Carbineer Archive
Thread: Its official: The class has died and now the carbineer board is dead
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shadowist
Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:35 pm
#1
Man I hardly ever see new posts here since the patch. Carbineer is the worst of the worst.
Phazorn
Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:37 pm
#2
sad but true... the chef revamp even supercharged the rifleman prof
shadowist
Mon Feb 16, 2004 10:47 pm
#3
I think it's evident that everyone is dropping this class or losing all interest in it
Vevy
Tue Feb 17, 2004 12:06 am
#4
OMG are you nuts???
We FINALLY got some love and you're upset? I just come back after a 4 month break and I see we got out counterattack upped which now means 1 out of every 3 attacks or so we dodge...plus we now have doc buffs, entertainer buffs, and a new chef food and drink that we can stack and get +1600 to our focus/willpower
...umm I don't know about you but I've broke out the 500+ max dam laser carb with the adv stock and adv scope and I'm cranking out the CS love on everything that crosses my sights, evenwith a 100/100/100 ham weapon...and my bars never see white.
Granted it would be nice to get some OF OUR FRIGGIN SPECIALS FIXED YOU CRACKHEAD DEVS!!!
STOP PUTTING IN NEW CONTENT UNTIL YOU FIX WHAT'S ALREADY OUT!!!
...but now that's off my chest, I'm much happier with the class than 4 months ago.
Pandaboy
Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:28 am
#5
Me too 
I love being carbineer. Gonna be even nicer once I get a hold of some nice scopes and stocks from the emperors retreat and get a WS to make a super uber carbine
This is my 100th post, been looking for over an hour where to put it
TheFUna
Tue Feb 17, 2004 8:13 am
#6
Carbineer isn't dead...its dead for those who don't know how to play it.
That said it isn't the mind-hitting powerhouse of Rifleman and its not an "uber" PvP class. Carbineer is a viable combat profession.
I gave up Master Bounty Hunter shortly before Patch 6 because it became painfully obvious that prof isn't getting the love it truly needs. It has no ranged defenses or state effect defenses at all. We, Carbineers, at least get a few state effect defenses.
Additionally BH's are completely broken when it comes to doing their job of Jedi Population Control. The droids don't work.
Carbineers point to the low ranged defenses we have a lot and complain but do you realize that our primary defense is COUNTERATTACK, not ranged defense. Do you understand how counterattack works? ON a successful counterattack you get to make an UNDODGEABLE, UNDEFENDABLE counterattack on your opponent in addition to making their initial attack MISS! You get not only the dodge, but a free hit. This works against both ranged and melee attacks but to get the full effect of you must be a master carbineer.
The strength of the carbineer was summed up by another poster when he said, "Our strengths are not in our defenses but in our ability to remove our opponents capability to attack." By dizzying, blinding, stunning, knocking them down while dodging and counterattacking...we take away our enemies' ability to injure us.
There really are two main problems with Carbineers that need to be addressed:
1) Dizzy attacks broken. These need to be fixed to take advantage of our knockdown. IMO it was irresponsible of SOE to nerf ChargeShot1 without fixing the dizzy. Knocking a target down now is pointless since it gets right back up with no chance to get in a shot or two. As a Master Bounty Hunter this was one of the biggest strongpoints of the carbine line and lead me back to carbineer since the DH17 Short Carbine and Laser Carbine became my primary weapons.
2) HAM Costs. They're ridiculous. But until its fixed use the new food buffs if you can't get a doc buff to counterbalance the problem. Also a smart stat migration to boost Strength, Quickness and Focus to maximum will go a long way to compensate the HAM costs. Oh and don't forget to take off your damn armor when you don't need it. Too many people fight fully armored against creatures and enemies that don't necessitate it.
Carbineer isn't horribly broken. Its got bugs to be sure but its not useless. It is the least popular ranged combat profession.......but maybe that's a good thing in the long run.
That said it isn't the mind-hitting powerhouse of Rifleman and its not an "uber" PvP class. Carbineer is a viable combat profession.
I gave up Master Bounty Hunter shortly before Patch 6 because it became painfully obvious that prof isn't getting the love it truly needs. It has no ranged defenses or state effect defenses at all. We, Carbineers, at least get a few state effect defenses.
Additionally BH's are completely broken when it comes to doing their job of Jedi Population Control. The droids don't work.
Carbineers point to the low ranged defenses we have a lot and complain but do you realize that our primary defense is COUNTERATTACK, not ranged defense. Do you understand how counterattack works? ON a successful counterattack you get to make an UNDODGEABLE, UNDEFENDABLE counterattack on your opponent in addition to making their initial attack MISS! You get not only the dodge, but a free hit. This works against both ranged and melee attacks but to get the full effect of you must be a master carbineer.
The strength of the carbineer was summed up by another poster when he said, "Our strengths are not in our defenses but in our ability to remove our opponents capability to attack." By dizzying, blinding, stunning, knocking them down while dodging and counterattacking...we take away our enemies' ability to injure us.
There really are two main problems with Carbineers that need to be addressed:
1) Dizzy attacks broken. These need to be fixed to take advantage of our knockdown. IMO it was irresponsible of SOE to nerf ChargeShot1 without fixing the dizzy. Knocking a target down now is pointless since it gets right back up with no chance to get in a shot or two. As a Master Bounty Hunter this was one of the biggest strongpoints of the carbine line and lead me back to carbineer since the DH17 Short Carbine and Laser Carbine became my primary weapons.
2) HAM Costs. They're ridiculous. But until its fixed use the new food buffs if you can't get a doc buff to counterbalance the problem. Also a smart stat migration to boost Strength, Quickness and Focus to maximum will go a long way to compensate the HAM costs. Oh and don't forget to take off your damn armor when you don't need it. Too many people fight fully armored against creatures and enemies that don't necessitate it.
Carbineer isn't horribly broken. Its got bugs to be sure but its not useless. It is the least popular ranged combat profession.......but maybe that's a good thing in the long run.
Message Edited by TheFUna on 02-17-2004 10:44 AM
Ayami-Ayami
Tue Feb 17, 2004 8:18 am
#7
it si sad to see so many carbineers leave, but i'm here to saty, i'm taking this thing to master even if it kills me(which it will, over and over and over again)
sumner
Tue Feb 17, 2004 8:32 am
#8
I too am sad to see the exodus, but I'm here to stay (if you cansider a carbine heavy dabbler one of your own) I was doing BH, and found that I liked the carbines the best so switched to carbineer. I would master it, but I don't want to give up my BH carbine stuff or my ranger tracking. I can't wait until the specials get fixed, and I love the couterattack, especially comming from BH where every shot at you hits! The other thing I love about carbineer (as I stand now +115 acc/ +75 speed) is hunting with my master commando friend is watching the combat log: I hit every shot (well 95 out of 100) and I can rip off almost every special I have at the speed cap! Sure my buddy can hit for 15000 damage but he wont shoot again for 5 to 6 seconds and then it'll probably be a miss! In that time I've laid down at least as much damage with my dh-17 snub or more with my laser! You gotta take the good with the bad, sure I'm not gonna beat that TKA/Swordsman/Pistoleer since nothing can touch him, but I'm gonna give him a good fight too! once the defense stacking is dealt with and our ham costs are fixed you'll see a major influx of people again!
Vevy
Tue Feb 17, 2004 10:12 am
#10
TheFUna wrote:
I gave up Master Bounty Hunter shortly before Patch 6 because it became painfully obvious that prof isn't getting the love it truly needs. It has no ranged defenses or state effect defenses at all. We, Carbineers, at least get a few state effect defenses.
That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. From day 1 BH'swere overpowered and were the top of the food chain and always the primary reply was "we should be, we spend so many SP to get here", as if spending SP on scout should somehow justify combat power. That was a load of crap even back then and the only reason people took BH was because you got more bang for the buck in mods over carbineers.
Few people ever used to take BH to master cause they could just dabble in one tree and outgun a master carbineer everytime. I about fell out of my chair with laughter to hear a BH claim they aren't getting any love when carbineer has been broken from day 1 and now they wanna begrudge us our counterattack mods when it's ALL WE GOT!
Noone here is gonna feel bad for the poor BHs, that prof has had its hayday and it's about time it gets balanced down a little.
shadowist
Tue Feb 17, 2004 11:11 am
#11
I'm sorry but Carbineer is BY FAR the MOST broken combat proffession in the game.
We can't even fight without buffs, all of our specials are broken, we do crap damage, our weapons BLOW.
ANY combat class ca OWNus now.
Message Edited by shadowist on 02-17-2004 01:13 PM
TheFUna
Tue Feb 17, 2004 11:42 am
#12
Carbineer by itself is not a PvP profession.
Additionally you're in FIGHT...you guys don't engage in PvP unbuffed anyway...hell double-buff exploits are a lifestyle in FIGHT so what are you complaining about "can't fight without buffs" for? Also what is a FIGHT member doing with carbineer? You guys live and die by rifle mind damage, Java ION rifles and/or by blackbarring opponents with disease and poison. Carbine's and Pistols are lousy choices for PvP because they do no mind damage.
I'm guessing the only reason you took carbineer was to spam ChargeShot1.
If you're crying like this now I can't wait to see the rivers of tears when defense stacking gets nerfed.
Additionally you're in FIGHT...you guys don't engage in PvP unbuffed anyway...hell double-buff exploits are a lifestyle in FIGHT so what are you complaining about "can't fight without buffs" for? Also what is a FIGHT member doing with carbineer? You guys live and die by rifle mind damage, Java ION rifles and/or by blackbarring opponents with disease and poison. Carbine's and Pistols are lousy choices for PvP because they do no mind damage.
I'm guessing the only reason you took carbineer was to spam ChargeShot1.
If you're crying like this now I can't wait to see the rivers of tears when defense stacking gets nerfed.
TheFUna
Tue Feb 17, 2004 11:59 am
#13
Vevy wrote:
TheFUna wrote:
I gave up Master Bounty Hunter shortly before Patch 6 because it became painfully obvious that prof isn't getting the love it truly needs. It has no ranged defenses or state effect defenses at all. We, Carbineers, at least get a few state effect defenses.That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. From day 1 BH's were overpowered and were the top of the food chain and always the primary reply was "we should be, we spend so many SP to get here", as if spending SP on scout should somehow justify combat power. That was a load of crap even back then and the only reason people took BH was because you got more bang for the buck in mods over carbineers.Few people ever used to take BH to master cause they could just dabble in one tree and outgun a master carbineer everytime. I about fell out of my chair with laughter to hear a BH claim they aren't getting any love when carbineer has been broken from day 1 and now they wanna begrudge us our counterattack mods when it's ALL WE GOT!Noone here is gonna feel bad for the poor BHs, that prof has had its hayday and it's about time it gets balanced down a little.
Nice reading comprehension there...way to take it right off-topic and out of context.
Fact is the love BH needs has almost nothing to do with combat and everything to do with broken droids. Did you miss the point where I said BH was an offensive powerhouse? Guess you did.
Or the part where I mentioned Carbineer and BH complement each other well?
You act like my post was some gripe about the BH profession -- I just wanted to show the points where Carbineer does excel over another profession.
I guess you also missed the part where I discussed the problems with Carbines too.
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