Business And Economy Archive

Thread: Inflation and Star Wars Galaxies: A possible solution

TomedNor
Tue Mar 15, 2005 10:05 am
#14

OK, first, I'm a newbie, so this might be stupid... but it seems like the Bazzar could do this with a little tweaking, removing the 6000 credit cap, and if people used it...



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See you around, and happy trails,
- Tomed Nor
*walks off into the forest*
Corbantis ~ Master Ranger, Master Rifleman, CorSec Ace Pilot
Greywulf0
Tue Mar 15, 2005 11:36 am
#15






MaxellSnow wrote:

I suppose I am confused as to how a player terminal would differ from any of the current methods for hiring players for either hunting, resource gathering, or crafting. USe the auction tab, search by profession, look at the server forums, yell in front of the starport, go to Theed or Mos eisley and yell for noobs...all the resources are there, just tap them...I am ina guild with one other active person right now (everyone left to WOW) and I have contacts in every major profession, 2 sometimes 3 people deep. It is called networking. That requires one thing, WORK, which sad to inform all those that complain about the group mission change, difficulty in becoming jedi, etc...work is part of the game, if it is not, then you need to dumb down your in game goals.





I have used all the current systems you have mentioned. From Starport spamming (myself and barker droids), contacting and hiring hunters, using my guild, using the trade forums. All of these, except for using the guild, meets with minimal results.


Starport spamming: My most successful venture resulted from afk spamming. Yet afk spammers are some of the most reviled players around. I have even had someone send me a tell, saying they had what I wanted in mass quantities, but that they were going to sell it to another player at a cheaper price just because I was spamming.


Starport spamming with droid: You can't fly to another city with the droid currently barking. I assume you can ride to another city on the same planet and spam both those locations, but I forgot to confirm it before I logged out. The droids have a ridiculously low amount of characters that they will spam, and you can't vary them.


Trade forums: Useful for veteren players, but many newer players do not even know they exist. Plus, most of the elite players post there. My last venture for hiring hunters resulted in being outbidded by 10cpu. As a new crafter, I couldn't compete with the big names on the server there.


Contacts: Very useful, but constantly changing as players leave the game or change their professions.


Guild: Easily my best source of resources. Still, they have their owncharacters to run and I can not monopolize their time.


What I'm proposing, is a terminal that will broaden your reach. From newbs to veteren players.





Do you seek intelligent discussions of MMOs, free from moderating influenced by marketing or advertising? Come to RLMMO.com
MaxellSnow
Tue Mar 15, 2005 11:52 am
#16






Greywulf0 wrote:





MaxellSnow wrote:

I suppose I am confused as to how a player terminal would differ from any of the current methods for hiring players for either hunting, resource gathering, or crafting. USe the auction tab, search by profession, look at the server forums, yell in front of the starport, go to Theed or Mos eisley and yell for noobs...all the resources are there, just tap them...I am ina guild with one other active person right now (everyone left to WOW) and I have contacts in every major profession, 2 sometimes 3 people deep. It is called networking. That requires one thing, WORK, which sad to inform all those that complain about the group mission change, difficulty in becoming jedi, etc...work is part of the game, if it is not, then you need to dumb down your in game goals.





I have used all the current systems you have mentioned. From Starport spamming (myself and barker droids), contacting and hiring hunters, using my guild, using the trade forums. All of these, except for using the guild, meets with minimal results.


Starport spamming: My most successful venture resulted from afk spamming. Yet afk spammers are some of the most reviled players around. I have even had someone send me a tell, saying they had what I wanted in mass quantities, but that they were going to sell it to another player at a cheaper price just because I was spamming.


Starport spamming with droid: You can't fly to another city with the droid currently barking. I assume you can ride to another city on the same planet and spam both those locations, but I forgot to confirm it before I logged out. The droids have a ridiculously low amount of characters that they will spam, and you can't vary them.


Trade forums: Useful for veteren players, but many newer players do not even know they exist. Plus, most of the elite players post there. My last venture for hiring hunters resulted in being outbidded by 10cpu. As a new crafter, I couldn't compete with the big names on the server there.


Contacts: Very useful, but constantly changing as players leave the game or change their professions.


Guild: Easily my best source of resources. Still, they have their owncharacters to run and I can not monopolize their time.


What I'm proposing, is a terminal that will broaden your reach. From newbs to veteren players.






Looking at your templates, what more do you need? More meat? Finding noobs to get wp's is easy on the starter planets, acts a s a great recruiting tool for the guild. beyond that, You have the fighter to get your meat, you have the guild contacts for medical components for petstims if you choose, you are your own chef's be. What else is left? Myabe you should scale back your business...


re: contacts-yes they do always change, that is why you always have to work at finding new ones. I do not mean to knock on your idea, but I think there are many other things that are much more worthy of fixing in the game then adding this new concept. Personally this strikes me as a handout for people that do not want to put effort into this aspect of the game. Not calling you out, but think of all the other broken stuff first...





Maxell Snow

Avios Snow

Msg. either toon in game if I win an auction. I DO NOT MONITOR auctions tightly.
Greywulf0
Tue Mar 15, 2005 12:59 pm
#17




MaxellSnow wrote:


Looking at your templates, what more do you need? More meat? Finding noobs to get wp's is easy on the starter planets, acts a s a great recruiting tool for the guild. beyond that, You have the fighter to get your meat, you have the guild contacts for medical components for petstims if you choose, you are your own chef's be. What else is left? Myabe you should scale back your business...


re: contacts-yes they do always change, that is why you always have to work at finding new ones. I do not mean to knock on your idea, but I think there are many other things that are much more worthy of fixing in the game then adding this new concept. Personally this strikes me as a handout for people that do not want to put effort into this aspect of the game. Not calling you out, but think of all the other broken stuff first...







Heh. Scaling back my business would be very difficult since I purposely don't market much . I'm not a big time chef, and I really don't want to be. I generally make custom orders, and most of my products are sold to the guild memebers. The few outside sales are just a little extra that I can use to buy more resources or skill tapes. But this isn't about me wanting to grow, this is about me wanting to easily hire other players, to make use of their professions.


"[B]ut I think there are many other things that are much more worthy of fixing in the game then adding this new concept."


Oh, I agree. I'm still waiting for the teaser that the devs posted on the Ranger board for fixing tracking, traps, and such. Let's see, 17 months and counting from that post, by the big cheese himself. If we wait to post ideas on what we think will improve the game, until all the other fixes are done, we will be waiting forever. I think this is a good idea, and I would like to see something like this implented. I can wait until next year.




Do you seek intelligent discussions of MMOs, free from moderating influenced by marketing or advertising? Come to RLMMO.com
MaxellSnow
Tue Mar 15, 2005 4:27 pm
#18

oh I know, my ex in game wife is still a master ranger and has been fighting the urge to give it up.


The concept is sound, and would help some, but I am just not one for suggesting new ideas when so much other stuff is whacked. Too much like my rl job



Maxell Snow

Avios Snow

Msg. either toon in game if I win an auction. I DO NOT MONITOR auctions tightly.
Milgram
Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:26 am
#19

Only Luxury Items are going up in price. Here my post where i lay it all out.


Now it is fixed. Lol, oops. Umm, ya, i linked it there so you could reply.

Message Edited by Milgram on 03-16-2005 12:46 AM




I'm With-Stupid n I-am With-I'm
The Jedi Jeweler - Outside Theed at -3990 4485
I go Bakersfield Chimp on Krayts and Nightsisters. You Savvy?
- I support keeping & balancing the current combat system You can too


bluejanus
Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:27 am
#20






Milgram wrote:

Only Luxury Items are going up in price. Here my post where i lay it all out.






Wrong link, my friend.





Isander Aperin - Kettemoor Master Architect (home: Serenity, Naboo)
Structures vendor in the HorkCo Shop near Coronet, Corellia (CLOSED)
Structures vendors in the Mos Mesric Mall near Mos Espa, Tatooine (CLOSED)
Structures, jedi kit, crafting station and resource vendors in Serenity near Kaadara, Naboo (CLOSED)
Puertoriqueno
Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:29 am
#21

The illusion of inflation is just that....and before I get flamed, let me explain.


I used to belief the economy was over-inflated, until I actually viewed the economy graphs to see what was going in and coming out. I found that the economy is actually operating at a loss, as it should. So I changed my tune.


The prices of some high end loot and upper end vendors make the economy APPEAR to be inflated, but there are more fair market vendors out there than not. The galaxy search will help to further stabilize this perhaps....but at any rate, I do not believe the economy is in trouble. Just my two cents.




~<<<EGIDA>>>~
/// Master Architect/Master Artisan/Master Merchant \\\
\\\------------Master Politician/Novice Fencer------------///




velm
Wed Mar 16, 2005 1:16 am
#22

Look for new players, they will LOVE you to death if you were to say to them: "hey, watcha doin?" chit-chat away a bit. then "do you want to earn some credits and have some fun? well, if you have some scout in you, you could harvest me some corelian avian for 25 cpu."Then you explain to them that corelian avianis dropped from carrion spats and for each unit they deliver to you, you will give them 25 credits. If the rest of the chefs are paying 35 or 50, you just offer a little less.


When I was introduced to that concept, it blew my mind away.You do not necessarily have to try to get them into the guild, just use them for hunters, sure, at first it will not be much, but as they start to work their way up, it will increase more and more.
Straker_Atrella
Wed Mar 16, 2005 5:56 am
#23

I think you are missing part of the problem, well you nibbled around it.


Combatents only pay a certain percentage of their mission money out for expenses, let's say 25%. The other 75% gets banked.Overtime, these bank accounts just keep growing.


Now when a really good loot drop like a skill attachment or weapon comes up, they may want it. It may also be an AV-21 or a Firespray. They now start to make offers. Since their bank accounts are so big, they may pay more then the item is worth, they just don't care, they can always make more money. Once enough people pay a certain amount for a product, that product is considered "worth" that amount.


Now you take a crafter, he really isn't that different from the Combatent, he just makes his money from selling, not missions. However, he likes nice things as well. He may want an AV-21 or a Firespray as well, or may have a combat alt he supplies from crafting. The problem is that his money isn't infinite, it's based on others. Yet if he wants to bid on stuff that combatents are bidding on as well, he needs more money. The logical step is to raise prices. As long as people are willing to pay those prices, they are not to high. The choice lies with the customer.


The real solution is this.

Currently only certain crafting professions are really "needed" to support combatents, the others are more just wants, but not needed. Tailors are an example, they are not nearly in as much demand as Armorsmiths or Weaponsmiths. What you do is increase how much the more neglected crafting professions are needed, make combatents pay them more money.


Ideally, about 50% of a Combatents money would go to expenses. Then because this 50% is spread out through the crafters, they are on equal footing. Prices will stabalize because everybody has the same earning potential.



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
velm
Wed Mar 16, 2005 6:49 am
#24

I do have to agree to a an extent about what the combat professions need. If you stop and think about it, the following 'crafting' professions are currently in demand by the combat profs:


Chefs - food, brandy, synthsteak and other very useful ones

Docs -Buffs, gotta have our buffs for the high end content

Armorsmiths -gotta have that nice comp armor

Weaponsmiths - need them super powerful damage dealing weapons


To a lesser degree:


BE - for additives for tailorsand chefs for their foods and making BE creatures

Scouts - to provide the various organics for the armorsmiths, chefs, docs

DE -Harvesting droids, medical droids, storage droids

Tailor - with conjuction with a BE can make some BE clothes that can really enhance a character.


But, yes there are some professions that really do not see the amount of credits that the above ones do. The difficult thing to do is trying to figure out how to make some of those professions more viable. Either make them more useful, somehow, or lower some of the production costs, or give them more options.


MaxellSnow
Wed Mar 16, 2005 4:31 pm
#25






bluejanus wrote:










I'm not disagreeing with your anti-inflationary forces idea. Just saying that a newbie coming into the game will soak up credits as they establish themselves as a player. The player who quit is 5 mil now gone from the game. The new player will require all those things that the old player left with so will generate sales




Eventually, the new player will equal the existing player in terms of demand, true. But when a new player comes in, they do not have the buying power of the veteran, there is a delay. Constantly, people are coming and going from the game. There is not a mass exodus away. As sellers, the cnstant in/out is transparent because as you say, demand is constant since the changes are staggerd.



other quote: straker-atrella:


Now you take a crafter, he really isn't that different from the Combatent, he just makes his money from selling, not missions. However, he likes nice things as well. He may want an AV-21 or a Firespray as well, or may have a combat alt he supplies from crafting. The problem is that his money isn't infinite, it's based on others. Yet if he wants to bid on stuff that combatents are bidding on as well, he needs more money. The logical step is to raise prices. As long as people are willing to pay those prices, they are not to high. The choice lies with the customer.


The real solution is this.

Currently only certain crafting professions are really "needed" to support combatents, the others are more just wants, but not needed. Tailors are an example, they are not nearly in as much demand as Armorsmiths or Weaponsmiths. What you do is increase how much the more neglected crafting professions are needed, make combatents pay them more money.


Ideally, about 50% of a Combatents money would go to expenses. Then because this 50% is spread out through the crafters, they are on equal footing. Prices will stabalize because everybody has the same earning potential.

________

This is pointless to me. If a crafter wants the same amount of money a sa hunter, then become a hunter. The templates are what they are. It is selfish and rediculous to think that 100% of the toons should all make the same amount of money. What about politicians? Maybe we should give the mayors a sluch fund tax so they can line their bank with tax money...


...the comment about the money being based on others....no, it is based on the seller(s) if you feel you are getting an unfair amount of cash, then charge more. I sure as hell would pay 2x the amount just to have an amorsmith that is regularly stocked. Your 50% idea wouldnt even work. VERY SIMPLIFIED EXAMPLE

Fighter makes 10k on a mission.

Needs to buy item x to complete the one mission

cost of item for fighter = 5k, per your rule

cost of crafter to make item x = 1k

net cash in hand of crafter = 4k = 40%


who should charge more to balance this? crafter? supplier to the crafter? Everyone on this server cannot make the same amount of money, nor should they. Why do you just use crafters and fighters? Entertainers are an inegral part of a good fighter: mind buffs, why leave them out in the cold?




Maxell Snow

Avios Snow

Msg. either toon in game if I win an auction. I DO NOT MONITOR auctions tightly.
FriedSquid
Wed Mar 16, 2005 6:51 pm
#26

The problem with the current inflation is that it started with massive duping of currency, and subsequently all that currency was spread fairly inefficiently. There's no real way to change this except to purge all the money on a server. Purging all the money on a server would lose player base, so there's no real point to the whole argument. The current solution is the only one that is going to be attempted - delete those who flagrantly abused, and otherwise let the economy sort it out. Right now it's doing that rather effectively, is my guess - anyone cancreate a master doc within a few weeks and start buffing at a decent rate, filtering the money through those they buy their buffs from down to their consumers.... Anyone can harvest lots of resources off of monsters and then sell them to people with effectively limitless pools of cash to make some for themselves. The only real losers are the n00bs and the "must mission forever" style fighters, because the noobs don't have any access to the bug but have to pay inflated prices, and the "mission forever" fighters don't produce anything for other people. (unless they are harvesting, which changes everything immediately) All in all, there are more downsides than upsides in an economy like this - the maintainance rates are out of whack being quite important, and the fees are all negligible - but any proposed solution will most likely be a wasted proposal because the devs said what they would do six months ago and haven't changed their story since.


Let's just hope they didn't leave any gaping holes for people to dupe more cash. I'm not holding my breath on that one.


And yes, this is my first post total. So I know what I speak of when I talk of being a disenfranchised noob.


Buy my crap on ahazi. Send me tells if you need anything a noobish shipwright or architect can make. Especially furniture, I can make a lot of that.


That is all.






It's all gone. And so am I.


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