Commando Archive
Thread: Know thy enemy. A commandos PvP guide. Experienced PvPers help apreciated.
I am relatively new to GCW and PvP in SWG so I will just give some ideas I have from my little experience. I look to the experienced PvP commandos to help out here with this constructive guide on how to deal with what we got.
Ok first off, know your enemy.:
Other Commandos: Typically in PvP it is wise not to show your cards so dont expect to see the commando banner waving in the breeze, and with other commandos, there are numerous supporting professions that are common so this depends on what supporting skills you have. If you got defenses high enough through melee professions, move in and its russian roulette to see who hits first, if you got a ranged profession adequetly enough to hit you can try running a gamble that they dont and begin to kite. In either scenario, it could be russian roulette if they have similar support skills.
Brawlers: Ok, here we got a problem of fighting high defense class on there ground with our measly 16m. HWs are probably not going to hit a high defense target from ranged and the kneeling will slow you down long enough for them to catch you anyway so be advised, it not a preferred confrontation. Best bet is, even though we cant special at 64m and are inacurate on the move, kiting with FT regular shots may be the best bet.
Marksman: Ok we got a problem here. Other marksman, including BHs, got more accuracy than we are and if they are smart they will not get in 16m and will keep moving so HWs will be dificult to land. Try to use buildings, rocks, or trees provided tehy are big enough to cover you. Lure them into your game or try to get the drop on em which is hard solo. Note that hills do not stop projectiles in this game. Having high ranged defense helps immensly in this situation as well as having our own ranged profession mixed in. The best combo of the 2 would be master rifleman, or, if you want a profession to set up a FT special on them, pistoleer with drty fighting 3 for knockdown or go for the carbineer KD, just make sure you got the accuract skill mods.
OK secondly, common tactics for all foes:
Terrain: As mentioned befor, if you dont have a ranged profession, you dont want to get in the open field where you can be kited. I suggest sticking to city fighting where there are ample supply of buildings to hide behind. Make em come to you and if they dont, work your way out of the fight. Not very brave or honorable but no need to die in veign.
Large Battles: If you got 10 people going at it, you got an advantage of them being distracted so you can get the flame specials in. Also, if you see a ranged sniper fight where an opponent is prone and not paying any attention to you, now is your chance for your HW to shine and you get to wreak havoc. Enjoy the beautiful fireworks. This is the situation I highly recomend currently as we only got 16m specials and por acuracy otherwise. Still, be patient and use terrain as mentioned and be ready for that split second window of oppurtunity.
Secondary skills: there are several possibilities. I've mentioned befor, ranged fighting helps as do KDs and ranged/melee defenses. Pick carefully as to what wil fit you and your style of fighting. I prefer to use only my commando weapons myself so I decided not to go for ranged fighting, however, getting some range wol make you usefull in more situations than my high defenses. The reason I went high defense with my short range goes back to my Mech Warrior days. I used a Daishi packed with short ranged weapons and good armor and stuck to the city, my commando will be similar as I will stick to urban combat where I am experienced and really enjoy along with the defenses are very helpful PvE.
I hope this helps and hope to see some more added from more experienced PvPers. What I have here is just some plain common sense for combat and may not easily be executed in this game but I tryed to keep to what I see is possible. Add in as you feel fit and debate about it. Later we can compile a complete guide for commando and PvP.
**edit**....
Hard to think of tips considering the simplicity of the profession. Simple in that there isn't much to know about the Commando in PvP. But there is stuff about PvP that I find people unaware of. Here's some tips & guidelines that help me, for PvP is all I do nowadays:
The first and most important thing to do before PvPing is to make sure that you gots your gear on you. This includes armor, weapons, munitions, food/drink, stims (if you have medic), and spices (if you're a FIEND!!) at least.The next mostimportant thing to do is to make sure that your toolbars and macros are setupthe way you likethem. This isimperative in preventing you from kicking your own ass should you die as a result of lack of preparation.
Next thing to do is to set your clone data at a nearby cloning center. You will want to set clone data previous to PvPing to ensure that you don't pick up any unnecessary wounds and battle fatigue.
All set? Good. Now lets lookat whatus Commandosare capable of, starting with defense....
You will quickly learn that there isn't much defense within the profession. At best, your melee and ranged defense will not exceed 50. Aside from that, the only other defense you get is specifically against knockdowns, but only a measly 5 points. In the current state of PvP, you have two ways to deal with this. You can either dabble in other professions to boost defensive skills or you can train a profession with a either a dizzying or spammable knockdown(read: TKM / Carbineer). And there's no such thing as overkill if one wants to do both. But until they 'fix' it, those are your two ways of dealing with the lackluster defense within this profession. I went the dabbling only route. To give you an example of what is possible on that path, here's what I did:
Master Commando
4000 Fencer
0004 Teras Kasi
0104 Rifleman
The focus of such a layout is directed purely at boosting front line defense (melee & ranged defense). The skills trained bring my ranged defense up to 171 and my melee defense up to 203. BE clothing further boosts melee defense up to 216. With that much defense, Ican be a pain in ass to bring down, particularly when there's a doc in the team.
...yes, I know how to cut cookies.
Your best defensive tactic is that of using line of sight. Speaking in terms of abilities or commands, there isn't much a player can do defensively. You can tumble, but I wouldn't bother as doing so prohibits you from executing special attacks. You can /takecover, but immobility unlocks the door for death to come through and the defensive boosts gained by taking cover do not justify the penalty of immobility. The core of all defense starts with learning to play line of sight properly. Also, know that when you break someone's line of sight to you, it clears their combat queue.
...and you will find much amusement in learning what line of sight means in this game.
Offensively, you will learn that the only effective weapon within the profession itself (assuming you have no pistoleer skillsto increase effectiveness with thelag pistol) isthe flamethrower and that it is mostaccurate when you shove it up a target's nose and spray it at point blank range. However, rocket launchers and heavy particle beam cannons can be surprising in PvP. They can produce wicked results when used right and totally open you up for death when used wrong. This is because both are heavy armor piercing weaponsthat bring you toscreeching halt whenever used so that theanimation can play out. Best time to use them iswhen there are no red dots within 40m ofyou and the selected target is still about 50m from you. Worst time to use them iswhenthe target has you in their attack range (64m or closer) and is charging your way. 48m is the ideal range for both of these, however, the rocket launcher maintains its accuracy bonus all the way out to max.
Also,area effect weapons and attacksrequire that all targets in the blast radius or cone be in combat mode before damage is actually inflicted on them. If a target in the blast radius or cone of an area attack is not in combat mode, they do not suffer damage should that attack be successful. If the attack has secondary effects (dizzy, DoT, etc..), those are applied; it is only the damage that is not.
Grenades? Don't bother. Acid rifle? Don't bother. Both are broken and need fixing.
The Aim command can be of great importance when encountering someone with defense like me. I've not seen any increase in the to-hit chancewhen stacking them (which you can see to the left of the HAM bars above your target's head), but then again, I hardly miss when I do. But note that using the Aim command will stop your motion for a second while the animation for the command plays out. Kneeling also helps accuracy, butit can be adangerous thing to do. Onlyconsider kneelingwhen you aren't being attacked.
Intimidation is evil. Learn to use it. What does it do? It makes people easier to hit, makes them unable to dodge, counter, or block, and lowers their damage output some. BE clothing can help here too. Considering what it does, this should indeed be the first thing you do to your target. You will find that you will NEEDtouse it when facing mod stackers like myself if you want to see any of your /flamecone2's land. To ensure that itexecutes properlyon the first try, youwill want to /attack the target first and then /intimidate. If you try to /intimidate a target without first starting combat, you will find that starting combat is all that will do. The range on intimidate is pretty far (I wanna say 30m, but I'm not completely sure).
Warcry is iffy. When it lands, it is a wicked 10 second delay. When it fails, it is nothing but a waste of HAM and a delay in motion. BE clothing that helps intimidate usually also helps warcry. Warcry likes its victims intimidated, therefore, it is recommended that you refrain from using warcry unless the target is intimidated.
Blindand stun are very helpful. As Commandos, you do have to train some unarmed skills and these are two of the abilities you get from that training. It is highly suggested that one train at least Novice TK to get the vibroknucker certification and the insane bonuses in that box to help these abilities. Blind lowers target accuracy and prohibits posture changes, stun lowers substats and speed. Of course, you need to be in melee range to do this.
Tactically, knowing what the enemy is capable of is key. Your best reference is the skill tree. Study it. Know it. Know your enemies strengths and weakness and use it against them. Your next best reference is a weaponsmith's vendor. Study the weapons. Study the to-hit bonuses and know the ideal range of the weapons used by your enemy. Knowing this will enlighten you as to what distance to keep the enemy at and doing so will enhance your chances of avoiding incoming attacks.
Beware the crap weapons. A highly-experimented HPBC or HRL, made by someone who knows their stuff, is an unimaginably better weapon than the majority of them out on the market. Granted, since mostly these are used for anti-turret work, there's not a lot of motive on the Weaponsmith's part to make them do anything but damage, and they'll use whatever crap they can lay their hands on to make them.
But a high quality, expert-crafted HPBC can be a tool of immense power and destructive capability. HRLs are even more impressive, because their optimum range extends a little...
A thought when using these weapons: Shoot the Bounty Hunter first. He has no defense ratings, and your accuracy can compensate for the fact he's moving, if he is. After him, the combat medic, the doctor - all of the people who can't get stacked defenses. In a big fight you can annihilate the majority of the enemy's support personnel in just a few shots - especially if they're bunched up close together. And without their Doctor, an enemy group is going to be in a world of hurt...
heavy weapons are useful for another thing... vehicle destruction. i have yet to miss a moving vehicle with a HW. nothing is better than having a taunting rebel try and kite you with their vehicle and you pop a HPBC right into their afterburner *BOOM!!!!!* of course than you have an angry rebel chasing you around... but even if you lose, the rebel is short a vehicle and has to hoof it until he gets to town.
OK this is cool. We got gear and personel to target in there anything else?
This is not imperial only, you Rebels out there feel free to speak up. This is for all commandos.
Spice Spice and more Spice!
These can be your best friends in pvp battle (you can't stay doc buffed all the time). If u walk around overt alot then many times u don't have enough time to size up your enemy, so i keep Moun and Nuetron in my toolbar at all times. When i get attacked i keep my eye on my HAM if my opponent is laying into my Health or Action i immediatly hit the nuetron, Mind i hit Moun since we are for the most part much slower than other professions it is imperative we stay alive long enough to deal out damg.
Rocket Launchers are quite possible our best weapon at Master level. Most decent PvP opponents are gonna stay out of your flame range so be ready to lay into him with the RL. A RL will take out a buffed opponent in 2-5 hits and at master u can fire pretty fast with a well sliced RL.
Flame throwers are good in pvp also but don't forget to hit burstrun at the bginning of the battle so u can run within range Flame Dot and run out of range, after my inetial flame dot i reley heavily on overcharge shot. A well landed overcharge shot can hit for almost as much as a RL can, and as long as u have a good speed slice on your FT the delay isn't that bad.
just from browsing your guide, shows glaring flaws with commandos
Consider this: as a hybrid proffession..where as we need more pre-reqs and generally should be overally more specialized (in terms of more distinct role and/or type of combat) and/or better in combat (but not unbeatable..which..encourages group fighting..which the devs always want...when a mid lvl pistoleer can beat a master commando..something wrong...that doesnt inspire grouping)
Anyways, where: Ok got a problem..in BOTH melee and ranged proffessions (ideally marked as brawling and marksman)...that shows our problems
I used grenades sometimes, but very rarely. The idea that you are immobile while you pitch it and the fact that they miss alot is just not worth the result, even if it is a one hit incap.
I'm switching to this for my commando:
Master Commando
Smuggler 0040
Pistoleer 0344
The LP isn't the most powerful weapon, but with smugglers panic shot and low blow you can kite the TK's and Fencers well enough. Slap a few bleeds on them and then let them give chase. I know its a drawn out fight, but in good armour you can out damage them given that you don't slip up. My favorite macro with the LP is this:
/panicshot;
/healthshot1;
/healthshot2;
/fanshot;
/stoppingshot;
Usually after that combo my action pool is almost drained, but one good heal brings it back up. I like to mix in lowblow for other commandos and then run up and set them afire. Nothing more gratifying than torching other commandos and also BH's burn quit nicely. Seeing as how neither of us get any good defense mods.
StarNick wrote:
just from browsing your guide, shows glaring flaws with commandos
Consider this: as a hybrid proffession..where as we need more pre-reqs and generally should be overally more specialized (in terms of more distinct role and/or type of combat) and/or better in combat (but not unbeatable..which..encourages group fighting..which the devs always want...when a mid lvl pistoleer can beat a master commando..something wrong...that doesnt inspire grouping)
Anyways, where: Ok got a problem..in BOTH melee and ranged proffessions (ideally marked as brawling and marksman)...that shows our problems
Yeah we know starnick. We are just working on a guide to try to best help the commandos figure out what to do to combat our weaknesses. Pretty much how to deal with what we got.
And yes, I use OC2 with the FT from time to time. Wears your FT down faster but FTs are normally cheaper than RLs