Commando Archive
Thread: Time to be Realistic Garibaldi Please Read
Alright, I've been reading through this forum for some time. A lot of good ideas have been suggested but where are we going. As Commandos, we can argue with each other for weeks. All the good suggestions in the world aren't going to do us any good unless we put aside our differences, come up with some concrete requests that we all back, and present them in a unified manner to the developers of SWG. I believe the first thing we need to do is this: find out what changes the developers are WILLING to make- cosmetic or a complete commando overhaul.
Garibaldi... I applaud your efforts in representing us to the developers. I read the transcript of your week 2 conversation. It seemed to me like the developer was not respecting or really listening to your problems with the flame thrower's speed, damage and special moves. It read as if he was trying to get you to come over to his point of view rather than listening to you, our representative.
So, first things first. Please ask the developers the following questions and push for answers.
- Are they only going to allow small changes or can we overhaul the entire commando tree?
- Are they going to do as we, the Commandos suggest or only take our requests "under advisement"?
- When are we going to see any concrete changes to the commando profession?
Commandos... Once we have the answers to these questions, we need to create a single document with 5-10 requests on it and stand united behind it. It's the only way anything will get changed. Please understand that this means you, I and everyone else will NOT get everything we want.
We can bitch on this forum for years and not get changes made or we can work together, come up with the changes that appeal to the most people, then have Garibaldi submit them for us. Honestly, I don't believe that we'll be able to make huge changes in the class. As I'm sure other coders can tell you, it's probably going to be too difficult to add stationary guns like E-webs. On the other hand, it may not be too difficult to change an acid rifle to a repeating blaster, adjust damage levels, change a few special attacks, and so on.
So, I humbly ask that you all get with me on this. Garibaldi, please speak to the Devs immediately about the questions above and post their answers here. From that point on, we'll can begin working on that list of 5-10 requests.
As many of you have pointed out on other threads, all our bitching is going nowhere. It's time to go forward with a logical plan and get something done.
Humbly,
I 100% agree with every word! This post deserves some attention! It's sound, uncomplicated and unbiased! We need realistic requirements to make the commando "playable", and we need appropriate feed back to the requests that Garibaldi makes rather than abritrary reasons why things are the way they are. Its not just a bout a few peoples good ideas its about everyone comprimising on a few major things that everyone can agree on.
Maybe if we setup a post with the major issues and had everyone vote on the priority of these fixes, with the specification not to include additional ideas or plugs for personal wish lists. Something cut and dry so that the devs can look right at it and say "Oh yeah, that does sound like a problem, and oh look there's a proposed solution...hmmm maybe we can do that". I think too often the major fixes and great ideas are clouded by several posts that simply complain about the way things are. Not that I disagree with the complaining it's well founded, but we need to speak out to the devs and forum moderators and when they scroll through and see only rants they may turn away.
Thank you MasterSynn.
Milkman1997 wrote:
if we setup a post with the major issues and had everyone vote on the priority of these fixes, with the specification not to include additional ideas or plugs for personal wish lists. Something cut and dry so that the devs can look right at it and say "Oh yeah, that does sound like a problem, and oh look there's a proposed solution...hmmm maybe we can do that".
Thank you for your support. Your idea of voting on a list of priorities is very good. I would suggest that after the vote is taken, we compile only the top suggestions and submit those. Once I hear back from Gaibaldi, I'd be happy to comb through the posts in this forum and compile a list of others' proposals and post it here for votes. Bear in mind that some suggestions may be mutually exclusive and may need some sort of run off vote. An example might be one suggestion to change the acid rifle to a anti-vehicle laser cannon and another suggestion to do away with the acid rifle.
This will take a bit of mediation but, again, your idea of compiiling a list of ideas and then voting on them is solid. Garibaldi, get back to us as soon as possible with the answers from the developers.
Thanks.
We're all pushing for you Commandos.
One suggestion, regarding weaopn effectiveness.
I strongly suggest getting together with master weapon crafters and the weaponsmith forum to detail exactly why weapons that have high base DPS, don't seem to scale as well after experimentation with other weapons (like a scout blaster...for instance). A large part of much of the weaponry issues for carbine and rifle, seem to come out of not having weapons that are highly experimented effectively. This could be due to a purely crafting issue (like advanced components not working in some more complex schematics), orto a resource issue, or both. I know on Chilastra a lot of laser weaponry is JUST now showing up (!!), and it wasn't for lack of crafters..they were ready and waiting.
Ilike the acid rifle even thoughI havent used it yet. Maybe one of the advantages of being a commando could be the wide assortment of weapons to choose from? Lots of professions allow for targeting specific ham pools, how about commando allowing the specific targeting of a damage type for the light(er) arms "primary?" weapons and the heavy weapons for large heavily armored targets.I thinka rocket launcher should be one of the most difficult to craft (and one of the most powerfull) items in the game with many many subcomponents including some that only commando's can make and be pretty much a 1 hit kill to anything but be extremely slow maybe as slow as 5 seconds to fire and 20 seconds until next attack.
the thread to post this in probably does not exist yet so i wont post alot of my opinions here ... i got carried away with my quick comment 
Garibaldi, I'm still waiting for some response from you. Please take the questions to the developers and post their response. I the mean time, I suggest we move forward under the assumption that the developers are not going to allow sweeping changes to the Commando profession. So far, they've not done anything to indicate that they will make drastic changes for us.
So, please begin submitting concise changes that you'd like to see and I will compile them for a vote once we have enough. Please keep them brief and to the point. You don't need to go into great detail as to WHY you want the change, we just need a list so that we can vote on them. Also, please confine the suggestions to our profession. This is about improving Commandos, not nerfing other professions. I'll begin with some of requests I've seen elsewhere on this board:
- Greatly increase the damage on the HEAVY weapons
- Change the heavy acid rifle to a multi-barrel repeating blaster from Sorosuub or Merr Sonn
- Add grenade launcher to the Heavy Weapons Support tree
- Insure that ALL resources needed for ALL heavy weapons crafting are available on ALL servers
- Allow Commandos to use their rifle bonuses when using longarms and pistol bonuses when using the launcher
That's enough from me for now. Star posting your requests. hanks.
Humbly,
Jaegen88 wrote:
We're all pushing for you Commandos.
One suggestion, regarding weaopn effectiveness.
I strongly suggest getting together with master weapon crafters and the weaponsmith forum to detail exactly why weapons that have high base DPS, don't seem to scale as well after experimentation with other weapons (like a scout blaster...for instance). A large part of much of the weaponry issues for carbine and rifle, seem to come out of not having weapons that are highly experimented effectively. This could be due to a purely crafting issue (like advanced components not working in some more complex schematics), orto a resource issue, or both. I know on Chilastra a lot of laser weaponry is JUST now showing up (!!), and it wasn't for lack of crafters..they were ready and waiting.
It's not the weapon design. There is a flaw in every weapon that uses multiple power couplings. That's why you see everything above a laser rifle with such low damage, regardless of it's AR rating. As it stands right now, the best weapons available for DPS are those at Expert Weaponsmith and below. Hopefully this gets addressed soon.
MasterSynn wrote:
- Are they only going to allow small changes or can we overhaul the entire commando tree?
- Are they going to do as we, the Commandos suggest or only take our requests "under advisement"?
- When are we going to see any concrete changes to the commando profession?
1. I can EASILY answer that one. They will state "overhauls of trees were done in beta" they will make small changes here and there, but nothing that would "alter" the entire tree.
2. Everything is taken "under advisement" that we (Commandos) post, some may change some may not.
3. I cant truely answer this one, but I assume that the changes that are listed on the "Test Center" page will go in whenever they annouce the "Big Patch". Of course when you assume you make an "a$$ out of u and me"
Jaegen88 wrote:
We're all pushing for you Commandos.
One suggestion, regarding weaopn effectiveness.
I strongly suggest getting together with master weapon crafters and the weaponsmith forum to detail exactly why weapons that have high base DPS, don't seem to scale as well after experimentation with other weapons (like a scout blaster...for instance). A large part of much of the weaponry issues for carbine and rifle, seem to come out of not having weapons that are highly experimented effectively. This could be due to a purely crafting issue (like advanced components not working in some more complex schematics), orto a resource issue, or both. I know on Chilastra a lot of laser weaponry is JUST now showing up (!!), and it wasn't for lack of crafters..they were ready and waiting.
I think a lot of this comes down to a misunderstanding of how weapons work. Everyone looks at the DPS of pistols and goes gaga, when the truth is once AR penetration factor is taken into account many carbines have equal or better damage against AR0, let alone AR1/AR2 where the difference is even more dramatic.
If Commando weapons have high AR values then they might not be underpowered. Unfortunately it seems like they (at least the Launcher Pistol) does not.
Agreed.
The Launcher Pistol isn't that bad, if it's crafted with good quality materials. I.e. High Conductivity, High Quality. The reason why the dps is -bad- is because a gunsmith uses bad materials, or resources. However, I have a decent LP and a scout blaster.
I've noticed on armored targets that the scout blaster does less on average then the LP does. And yes, you have to use the spec attacks from pistol. But, really it's not that bad. Try using a bleed attack with two pistols. And note the damage. The LP has a higher bleed damage to it per tick then my scout blaster. So I end up starting the fight with the LP for bleed, and switching to the other one, because it's faster and has better ham cost.
As far as the Acid Rifle goes, really -- it should be scrapped and put a repeating blaster rifle into the works. It suits SW a little better then an acid rifle. I mean, majority of the weapons are blaster or laser technology. Why not utilize that? I like the idea of being the guy carrying the repeating blaster. It'd make sense.
The Heavy Particle Beam Cannon -- I've seen a couple made on my server, and they're pretty nasty in the damage department. But the fastest one I've seen is 6.0 seconds. It's comprable to a pistol, unless it's AR is higher. Then it's pretty nasty period, considering you can slice it and maybe, just maybe up it's speed.
However, the pricetag on Scylla for one is 20k. So, unless you're also a merchant -- you're going to be spending a while gathering the cash for it. I've only see one flamer, and I'm not all that impressed by it. It's pretty, but-- if you have to stay at a certain range, then the class is dependant on being in a troupe. So is our role to be the heavy hitter, whilst the others keep the mob pinned down? If so, that's fine. Most of the time, I'm endlessly switching back and forth between guns.
I don't mind that. It's pretty fun to me. Nail with LP with roll shot, note which pool takes the most dmg, switch to wpn that targets said pool, and you're on your way. Being a Commando isn't just about using the hvy wpns, but using your Master Marksman skills to your advantage. Of course, this means no hvy wpn xp if you're relying on it. And it makes it a little harder, but-- I'm still waiting for the changes to the certs.
I'd really like to use the hvy wpns and see if they truly are better, worse, or just middlands. And I don't mind enduring the endless snickering from all the BH/CH's running around. I like my tag above my head. I worked for it. I'd just like to play my class as intended. =)
MasterSynn wrote:
Garibaldi, I'm still waiting for some response from you.
You posted the first and are asking a response within 2 hours from your first post.
Give his some friggin time...relax a bit.
And like he should respond to this. He doesn't owe you anything. He doesn't owe anyone anything. He is just playing a game like anyone else. You don't elect him, and you don't demand anything of him.
The_Origional_Frills wrote:
You posted the first and are asking a response within 2 hours from your first post.
Give his some friggin time...relax a bit.
Actually, the question were posted 3 days ago. In addition, my intention is not to pressure Garibaldi but instead to band together to put more pressure on the developers as a group. Perhaps you should take your own advice and "relax a bit".
