Commando Archive
Thread: New HAM System Coming...
Evelas wrote:
So this is the HAM rebalance they've been talking about since January? And they haven't figured out what they're going to do?
Well...at least it'll help the Carbineers, poor guys.
From Kel's recent reply in the "In Concent" forum post, it sounds like they had a new HAM design similar to this proposed sysytem and it was ready to roll out...they Tested in on TC and discovered it had a few flaws...this latest post represents a revamp on the design based off of what they learned during that testing period...
PS...to respond to the Buff Question that came up...Kel reported that buffs will infact influence the "special abilities" bars as well as the HAM bars...both will go up...but this should be taken with a grain of salt since Buff's are apparently being "reworked" as well...
So it took them 5 months to revamp a few numbers?
garvin wrote:
Evelas wrote:
So this is the HAM rebalance they've been talking about since January? And they haven't figured out what they're going to do?
Well...at least it'll help the Carbineers, poor guys.
From Kel's recent reply in the "In Concent" forum post, it sounds like they had a new HAM design similar to this proposed sysytem and it was ready to roll out...they Tested in on TC and discovered it had a few flaws...this latest post represents a revamp on the design based off of what they learned during that testing period...
PS...to respond to the Buff Question that came up...Kel reported that buffs will infact influence the "special abilities" bars as well as the HAM bars...both will go up...but this should be taken with a grain of salt since Buff's are apparently being "reworked" as well...
Tyrst wrote:
As commando sits right now this will not affect us that much. If you take a look at our current regen time most of our weapons are slow enough to not impact our HAM. The new ability pools regen even faster so I really doubt there will be much of a difference for us.
Since some of our weapons are big HAM eaters, this could work out in our favor...or at least better then we have it now...my worry is just being left down river without a paddle...that at some point we'll be stuck in combat, not able to do any specials or fire any of our consumables, while we wait for "special abilities" bar to regen...
The focus of my first series of tests will probably be to see how quickly I can eat up those "Special Abilities" bars and how quickly they regen...after that will be to look at how damage taken (both damage and actual wounds) effects the new bars as well...
But the key thing is that we should be able to kill ourselves as easily as before...
Daker-Naritus wrote:
This combat balance thing is going to suck.
For some reason the developers have this stupid "more power = higher specials costs" on the brain....
Question: Why spend skill points and time grinding to get higher skills, if those skills are just going to be "balanced" with specials costs that mean you can't use them?
(although hopefull both will recieve their nerfs very soon...)
Combat_Medic_to_be wrote:
Daker-Naritus wrote:
This combat balance thing is going to suck.
For some reason the developers have this stupid "more power = higher specials costs" on the brain....
Question: Why spend skill points and time grinding to get higher skills, if those skills are just going to be "balanced" with specials costs that mean you can't use them?
The reason this is a good thing is that it stops people from just spamming their most powerful attacks. So long asHAM cost is also increased for attacks that give state effects it will be a very good thing because it will add alot more depth to combat. You will have to consider when to use your high cost specials, whether you want to use them early in battle to get the damage in fast but leave yourself with less options as the battle unfolds or vise versa, or even a compromise between the two.
This new HAM system should bring alot more stratagy into combat as long as HAM costs are related to damage and possible states inflicted. The best PvPers wont just be those who can def stack or spam headShot3
Ok....which one of the devolpers is this? 
My thoughts from another post:
(1) Better special moves are what separates a novice from a master. If you are going to give advanced pistoleers great specials, but heavily penalize those advanced pistoleers with specials costs (so that they can rarely use them), what is the difference between a novice and a master. Both will just sit there auto-attacking.
This is especially true with the increased speed you get as a you skill up. More speed = You shoot Specials faster = The regeneration of your HAM bars over time has a MUCH greater effect because there is less time between specials to regenerate.
When you add faster shooting, and greather HAM costs of better moves, you are killing all incentives people have to be masters.
The solution to this is to tie specials' costs to skill level..... The Body Shot 3 for a Master Pistoleer should have the same special cost for a master that Body Shot 2 has for a novice pistoleer to make everything equitable. If you do not take this into account, there is no reason to even have differing specials.
(2) Standing there pushing no buttons at all and watching your character auto-attack is BOOOOOOORRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNGGGGGGG. My favorite part about the combat in this game is the control I have over what I am doing at every single second of combat.
If you incur high specials costs on all specials, you are essentially killing this, and eliminating one of the best parts of the game.
The solution would be to have some low cost moves that you can "spam" if you desire (for less damage of course), and some high cost moves that impose status effects or do big damage.
Key: The thing that is unbalancing about specials is not the spamming, it is the spamming of the best moves over and over. If you eliminate all spamming, you are ruining the best part of the game.
Message Edited by Daker-Naritus on 07-24-2004 08:25 AM
Daker-Naritus wrote:
Combat_Medic_to_be wrote:
Daker-Naritus wrote:
This combat balance thing is going to suck.
For some reason the developers have this stupid "more power = higher specials costs" on the brain....
Question: Why spend skill points and time grinding to get higher skills, if those skills are just going to be "balanced" with specials costs that mean you can't use them?
The reason this is a good thing is that it stops people from just spamming their most powerful attacks. So long asHAM cost is also increased for attacks that give state effects it will be a very good thing because it will add alot more depth to combat. You will have to consider when to use your high cost specials, whether you want to use them early in battle to get the damage in fast but leave yourself with less options as the battle unfolds or vise versa, or even a compromise between the two.
This new HAM system should bring alot more stratagy into combat as long as HAM costs are related to damage and possible states inflicted. The best PvPers wont just be those who can def stack or spam headShot3
Ok....which one of the devolpers is this?
Didnt get that, lol, havent been around the forums very long
My thoughts from another post:
(1) Better special moves are what separates a novice from a master. If you are going to give advanced pistoleers great specials, but heavily penalize those advanced pistoleers with specials costs (so that they can rarely use them), what is the difference between a novice and a master. Both will just sit there auto-attacking.
This is especially true with the increased speed you get as a you skill up. More speed = You shoot Specials faster = The regeneration of your HAM bars over time has a MUCH greater effect because there is less time between specials to regenerate.
When you add faster shooting, and greather HAM costs of better moves, you are killing all incentives people have to be masters.
I didnt really explain myself very well in that post, lol. What i would like to see is each profesion having one very powerful attack with a very high special cost also. Make the specials that do more damage or inflict stateshave higher costs but not so much so that people have to auto attack
The solution to this is to tie specials' costs to skill level..... The Body Shot 3 for a Master Pistoleer should have the same special cost for a master that Body Shot 2 has for a novice pistoleer to make everything equitable. If you do not take this into account, there is no reason to even have differing specials.
I like the idea of having a base special cost with mods throughout the trees to reduce costs. Would certainlybe very interesting and add alot of depth
(2) Standing there pushing no buttons at all and watching your character auto-attack is BOOOOOOORRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNGGGGGGG. My favorite part about the combat in this game is the control I have over what I am doing at every single second of combat.
If you incur high specials costs on all specials, you are essentially killing this, and eliminating one of the best parts of the game.
The solution would be to have some low cost moves that you can "spam" if you desire (for less damage of course), and some high cost moves that impose status effects or do big damage.
I agree completely with this point, there need to be some low cost specials and some high cost but if a move inflicts state and/or is highly damaging the special cost needs to reflect this
Key: The thing that is unbalancing about specials is not the spamming, it is the spamming of the best moves over and over. If you eliminate all spamming, you are ruining the best part of the game.
Message Edited by Daker-Naritus on 07-24-2004 08:25 AM