is we are a master of nothing.

Brilyn writes
“Frankly, I think Commando should be just generally more *interesting* than other professions, rather than simply focusing on damage output.”

I’m going to respond with a quote from my post as I fell it fits.

“I don’t remember two thirds of the galaxy running around with swords killing people armed with blasters like they were unarmed. I remember the flavor being a little more tech based. I love the cool animation of pulling out my rocket launcher but it is useless. I don’t feel like a heavy weapon specialist. Star Wars is also supposed to be about blasters and futuristic fights, not wannabe Jedi running around slaughtering stormtroopers and heavily armed opponents with vibroknucklers and melee weapons.”

I thought a major part of the Star Wars saga was the epic battles with blasters firing, not Conan type battles but futuristic ones.

I’m sorry if it seems like we are picking on you Brilyn but we need more than a weaponsmith.

Okay, assuming the accuracy issues with grenades are fixed:

They're still capped at 32m.
They still hurt the user if the target gets within the blast radius. (You throw at an oncoming meleer, they're in blast range by the time the gren hits.)
They still don't count as a regular part of the combat queue and can't be cleared. (If you have a number of regular specials queued up and click a grenade, you throw the grenade instantly, it ignores the queue.)
They only come in stacks of five, on some targets you'd have to pull a whole crate to do any damage.
They're expensive for the damage they actually do. If you ran missions using grenades, there's no way you'd make your money back.
Most of them have crappy AP.
The only "loot components" for grenades, Acklay Venom, can only be used in C22s, Glops and Cryobans, the low end grenades.

And that's just the grenade tree. The other three trees all have their share of problems.

Iagree that Grenades are for support in an attack and that you shold not be able to kill anything with one Grenade. On the other side i believe that Grenadesif they are to be productive in the game since they are disposable the speed on them is what makes them inafeective. now before you go on about the "speed" this and "speed" that all profestion's are soposed to be "based" on the same speed scale based on first single hit dmg i know that its a issue that there trying to fix but i also now that it's an "issue" that we live with for quite some time and thuss the hesitation for new comando's to use the Grenades. I do believe that you are trying to figure out what comando's want to use and such but the truth is that on most "galixy's" they are expensiv when you can find a WS to make them and geting blasted in the field dosnt help the trend of Grenades.