Carbineer Archive
Thread: Sadly, I'm dropping all of my Carbineer skills
TAfirehawk
Wed Sep 08, 2004 1:04 pm
#14
spathotan wrote:
Yea, you did more damage at master than you did at novice 2/0/0/0 is because your using a damage sliced weapon! you just said so yourself.....sooo whats your point? I already know that a damage sliced weapon does more damage than a speed sliced.
And i get 1 stared for somethign dumb.
Actually a Speed Sliced weapon does more DPS than a Damage Sliced one until you hit the Speed Cap.....a fact I detail in the FAQ 
Onohos
Wed Sep 08, 2004 2:26 pm
#15
I've hung in there from Day 1, and it hasn't gotten any better. I'm capped on EXP so it shouldn't be a problem to pick alot of it back up when it's finally worth it. I like tactics over mashing the "I win move" but, when it takes me more than 2 shots to kill a NPC thug (when not using a Laser Carbine) we have a problem. I'm speed capped as well...gotta love them Pre Nerf Ubese Stuff. Yes I'm falling to the Darkside....TKM/Fencer/Swordsman. Little tactics here and there but once I get next to you, it's all over. I hope I don't break my keyboard.....but I'll be back, come Combat Revamp in 2859!
StabMastah
Wed Sep 08, 2004 5:05 pm
#17
Im carbiner 1/0/0/0 and have all the BH carbine boxes. I feel twice as deadly as when I had master carbine and my speed mod is much higher. Plus I still have enough skill points for Master Tk and novice medic.
Sorry your not happy, but I am.
Sorry your not happy, but I am.
Kraftomatic
Wed Sep 08, 2004 5:22 pm
#18
yeah bounty hunter gives +80 Speed to carbine (without any carbineer skills) which is not fair to people who just want to be a carbineer, not a bounty hunter. wish it was the other way around...bounty hunters got +60 and dabbled in carbineer for speed, and carbineers got +80 and could be OK on their own.
StabMastah
Wed Sep 08, 2004 5:28 pm
#19
Yes its fair.
Bh is an elite profession, Carbiner is a basic combat prof.
I just looked at the numbers, decided what I wanted to do in game, and made it happen. Instead of getting master carbine and crying about it hoping for a buff, I went another route.
Bh is an elite profession, Carbiner is a basic combat prof.
I just looked at the numbers, decided what I wanted to do in game, and made it happen. Instead of getting master carbine and crying about it hoping for a buff, I went another route.
Kraftomatic
Wed Sep 08, 2004 5:55 pm
#20
Uh no, Bounty Hunter is a Hybrid Profession, Carbineer is an Elite Profession....A Hybrid profession like bounty hunter has alot of different abilities, which come from Pistols, Heavy Weapons, Carbines and investigation.
Someone who devotes their skillpointsto aWHOLE profession dedicatedto carbines (not one tree in a hybrid profession) Deserves to be better than someone who only specializes 1/4 branches, in my opinion.
Real life example: would you think someone who is just a security guard wouldbe better at catching a criminal than a full time police officer who devotes most of their time toward crime control?!
No, because the security guard has minimal training on the fourth amendment, and powers of arrest. Although the guard performs security functions and some police work, the expert is the officer.
so should an "Enforcer" or a BH who uses a carbine among various other weaponsin their "bag of tricks"be better skilled than someone who specializes in one weapon, spends %100 of their time training with that weapon, is a master of THAT specific weapon? you say yes? your crazy. The Bounty Hunter should have to dabble in carbineer to reach high speed and accuracy, not the carbineer dabbling in BH. that alone in my opinion is a problem which I hope is addressed in the CB.
Message Edited by Kraftomatic on 09-08-2004 08:55 PM
Message Edited by Kraftomatic on 09-08-2004 09:11 PM
YamadaMan
Wed Sep 08, 2004 10:09 pm
#21
the fact is, BH is focused on 1vs1 specials/mods
Carbineer is focused on states and crowd control attack
for 1vs1 PvP, you need speed cap
for crowd control, you don't
so basically, if you want to rock in 1vs1, it's better to mix and match BH carbines skills with 1vs1 specials from carbineer tree
then you have a great advantage and one handicap: no ranged mitigation 3
so it's pure offense, then use the remaining skill points to get some extra defenses (not even close to a def stacker), and you'll end up with a very offensive template with decent but still quite average defenses.
it's a matter of choices, mix and match to get the best out of every prof. no one ever said you HAVE to get the master box to be efficient for what you want. no one ever said that you won't be efficient without a master box.
a straight master carbineer is great, for crowd control
a carbineer/bh carbines is great too, but for something else
it depends how you want to play carbines, and it's actually the only profession that allows you to play two different styles regarding on how you mix n match the skill trees.
Carbineer is focused on states and crowd control attack
for 1vs1 PvP, you need speed cap
for crowd control, you don't
so basically, if you want to rock in 1vs1, it's better to mix and match BH carbines skills with 1vs1 specials from carbineer tree
then you have a great advantage and one handicap: no ranged mitigation 3
so it's pure offense, then use the remaining skill points to get some extra defenses (not even close to a def stacker), and you'll end up with a very offensive template with decent but still quite average defenses.
it's a matter of choices, mix and match to get the best out of every prof. no one ever said you HAVE to get the master box to be efficient for what you want. no one ever said that you won't be efficient without a master box.
a straight master carbineer is great, for crowd control
a carbineer/bh carbines is great too, but for something else
it depends how you want to play carbines, and it's actually the only profession that allows you to play two different styles regarding on how you mix n match the skill trees.
Brilyn
Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:18 pm
#22
< Bh is an elite profession, Carbiner is a basic combat prof. >
No.
*Marksman* is a basic combat profession.
Carbineer and Bounty Hunter are both elite professions.
As for me, I've dropped Carbineer as of 2 days ago. I've been a Carbineer since I started 7 months ago, and I'd like to try something different: Pikeman! 
But I'll likely be back at some stage. I'm missing my crowd control already. 
Message Edited by Brilyn on 09-09-2004 07:18 AM
Kraftomatic
Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:22 am
#23
YamadaMan wrote:
a straight master carbineer is great, for crowd control
a carbineer/bh carbines is great too, but for something else
it depends how you want to play carbines, and it's actually the only profession that allows you to play two different styles regarding on how you mix n match the skill trees.
Riflemanis great for crowd control also, Area Stun and Dizzy, and more defenses than carbineer. And they are also amazing 1 on 1...Not much mixing and matching needed there. I'm not asking for Carbineer to be a damage dealing profession, I just want to see it possible for aMaster Carbineer to use their weapons quickly and efficiently...yeah for crowd control spamming full auto area 1 with a 1.9 Speed E-11 is fine, but when it comes down to attacking a single target (crippling shot and other 1 on 1 specials) there shouldn't be a huge 3-5 secondspeed lag with a 3.5 speed carbine. I want a carbineer to be as fast and accurate as a BH, you are talking about the roles of carbineer and that is crowd control and 1 vs 1 power moves...if you give carbineers more speed, you are not taking away their role at anything and you are not taking the BH's role. You can still mix and match in BH Carbines to get your 1 on 1 play style with confusion shot and fireknockdown. A straight master carbineer is NOT only for crowd control and there are roles in combat which REQUIRE a straight master carbineer to not be a crowd control person. That role is not reserved for a bounty hunter.
Brainplay
Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:44 am
#24
TAfirehawk wrote:
Actually, even at Master FAS2 is a higher DPS shot (by only 8% though)....unless you have a 1.0 Speed Carbine....
Eh...I'm an evil BH dabbler. Sorry to privelaged that I didn't know about pure carbineer But this profession needs some serious speed love. TK and Fencer cap way before master. Swords is close like rifleman but pike is way off. Pike is just broken anyway.
Pistols dont have a speed issue, they have a damage issue.
No its not easy to get +5 speed attachment for rifles. And the difference between 4/4/4/4 is HUGE.
No rifle defenses are still broken. But then again not even a pistoleer has the survivable defenses like melee do in PvP or PvE.
Maybe if the made tumbling the same thing as Center of Being or vice versa things would be different (tumbling enhances your defenses like CoB only you cant use specials. So why do melee get something like that and we dont?)
StabMastah
Thu Sep 09, 2004 5:06 am
#25
Well I got BH for the speed, not the specials. From what I can tell, out of the three carbine specials you get with BH, two are redundant knockdowns, and one is certainly not as damaging as crippling shot.
Kraftomatic
Thu Sep 09, 2004 5:16 am
#26
StabMastah wrote:
Well I got BH for the speed, not the specials. From what I can tell, out of the three carbine specials you get with BH, two are redundant knockdowns, and one is certainly not as damaging as crippling shot.
Bounty Hunters still get good carbine specials...Confusion Shot sticks dizzy and stun way better than full auto attacks (sometimes you'll fire at someone in PvP, hit 5/10 times, only blind them, or only stun them, and have to fire like 15 more times just to dizzy them..) The Bounty Hunter Fireknockdown is a KD and Dizzy, so if it works and sticks then you don't even need to fire any specials to make them dizzy....that special is priceless.
The specials in BH are way more 1 on 1 than the carbineer specials, so it would still be attractive for carbineers to dabble in BH for amazing accuracy, maybe a LITTE speed and the good 1 on 1 specials.
So the carbineer's main role is still crowd control, but the profession is not well rounded out when it comes to delivering medium level damage. More speed surely wouldn't shift a carbineer's role away from crowd control, it just allows a carbineer to realistically hold their own in tough situations.
Think of Teras Kasi.. I would say a carbineer is a ranged Teras Kasi, lol. Both Professions Knockdown, Dizzy, Stun Blind and Posture down. The only difference is Teras Kasi is well put together and whoever designed carbineer made a few errors.
Message Edited by Kraftomatic on 09-09-2004 08:22 AM