Combat Medic Archive
Thread: Healing yourself needs to be balanced
Well then... nerf player damage against healers. 
Picking up healing means sacrificing something else for the ability to heal. And the ability to damage regens a whole lot faster than the ability to heal.
StormTroopercpt0 wrote:
No balance needed, We choose Healing over Defense Thats our weakness no defense.
Thats actually not true. Combat Medics and Doctors get 100 melee and ranged defence along with the certification to wear Battle armor with resists up to 6000.
On the other hand, a Jedi Master Healer gets absolutely zero melee or ranged defence. They also only have 2000 armor and less healing capability than a Master Doctor or Master Combat Medic.
fletcherreed wrote:
Nerf this and because you nerfed this you also gotta nerf that....... and also this and while youre at it dont forget to nerf that............
fletcherreed wrote:
Its just too powerful right now for any profession... Its practically required for any type of PvP. The point of the CU was to make almost any template viable but if you don't have a good 25 sp invested in medic, or a dedicated group healer unless you are soloyou are screwed. The intention with CM and Doc were to be support professions. Especially with CM, they have debuffs to go along with the 1200 healing. Yes, they were intended to support groups and groups put out more DPS than a single player. This was intended to encourage grouping more and soloing less. This cannot be applied to the BH/Jedi mini-game though.
What I suggest is to beaf up player to player healing and nerf the player healing himself. Since BH and jedi cannot be supported by other players, jedi healing needs to takea hit too.Either increase mind costs or nerf the amount of healing. To have one or two professions ABSOLUTELY necessary in one's template toPvP is insane. Actually, you dont need a profession in one's template to PvP and many go without it. What they do have is good support elements. The BH/Jedi interaction is only exception to this and I can't honestly think of a way to fix it without doing more damage to every other aspect of group healers. With healing hate issue a mind cost increase would cause a major PvE issue (heck we've already got one). Nerfing the amount of healing affects both group PvE and PvP. As a dedicated group healer for both of those I can relate to you that the MIND bar gets drain REALLY fast when you have to tend to 7 players and yourself in heated combat.
JaymzRiken wrote:
really? where's my 3k heal while on my back?
While you cannot heal on your back, you get multiple heals on different timers and can heal more damage with better efficiency (mind cost) than Jedi healers.
The only way to get 3K heals as a Jedi is with Master Healer, which takes up 113 skill points and grants you only 2000 armor and zero melee/ranged defence mods. It also costs alot of Force and mind.
A Pikeman/Swordsman is supposed to be as close to equal as a Rifleman/Combat Medic in terms of who should be winning in a stand off. It is clear to everyone that this is not even close to being the case and this is why healing needs sorting out. The same principle applies to the Jedi skills. Any Jedi without healing is toast. The game is all about your healing power and efficiency now, this is what determines the outcome of 90% of encounters.
This is what needs to change. Healing is supposed to be a support role and currently it adds unparralleled power to a template, unbalancing the system.
I really wish people would look at the larger picture and factor in the intent of combat upgrade instead of being argumentative and offer no substance to their arguments.
da-bro wrote:
StormTroopercpt0 wrote:
No balance needed, We choose Healing over Defense Thats our weakness no defense.
Thats actually not true. Combat Medics and Doctors get 100 melee and ranged defence along with the certification to wear Battle armor with resists up to 6000. Actually its +75. But its not defense we lack but rather offense as our debuffs and DoT's dont increase the potential DPS as double combat professions.
On the other hand, a Jedi Master Healer gets absolutely zero melee or ranged defence. They also only have 2000 armor and less healing capability than a Master Doctor or Master Combat Medic. The also have the points to pick up Master Defender, two trees of lightsaber, and 2 boxes of enhancer (channel) which give them equal offense, superior defense than any profession could hope for and still have more attack speed than an MCM/MRifles, and the ability to regen their force quickly. Heck, even with just 2 boxes ofdefender you have superior defenses.
I'm not sure if you're a master healer or just getting your info from rumor but a Master Jedi Healer has more healing power and better debuffs than a combined MCM/MDoctor combined. I drool everytime I see force complete heal and its associated minimal costs. Force Sap is incredible even if it isn't working fully (talk with the devs about that one).
Go back to your forums Jedi. If you want to get a profession nerfed go ask the devs to re-instate master scout as a required profession for BH or something and leave us alone.
da-bro wrote:
JaymzRiken wrote:
really? where's my 3k heal while on my back?
While you cannot heal on your back, you get multiple heals on different timers and can heal more damage with better efficiency (mind cost) than Jedi healers. That is false. Oh and you get a single ranged and a single heal over time. We get a single ranged, an area, and a single point blank that is about to get majorlynerfed if you haven't heard.
The only way to get 3K heals as a Jedi is with Master Healer, which takes up 113 skill points and grants you only 2000 armor and zero melee/ranged defence mods. It also costs alot of Force and mind. Compared to? Thats false.
A Pikeman/Swordsman is supposed to be as close to equal as a Rifleman/Combat Medic in terms of who should be winning in a stand off. It is clear to everyone that this is not even close to being the case and this is why healing needs sorting out. That is incorrect. A pikeman/swordsman should have abilities tailored to damage output and tanking ability and are balanced out as to abilities and damage granted to an MCM/Rifleman but not against each other but rather in a parallel setting (in a group). Template balance isnot based off of single combat comparisons.
The same principle applies to the Jedi skills. Any Jedi without healing is toast. The game is all about your healing power and efficiency now, this is what determines the outcome of 90% of encounters. This only applies to Jedi when engaged in the BH/Jedi mini-game. This is a symptom of GTEF from the pre-CU days when the solution was to make it a 1vs.1 setting. Jedi are still able to be supported in all other forms of PvPor PvE by master non-jedi healers. In those cases healing is helpful but not necessary when the appropriatesupport is brought.
This is what needs to change. Healing is supposed to be a support role and currently it adds unparralleled power to a template, unbalancing the system. It IS a support role! When applied to the healer himself or just directly to another it works as a force multiplier. In group PvP is a healer supposed to take an extra MIND hit or damage reduction when the same amount of healing to a different group member does not? That doesn't make sense. The only time it does make sense is when it is applied to a 1vs.1 setting.
I really wish people would look at the larger picture and factor in the intent of combat upgrade instead of being argumentative and offer no substance to their arguments. Yeah I do too
Message Edited by Brainplay on 07-31-2005 08:59 PM
While I have used Jedi Healer in some examples, this has nothing to do with my points and the udnerlying issue of healing in the game as things stand. Please try to absorb this fact before trying to make up false motives as to why I am posting.
To make this as simple as possible and to make as clear as humanly possible what my comments are in reference to, pay close attention to the following sentances.
It is the intention of the combat upgrade to make the game as balanced as possible, with no template being stronger or weaker than any other.
All you have to do is is pick any 2 possible combat template builds and pit them against each other in a one on one scenario to discover if there are any glaring imbalances.
Take any build you want, that does not have any Medic, Doctor or Combat Medic skills in the template. Now fight someone who has any degree of healing, could be Medic 0020, Combat Medic 4000 or a MAster Doctor build, it doesn't matter. 99% of the time, the build with Medic in the template will win.
This highlights something which can be viewed in 2 ways:
1. Healing is overpowered when used on yourself.
2. Templates that don't include Medic, don't have access to abilities good enough to make up for it.
In either case, the issue is the same and there are also 2 ways to fix this issue:
1. Do something about using heals on yourself. Reduced effectiveness, or increased cool down timers for a few examples.
2. Completely change the structure and abilities of every combat profession except for Doctor, Combat Medic and Medic.
Now which is the best option? Number 1 of course because its less work and achieves exactly the same result as number 2, because they are both tackling the same issue, just from the opposite side.
I will instantly call anyone who thinks any combat template build that does not include any Medic in it, or any combat template that has less healing power/efficiency than another are equal, a liar.
An overwhelming majority of fights are decided solely on who has the most powerful and efficient healing and this is what is unbalancing. Healing has a far too heavy influence on the outcome of a duel between any 2 combat templates.
Now, to further illustrate my intent and rationale, take note of the following.
All of the above rings true with Jedi too. Jedi healing also needs to be subject to diminished effectiveness when used on yourself. No amount of skills can make up for not having healing in your template and for balance to be achieved, healing needs not be a required skill.
I rest my case.
Now for the ugly part of my post:
1. Nowhere does it say you can only post on the forums related to your characters skills. If I have an opinion or thoughts on an issue I would like to become involved in, I am freely welcome to do so.
Bacta Shot = ~ 1800 / 6 = 300dps
Geez not another one of these stupid threads. I'm gonna nerf yO mama.