Business And Economy Archive
Thread: So how is the economy broken?
VisaKhart
Fri Sep 09, 2005 3:30 pm
#27
Skyburnbright wrote:
everything is overpriced
Maybe you are just under"credited". 
Seriously - how can EVERYTHING be overpriced?
ThunderVamp9
Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:57 am
#29
[quote] Eleutherios wrote:
...For example, swoops are basically 20k on my server. Sometimes you see them for less, but it's in the majority area of 20k. Once this new batch of resources comes in, I'll sell them for 10k. I know how often they get one-shotted and I wouldn't really feel that good about charging a gigantic markup.
Well now theres an example of how the economy is somewhat broken. We've got people who will sell finished goods for less than the market value of the raw materials.
Man I wish my local Bestbuy priced like that.[/quote]
Why should I care about market value of the raw materials? As far as I can see, they're so overpriced it's scary. If I set my Heavy mineral harvester down on a 75% concentration of steel, then I can harvest that resource for approximately .25 cpu. Yet that same steel is selling on the market for 5 cpu [i]or more[/i]!. How much of a markup IS that? 20 times your investment minimum. That, to me, is gouging. That's an example to me of how the economy is broken. People who harvest their own resources, and base their prices off of THEIR cost to harvest the resources and craft the product are not an example of a broken economy.
I also harvest my own resources. I almost NEVER purchase them from vendors. My cost for items is generally 1 cpu, asteroid resources not withstanding because of the time involved in actually having to manually harvest it. As a rule that gives me .75 profit per unit. That can vary but it's close. Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't be happy quadrupling my investment? Why should I be greedy and go for more simply because I can? This pricing works for me. I've been playing my toon for maybe 2 months, and am not hurting for cash in any way or anything else.
Why should I care about market value of the raw materials? As far as I can see, they're so overpriced it's scary. If I set my Heavy mineral harvester down on a 75% concentration of steel, then I can harvest that resource for approximately .25 cpu. Yet that same steel is selling on the market for 5 cpu [i]or more[/i]!. How much of a markup IS that? 20 times your investment minimum. That, to me, is gouging. That's an example to me of how the economy is broken. People who harvest their own resources, and base their prices off of THEIR cost to harvest the resources and craft the product are not an example of a broken economy.
I also harvest my own resources. I almost NEVER purchase them from vendors. My cost for items is generally 1 cpu, asteroid resources not withstanding because of the time involved in actually having to manually harvest it. As a rule that gives me .75 profit per unit. That can vary but it's close. Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't be happy quadrupling my investment? Why should I be greedy and go for more simply because I can? This pricing works for me. I've been playing my toon for maybe 2 months, and am not hurting for cash in any way or anything else.
Suraknar
Sun Sep 11, 2005 11:19 am
#30
The only thing that can Break our economy is more "Loot Only" items, in my humble opinion.
When a T-21 unscliced Rifle with a base DPS of 300 goes for 20k (that is what is costs in Kauri anyways), and a Drop only Rilfe for 5Million...there is a problem, but its enhanced by player attitudes.
It is normal for someone that went hunting on Kashyyyk, or did a quest to get a very nice Rifle to want thereafter show off that Item, talk about it and say how good it is, but the new guy that started a month ago, will emediatelly want to have the same and will go in the market see that it costs something in the Millions and then wonder how to make these millions and when...
But does not necessarilly know that they can get same item of a quest or by killing a mob...
Then again its why there are fan sites out there...everyone should know that everyithing in this game everyone can get without having to resort to Buying it, just spend a bit of a time to read up the net, gather friends and have fun. Its all it takes.
Pawlin
Sun Sep 11, 2005 5:20 pm
#31
ThunderVamp9 wrote:
...
Why should I care about market value of the raw materials? ...
FOr profit businesses try to maximize profit.
Pawlin
Sun Sep 11, 2005 5:27 pm
#32
ThunderVamp9 wrote:
...Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't be happy quadrupling my investment? Why should I be greedy and go for more simply because I can? This pricing works for me. I've been playing my toon for maybe 2 months, and am not hurting for cash in any way or anything else.
If you had 1 ounce of gold and 1 ounce of silver would you think its greedy to sell the gold for 50 times as much as the silver?
Would you take gold worth $400, make a necklace out of it and sell it for $300?
jokerbacca
Sun Sep 11, 2005 6:03 pm
#33
One more reason that the economy is not broken. The simple fact that I spend maybe, thats a big maybe, 2 hours a week arbitaging a few items. I only concentrate on 2 or 3 in game items at a time. Turn around and have a 10-15% mark up on them and make avery, very good in game living. There are always those out there trying to sell for less than the market price, that drives down prices overall, which is in turn good for the consumers. Those of you that wish to 'cap' items are not familiar enough with laissez faire economics and should try to verse yourselves a little better. 55 mil in one month proves my point, at only 10% at a time.... If a moron like myself can do this anyone can.
EdOWar
Mon Sep 12, 2005 12:20 am
#34
ThunderVamp9 wrote:
[quote] Eleutherios wrote:
...For example, swoops are basically 20k on my server. Sometimes you see them for less, but it's in the majority area of 20k. Once this new batch of resources comes in, I'll sell them for 10k. I know how often they get one-shotted and I wouldn't really feel that good about charging a gigantic markup.
Well now theres an example of how the economy is somewhat broken. We've got people who will sell finished goods for less than the market value of the raw materials.
Man I wish my local Bestbuy priced like that.[/quote]
Why should I care about market value of the raw materials? As far as I can see, they're so overpriced it's scary. If I set my Heavy mineral harvester down on a 75% concentration of steel, then I can harvest that resource for approximately .25 cpu. Yet that same steel is selling on the market for 5 cpu [i]or more[/i]!. How much of a markup IS that? 20 times your investment minimum. That, to me, is gouging. That's an example to me of how the economy is broken. People who harvest their own resources, and base their prices off of THEIR cost to harvest the resources and craft the product are not an example of a broken economy.
I also harvest my own resources. I almost NEVER purchase them from vendors. My cost for items is generally 1 cpu, asteroid resources not withstanding because of the time involved in actually having to manually harvest it. As a rule that gives me .75 profit per unit. That can vary but it's close. Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't be happy quadrupling my investment? Why should I be greedy and go for more simply because I can? This pricing works for me. I've been playing my toon for maybe 2 months, and am not hurting for cash in any way or anything else.
Well, if you're happy making only 0.75 cpu profit on your goods, then there is no reason why you shouldn't do it. But know that you could potentially make a lot more than that. It sounds like you're probably selling your goods at below market rates....which is fine if you want to do that. Butit doesn't mean theeconomy is broken justbecause everyone else isn't as happy as you are to sell below market value.
Slim Vargo, Corbantis
SimDroid
Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:22 am
#35
Pawlin wrote:
ThunderVamp9 wrote:
...Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't be happy quadrupling my investment? Why should I be greedy and go for more simply because I can? This pricing works for me. I've been playing my toon for maybe 2 months, and am not hurting for cash in any way or anything else.
If you had 1 ounce of gold and 1 ounce of silver would you think its greedy to sell the gold for 50 times as much as the silver?
Would you take gold worth $400, make a necklace out of it and sell it for $300?
The opperative word here is "worth". Worth is a relative term. An apple has a million times more worth to a starving man than it has to a marathon runner.
Cost/price is a constant. Worth is a variable.
So to answer that question, who is the gold worth $400 to? What if I can't find anyone who wants to pay me $400 for gold, but I know someone who will give me $300 right now for a nice necklace? I would say the guaranteed $300 is worth more than a maybe $400 someday if I can find someone. Another factor thatI would take into consideration is how much the gold cost me. If I paid $200 for the gold then I wouldn't think twice about selling it for $300. That's a 50% profit. If I paid $400 then I would have to think for a while about it. That still doesn't mean that I wouldn't do it though. A small loss is much better than a complete loss.
Vermicious_Knid
Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:23 am
#36
ThunderVamp9 wrote:
[quote] Eleutherios wrote:
...For example, swoops are basically 20k on my server. Sometimes you see them for less, but it's in the majority area of 20k. Once this new batch of resources comes in, I'll sell them for 10k. I know how often they get one-shotted and I wouldn't really feel that good about charging a gigantic markup.
You wouldn't happen to be on Corbantis, would you? Please sell swoops for 10k, so I can buy them all and resell them for 20.
SimDroid
Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:45 pm
#37
Pawlin wrote:
SimDroid wrote:
Pawlin wrote:
ThunderVamp9 wrote:
...Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't be happy quadrupling my investment? Why should I be greedy and go for more simply because I can? This pricing works for me. I've been playing my toon for maybe 2 months, and am not hurting for cash in any way or anything else.
If you had 1 ounce of gold and 1 ounce of silver would you think its greedy to sell the gold for 50 times as much as the silver?
Would you take gold worth $400, make a necklace out of it and sell it for $300?
.... Worth is a variable....
So to answer that question, who is the gold worth $400 to? ...
Yes 'worth' does vary. Gold has a defined marketvalue. Its a standard price. So the value of gold is defined.
But that wasn't the point. The question was 'why should I be greedy and go for more?'. My answer was : would you sell gold for market value? I'm sure they would. And I'm sure they wouldn't take $400 of gold and make it into a ring and sell it for $300. That wouldn't be smart.
If you bought the gold for $400 and then the value went down then thats a different matter.
Prices for grind materials are fairly standardized in a specific range usually 1-2 cpu. So taking something worth 1 cpu and then making it into a product to sell for less than 1 cpu is not smart business. Its not being greedy to charge money for adding value, its basic business sense.
Heh, you're still using 'worth' as the guideline. The value of gold is not defined. The cost of purchasing gold is defined.
Who says grind materials are worth 1 cpu? IMO they are worth less than that. However, if the price I paid for these materials was 1 CPU then it's agreed, it's not smart business to not make a profit - or at least break even - wen it comes time to sell the finished product.
ThunderVamp9
Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:07 pm
#38
And I'm sure they wouldn't take $400 of gold and make it into a ring and sell it for $300. That wouldn't be smart.
If you bought the gold for $400 and then the value went down then thats a different matter.
And this is exactly my point. I'm not buying the "gold" for $400. I'm buying it for $75. Now, just because I CAN charge $400 for thering I made with it, simply because everyone else is, why not be happy with the $225 profit I made selling it at $300? That sounds plenty smart to me. Going for $400 simply because I can and everyone else is doing it smacks of greed to me. I'm already quadrupling MY investment. That satisifies me.
Pawlin
Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:56 pm
#39
SimDroid wrote:
...
Heh, you're still using 'worth' as the guideline. The value of gold is not defined. The cost of purchasing gold is defined.
Who says grind materials are worth 1 cpu? IMO they are worth less than that. However, if the price I paid for these materials was 1 CPU then it's agreed, it's not smart business to not make a profit - or at least break even - wen it comes time to sell the finished product.
Great. Nice **edit**ing pointless semantics argument... /rolleyes /sigh
OK then forget about the word 'worth'. Pretend it doesn't exist. Use the term 'market value' instead.
Do you agree that grind material has a market value of 1-2 cpu?? (varies by server) I assume you'd agree with this right? I don't care if you paid 0.2 cpu or 5 cpu for the stuff, if the market will readily pay 1-2 cpu for it then thats the market value.
If so then is it smart business to take something that the market valueat 1-2 cpu and then turn it into finished goods to sell for less? Thats what I'm talking about here.
Say steel sells readily on the market for 1.5 cpu. Then is it smart business to mine some steel and then make swoops out of it and sell the swoops for 1.2 cpu?
Is it smart business to do more work and make less profit?