Combat Medic Archive
Thread: Doc vs CM- Area heals and general issues
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Brainplay
Sat Jul 31, 2004 2:03 am
#1
/agree on most of that
Doctors have always been based in M.A.S.H units, hospitals, and other behind the battleline locations but never ever in combat. Doctors should be the "bio-engineers" of the medical professions. They should be the ones who craft awesome stim components, poison/disease packs, cure packs, and the best point blank heals. They should be the ones who can cure an entire black barred HAM pool with a single shot.
Instead Doctors have become the real combat medics. Now they have the most combat medical support and non-combat support abilities. The only thing they lack is ranged healing and mind heal and both of those are rarely used in PvE and even more rarely used in PvP. Every combat class is absolutely positively dependent on doctors now. There is no exception to that statement. No other combat class has ever had a "counter" yet now doctors are the "counter" to Combat Medics instead of various professions having some form of "counter/defense" to apply to others (at least squad leaders had the ability to group cure some states).
There was supposed to be interdependency between the classes yet the doctor profession hands down is completely self sufficient. Heck they dont even have to have a combat medic craft dispersal mechanisms when rancor drop bile so often which also gives a large amount of charges to each cure and innoculation. 
I am no longer a Combat Medic. I'm a Master Medic with range heals and expensive yet now worthless poisons and diseases. I have a hard time competing against a novice medic with stimB's unless theyfeel like beingthe "dedicated" healer in the group if we decide to do any high level content. My poisons are useful against npc's with heavy armor and high resists vs all damage types. That narrows it down to Krayt, GDK, Peko Albatross..........thats about it since everything on dathomir has a low resist vs. kinetic or energy and blast.
My master level crafted packs can even be negated by a simple innoculation A pack. That my friends is a serious kick in the nads and slap in the face.If what they have on the test server goes live (which frequently does without changes) the Combat Medic profession will finally go the way of the creature handler and be nerfed into oblivion. 
Dyvim1674
Sat Jul 31, 2004 12:57 pm
#2
The Lowdown:
(Forgive my sloppy typing... silly laptops)
Doctors should not be battlefield professionals.
My image of a doctor is the guy who sits in the med center or where-ever tending to battlestricken patients and enhancing the fighters pre-fight. Unfortunatly SOE's image was slightly consistant with that, except they implimented a "Field Doctor" line of the profession, which gave them their PvP skills, and gave doctor a chance to grow as a PvP template.
Currently, Combat medics serve as the Field doctors, keeping opponents at bay with poision/diease, mass healing and range healing, ability to heal mind, dragging etc.. Ability to heal poisions/diease is most effective during COMBAT, as is ability to heal states and fire.
My Theory:
Doctor- Remove the poision/diease/fire/state heal ability from doctor, BUT, keep the ability to craft these heal packs in the doctor crafting tree, making the 2 profession semi-codependent on eachother
CM- Move the ability to heal states/poision/diease/fire into the combat medic speed line, and move the title of Field Doctor from Doc speed line to CM speed line (for the sake of consistancy)
With the new inocculents, CMs will not be the offensive force they used to be, and it will give them an oppurtunity to become that support class they're supposed to be.
Flame me, pick apart this post, whatever. I'm actually looking for comments to possibly revise this and try to get it out there as a possible concept....
neutrineaux
Sat Jul 31, 2004 2:52 pm
#3
Brainplay wrote:
/agree on most of that
Doctors have always been based in M.A.S.H units, hospitals, and other behind the battleline locations but never ever in combat. Doctors should be the "bio-engineers" of the medical professions. They should be the ones who craft awesome stim components, poison/disease packs, cure packs, and the best point blank heals. They should be the ones who can cure an entire black barred HAM pool with a single shot.
Instead Doctors have become the real combat medics. Now they have the most combat medical support and non-combat support abilities. The only thing they lack is ranged healing and mind heal and both of those are rarely used in PvE and even more rarely used in PvP. Every combat class is absolutely positively dependent on doctors now. There is no exception to that statement. No other combat class has ever had a "counter" yet now doctors are the "counter" to Combat Medics instead of various professions having some form of "counter/defense" to apply to others (at least squad leaders had the ability to group cure some states).
There was supposed to be interdependency between the classes yet the doctor profession hands down is completely self sufficient. Heck they dont even have to have a combat medic craft dispersal mechanisms when rancor drop bile so often which also gives a large amount of charges to each cure and innoculation.
I am no longer a Combat Medic. I'm a Master Medic with range heals and expensive yet now worthless poisons and diseases. I have a hard time competing against a novice medic with stimB's unless theyfeel like beingthe "dedicated" healer in the group if we decide to do any high level content. My poisons are useful against npc's with heavy armor and high resists vs all damage types. That narrows it down to Krayt, GDK, Peko Albatross..........thats about it since everything on dathomir has a low resist vs. kinetic or energy and blast.
My master level crafted packs can even be negated by a simple innoculation A pack. That my friends is a serious kick in the nads and slap in the face.If what they have on the test server goes live (which frequently does without changes) the Combat Medic profession will finally go the way of the creature handler and be nerfed into oblivion.
yep
Anti-Thug
Sat Jul 31, 2004 3:30 pm
#4
exactly...what the devs hinted at fanfest was that this would be coming but that we would be THE ONLY option in PvP healing....it looks like they got it half right
Brainplay wrote:
/agree on most of that
I am no longer a Combat Medic. I'm a Master Medic with range heals and expensive yet now worthless poisons and diseases. I have a hard time competing against a novice medic with stimB's unless theyfeel like beingthe "dedicated" healer in the group if we decide to do any high level content. My poisons are useful against npc's with heavy armor and high resists vs all damage types. That narrows it down to Krayt, GDK, Peko Albatross..........thats about it since everything on dathomir has a low resist vs. kinetic or energy and blast.
My master level crafted packs can even be negated by a simple innoculation A pack. That my friends is a serious kick in the nads and slap in the face.If what they have on the test server goes live (which frequently does without changes) the Combat Medic profession will finally go the way of the creature handler and be nerfed into oblivion.
SecretFire
Sat Jul 31, 2004 4:23 pm
#5
Dyvim1674 wrote:
The Lowdown:
(Forgive my sloppy typing... silly laptops)
Doctors should not be battlefield professionals.
My image of a doctor is the guy who sits in the med center or where-ever tending to battlestricken patients and enhancing the fighters pre-fight. Unfortunatly SOE's image was slightly consistant with that, except they implimented a "Field Doctor" line of the profession, which gave them their PvP skills, and gave doctor a chance to grow as a PvP template.
Currently, Combat medics serve as the Field doctors, keeping opponents at bay with poision/diease, mass healing and range healing, ability to heal mind, dragging etc.. Ability to heal poisions/diease is most effective during COMBAT, as is ability to heal states and fire.
My Theory:
Doctor- Remove the poision/diease/fire/state heal ability from doctor, BUT, keep the ability to craft these heal packs in the doctor crafting tree, making the 2 profession semi-codependent on eachother
CM- Move the ability to heal states/poision/diease/fire into the combat medic speed line, and move the title of Field Doctor from Doc speed line to CM speed line (for the sake of consistancy)
With the new inocculents, CMs will not be the offensive force they used to be, and it will give them an oppurtunity to become that support class they're supposed to be.
Flame me, pick apart this post, whatever. I'm actually looking for comments to possibly revise this and try to get it out there as a possible concept....
You left out rezing I think.
I've thought about this awhile and I've came to a few conclusions of my own. I've been a CM longer than I've been a doctor, CM will always be my favorite profession because of the vision I had concerning my CM. I liked the thought of being underfire and running across the battlefield to offer aid to somebody, firing at any enemies that approached inbetween of helping the injured. To me, that's the heart of being a CM and it's *edit* fun too. My doctor is more of a CM than my CM is. Isn't that just sad?
My CM moves faster, due in part to her 70 ter neg and she has range and area heals. She does use /mindheal to help time to time as well but it ruins her for battle and if she's not careful it can incap her. But things like rezing, putting out fires, healing states, curing disease and poison is what my doctor does in addition to healing. She does this ON THE FIELD. Maybe all of this time we should have been screaming at the devs to give us healing states, putting out fires and cuing poison and disease.
The more I think about it, the more I can see CM has been a broken profession from day one. The more I look back the more I see docs getting all the "love" and CMs getting nothing, making me even more disgusted.
As for the buffs, that's a doctor thing in my eyes. It would have been nice for cms to get the new resist buff to make some cash, but that's about it.
Farcaster007
Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:09 pm
#6
I have to disagree with the sentiment that Docs aren't battlefield professionals. Firstly, when was the last time anyone dropped dead in a medcenter and needed a rez? Secondly, Doctors have all the premier healing abilities, and on the battlefield, ask the nearest CM for a cure disease or poisonand see what response you receive. The only advantages a CM has is the area and ranged healing abilities, and frankly, I doubt half the CM's that play actually carry area stims, as most are too busy flinging microbes around to bother healing people.
This upcoming "fix" will put CM's right where they belong. A support profession, not the be-all and end-all of PvP. I find it hilarious that CM's are already packing it up, thinking their poisons and diseases are now "useless", when actually, all that's been done is to put this unrealistically overpowered ability in the realm of other professions.
Ekatha Jes, MD
Dyvim1674
Sat Jul 31, 2004 7:10 pm
#7
Ahh... but rezzing is done out of combat. The reliance of buffs and the 60 second wozzy timer means that you can't get rezzed, be vulnerable for those 60 seconds and then hop right back into combat, espeically considering droids can not be pulled during combat, and if they get hit with anything area they go flying off. Just shooting for a little real-world consistancy
Farcaster007
Sat Jul 31, 2004 7:25 pm
#8
I've done quite a bit of PvP, and 95% of the rezzes I've done were performed in the middle of a battle.Dragging some corpse around a corner, doing a peace and then a rez is not possible in battle? Granted, the patient isn't in any condition to fight for a short time, but me? I'm right back into the fray. After all, I'm not just a Doc.
Ekatha giveth, and he taketh away...
Farcaster007
Sat Jul 31, 2004 7:34 pm
#9
BTW, I totally disagree with your conclusion that Doctors are self-sufficient. I rely on quite a few other professions to do my job to it's greatest potential:
1) Scouts/Rangers - Sorry, but I'm a Doc, not a hunter.
2) Droid Engineers - Me? Buff in a Medcenter? Pfffft!
3) Chefs - Bivoli good! Fire bad!
4) Tailor - I don't dress like thisfor no reason!
5) BE - "All my skill is in my pants"
6) Artisan/Architect - Havs, harvs and more harvs.
7) Every combat class in the game- Ahh, my loyal customers!!!!
Ekatha Jes, MD/MS
Dyvim1674
Sat Jul 31, 2004 7:44 pm
#10
Farcaster007 wrote:
BTW, I totally disagree with your conclusion that Doctors are self-sufficient. I rely on quite a few other professions to do my job to it's greatest potential:
1) Scouts/Rangers - Sorry, but I'm a Doc, not a hunter.
2) Droid Engineers - Me? Buff in a Medcenter? Pfffft!
3) Chefs - Bivoli good! Fire bad!
4) Tailor - I don't dress like thisfor no reason!
5) BE - "All my skill is in my pants"
6) Artisan/Architect - Havs, harvs and more harvs.
7) Every combat class in the game- Ahh, my loyal customers!!!!
Ekatha Jes, MD/MS
I'm not oblivious to that, but please quote and highlight where I said "Doctors are self-sufficent classes"
Dyvim1674
Sat Jul 31, 2004 8:12 pm
#11
Farcaster007 wrote:
I've done quite a bit of PvP, and 95% of the rezzes I've done were performed in the middle of a battle.Dragging some corpse around a corner, doing a peace and then a rez is not possible in battle? Granted, the patient isn't in any condition to fight for a short time, but me? I'm right back into the fray. After all, I'm not just a Doc.
Ekatha giveth, and he taketh away...
The point is rezzing is not done during combat... while aggro'ed might have been a better term. I personally don't think any of the Droid/camp/medcenter required actions should be able to be performed whilst aggro'ed, a different issue though.
What you mention there is pretty much the extent of what docs should be able to do in encouters like that, that and heal. If they have something like swordsman as well then that's what they should be doing in PvP/PvE, but a majority of their doctor actions should be performed out of combat
Farcaster007
Sat Jul 31, 2004 9:31 pm
#12
Perhaps you don't PvP, and don't understand how fluid and dynamic it can get. There are plenty of Docs out there in the GCW, now more than everand for good reason. Having skills such as removing bleeds, dizziness, intimidation, stun and blindness,curingyour insane poisons and diseases, healing massive damage and wounds, REZZING, dragging playersand dousing flames areessentialDURING battle,not afterwards.
I'm also a Master Swordsman, and havebeen MasterPistoleer, Pikeman and TKA, and I'll tell you, Doctors are capable warriors. Combat Medics WERE a broken class from the beginning. Ultimately, because the Devs allowed it, many of you took advantage of a broken class and eventuallydestroyed PvP. As a Doc, I was doing always amazed how such an overpowered class was permitted to exist, alone among classes in the ability to decimate dozens, single-handedly, and then made stronger, publish after publish.
Until of course the Devs heard the cry of the dedicated players who ground their way toJedi, only to get creamed by a medic.
Let the Nerfing commence.
Ekatha, Janta Hunter
neutrineaux
Sat Jul 31, 2004 10:03 pm
#13
Farcaster007 wrote:
Perhaps you don't PvP, and don't understand how fluid and dynamic it can get. There are plenty of Docs out there in the GCW, now more than everand for good reason. Having skills such as removing bleeds, dizziness, intimidation, stun and blindness,curingyour insane poisons and diseases, healing massive damage and wounds, REZZING, dragging playersand dousing flames areessentialDURING battle,not afterwards.
I'm also a Master Swordsman, and havebeen MasterPistoleer, Pikeman and TKA, and I'll tell you, Doctors are capable warriors. Combat Medics WERE a broken class from the beginning. Ultimately, because the Devs allowed it, many of you took advantage of a broken class and eventuallydestroyed PvP. As a Doc, I was doing always amazed how such an overpowered class was permitted to exist, alone among classes in the ability to decimate dozens, single-handedly, and then made stronger, publish after publish.
Until of course the Devs heard the cry of the dedicated players who ground their way toJedi, only to get creamed by a medic.
Let the Nerfing commence.
Ekatha, Janta Hunter
yeah, nice to get support from the next guys in the nerf line. you will be singing a different tune if the buff nerf happens. but i will actually be sympathetic to the docs when they are suddenly not "it." too bad you can't see past your own self-righteous nose
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