Business And Economy Archive
Thread: Why did everyone complain about the money system/infalted economy?
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Bluechiss
Tue Jan 18, 2005 8:27 pm
#1
I play this game for the economy and i didnt really understand why many people found a problem with it.
I have been playing since the 1st hour of launch (got in before the registrationservers exploded)and have seen all the trends etc.
I was a resource supplier though the holo grind and made quit a bit off that, but never held over 15 million at my peak. Still dont see how the grind ruined the economy as it provided a resoruce market and a crafter market too.
I then picked up crafting and did quite well by collecting uber resources and 12-point suits for it, doing the proffesion for 2 weeks and then quitting and selling everything (repeat). Also PSG manufacture (i love those little guys!!).
My record money height was 218 million. It is currently at 140 million.
I have about 50 million in ready-to-sell goods (i re-rolled and took away my vendors), a full RIS suit and a speed-capped swordsman.
I did none of this through exploiting or underhanded dealings. I did it all the hard and honest way. I took great pleasure in providing my fellow server-mates with quaility products and making a bit of money on the side.
I hear some call for money wipes and the like. I dont understand this at all. With the solo groups, money was by far the easiest thing to get in the game. There was no reason anyone but a 2-week noob should have been pinching pennies.
This is where i get confused though. With all the money coming into the system and the ease of it, what was the problem with inflation? This is not a real world economy, so there is not really any sort of backing for currency that had a dire effect on the amount of it in the game. So what if people had millions and billions?? It did not really affect the average player since it was well within his/her reach of getting with a little hard work.
I mean, if everyone could afford nearly anything they needed, i dont see the problem with the high prices.
Maybe i am missing something. Could someone clarify if so?
Thanks,
Minass
Narreem0884
Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:01 pm
#2
Solo groups have been nerfed, ruiningthe money-making aspect of it and are now only good for grinding. 10k payouts on missions don't exactly collect cash at an astonishing rate. The only good money-maker is space, and anyone without JTL is left in the dust.
Good loot can only be looted and sold by the defense stacking tanks and CM's who can take on NS Elders and the like. The good loot goes for so much that only the people with alts have the money to buy them, perpetuating the cycle.
I can make enough to get by, but I can never hope to make the millions necessary to buy the good stuff for my profession, the NS Energy Lance being the foremost thing on this list. I'd have to spend days in space to make the necessary amount of cash and though I'd like too, I have other things to deal with.
Yogol
Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:54 am
#3
There is less money coming in the game, because the solo groups are nerfed. That isn't a bad thing, but the problem is that alot of people have 100's of millions that they got by doing easy missions or selling stuff to people that do easy missions.
So the sad result is that newer players can never pay the best items because older players have more money. Hence the talks about money-drains : ways to make sure that old players lose part of their money and new players can compete with them.
dlewis1234
Wed Jan 19, 2005 7:39 am
#4
Like someone said on another thread the real problem with any economy is perception.
Take the ship chassis market for example. Until you master pilot these items are
basically consumables. You use them till the next tier and discard them.
I've been trying to sell these items at a fair price 2 cpu or less and have found
very few takers. It seems that people feel that a ship you will use for a week must cost
several hundred thousand credits to be any good.
I find this a strange view. I was trying to sell tier 4 ships at the bargin price of 75k
just to raise some cash. I still have them. Granted my char has not mastered Shipwright
yet but the master chassis are only a few % better than my stats.
It is very hard for non-masters to sell anything in this game.
Take the ship chassis market for example. Until you master pilot these items are
basically consumables. You use them till the next tier and discard them.
I've been trying to sell these items at a fair price 2 cpu or less and have found
very few takers. It seems that people feel that a ship you will use for a week must cost
several hundred thousand credits to be any good.
I find this a strange view. I was trying to sell tier 4 ships at the bargin price of 75k
just to raise some cash. I still have them. Granted my char has not mastered Shipwright
yet but the master chassis are only a few % better than my stats.
It is very hard for non-masters to sell anything in this game.
ofim
Wed Jan 19, 2005 7:54 am
#5
Narreem0884 wrote:
Solo groups have been nerfed, ruiningthe money-making aspect of it and are now only good for grinding. 10k payouts on missions don't exactly collect cash at an astonishing rate. The only good money-maker is space, and anyone without JTL is left in the dust.
Good loot can only be looted and sold by the defense stacking tanks and CM's who can take on NS Elders and the like. The good loot goes for so much that only the people with alts have the money to buy them, perpetuating the cycle.
I can make enough to get by, but I can never hope to make the millions necessary to buy the good stuff for my profession, the NS Energy Lance being the foremost thing on this list. I'd have to spend days in space to make the necessary amount of cash and though I'd like too, I have other things to deal with.
High end items will always take high end cash, this nerf or that nerf will never solve it. Things like NS energy lances are sapossed to be very rare for people to have, so I would hav to say that the DEV's knew only the ultra rich....or the ultra lucky would ever have items like that. Thing is you never "need" items like that, you "want" items like that.....there nothing more than a shinny nickle at the end of the tunnel keeping you interested.
RashDraco
Wed Jan 19, 2005 9:33 am
#6
OK I'm not one to like the idea of "money drains" but fixing the economy is a must. There allready exists money drains, add a new loot schematic and you will see milions of credits exchange hands so someone can be first to have it.
Things that need repair "CLOTHING" the days of 0/1000 clothing being equipable and the players getting the benifits of the skill tapes and be clothes needs to go by by.
I don't car ethat so and so had a +25 crafting suit, if its at 0/1000 condition it should be scrap, cut and dry. This bug alone affects several crafting communities.
Tailor OBVIUOSLY:
has been reduced to makeing rarely clothing, usually trim schmatics for chefs, armor padding schems for armorsmiths and synth cloth schems for archetects.
BioEngineer: With ch basically useless, and tailor almost useless, BE's have been regulated to making schematics for nutrition suppliments, yep pretty much the rest of teh suppliments are useless or not used by chefs enogh to make a profit off of.
Weaponsmith/Armorsmith: These classess have there +25 suits, only a few hae them and they have the market corned making it impossible for anyine new to join the market, hey 10 exp to 12 or 13 exp is a HUGE differance.
What may be needed is just a little fix, perhaps since we all know 0/1000 items cannot be repaired a simple line of code that makes an ite become scrap at 0/1000. this includes weapons, armor, you name it. This will force players to insure, watch there usage and force them to rebuy items that just eventually wear out.
I also have some excellant ideas for a tailor/armorsmith revamp that would make for interesting discussion and revitilize both classess and bring the games armor mor ein line with the period in quesiton, I mean Bone armor COME ON!!
ana-mo-cara
Wed Jan 19, 2005 9:45 am
#7
An inflated economy has many drawbacks to it.
The economy dosent just become inflated it gets there gradually. This really sucked. A ten k item one week was suddenly 12 k the next week and so on. Eventually it becomes a viscious cycle. You buy product to run more missions. The missions give you better money. The crafter demands a bigger cut the item costs more. The real result is your working harder and harder to afford the same item. In other words if your burning through items your not getting very far. Except you spend your time feeding the beast.
Credit devalueing. You know if three million credits is easy to get and harrower bone shards are not which is worth more. Well that would be harrower bone shards. Whereas earlier in the game I might sell these items for fourty thousand credits which was a handsome some even though it didnt take days to get. After inflation I can charge nothing less then a quarter million plus and I will get that money. Net result credits used to buy everything now some people just say credits ah I do not need those. So you can offer fifty sixty seventy million for some items.
Solo content. Solo groups totally and utterly devalued these. Even a high level master hunting solo couldnt compete with these cash cows. Result all hunting became sologroup. If you do not want to go through the mechanics you are screwed.
Whenthe game was earlier on. A player could spend an hour or two each week running missions, and then be able to cover all costs for the following week. Buy weapons drugs armor equipment. That was it later on as inflation started to spiral it was not uncommon to be spending 7/8 hours a week just to cover the basics.
The point is a noninflated economy is better. You do not have to go to excessive lengths to cover your costs. Prices begin to get set. Novice paying the same as master. Hopefully we can get back to how the game should be played. Players earning in game creds to use them quickly to access game content. 140million get out I have never broken the million credit mark, but once when I sold a loot. You are angry because you got 140 million and with out a inflated economy those creds do not get you an awful lot.
Yomigaere
Wed Jan 19, 2005 9:59 am
#8
Anyone can sell resources, quick way to get rich, know the market, and you will be rich...
Tavtrin
Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:04 am
#9
I hate to rag on all of the people who say they can't make any money, but that's just whining and lieing. I have always had mixed and odd skills, and very rarely do missions. I gambled away 20 mil in credits a month ago, and am back up to 12 mil just from selling loot(and I gave away a mil today). I do not play that often and am no longer a "powergamer", and again I don't have an "uber" build. It is easy to get lots of money from harvesting/renting your lots, or harvesting off creatures. Even if you don't do that, if you are fairly intelligent you can make a killing on resale.
Message Edited by Tavtrin on 01-20-2005 02:04 AM
Pawlin
Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:36 pm
#10
"Why did everyone complain about the money system/infalted economy?"
Some people don't have as much money as they want, can't afford the things they want and don't know how to get as much money as they want.
If you're a newbie then its easier to understand. I know if I started on day 1 and saw armor selling for 250k, tapes auctioning for 10M and my missions payed out500-1000 credits it might seem an impossible task to get enough money to afford what it seems everyone else has. And no matter what you do as a new person, it will be hard initially to compete with the established people who've got a year plus head start on you.
IntoTheGarbage
Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:52 pm
#11
For my part, I thinkyou have spelt outone of the problems right there. The economic game is just way too easy. I am in the same boat as you, and I want the economic game to be more challenging.
Bluechiss wrote:
I play this game for the economy and i didnt really understand why many people found a problem with it....
I then picked up crafting and did quite well by collecting uber resources and 12-point suits for it, doing the proffesion for 2 weeks and then quitting and selling everything (repeat). Also PSG manufacture (i love those little guys!!).
My record money height was 218 million. It is currently at 140 million.
I have about 50 million in ready-to-sell goods (i re-rolled and took away my vendors), a full RIS suit and a speed-capped swordsman.
I did none of this through exploiting or underhanded dealings. I did it all the hard and honest way. I
Master_Mavric
Thu Jan 20, 2005 2:56 pm
#12
Some one above me said that anyone coming in will never be able to afford or have the "good stuff" do to inflation. I would like to say that Ive been playing sence day one and i still dont have "the good stuff" however i am quite happy in game. I also would like to point out that for the better then 50% of the player base that doesnt use these fourms the chances are even slimmer that they will get "the good stuff" because it all sells on the trade forums. So whys it realy matter? Well its a game. It doesnt. Dont Like It? Dont Play It
Stl2aNgE
Thu Jan 20, 2005 3:41 pm
#13
I think the whole thing is blown way out of proportion. Yes, i do see things that are outrageously priced, but they sit there for months waiting to be sold. Except for some stuff on auctions. I currently have about 2.5 mil in credits, have been as high as 3.5 mil, and i worked for every bit of it. I see people nowadays standing around begging for credits, cause they are either too stupid, or too lazy to run missions. And that is really sad. Prices are coming down I guess due to the solo group nerf, I personally think it is cause people got tired of having their houses and inventories full of junk that isnt selling, so they finally decided to be realistic on some of their prices. With the new loot system and a bit of luck in the FS tree, anyone can go lot hunting now days and get things they want. Or, get things other people want to buy, and sell them off that way to make the money they need to purchase what they want.
Also for every outrageously priced item out there on the market there is another identical piece for less somewhere, you just got to look. Might take a couple hours, but it is out there. People just need to quit whining and get out there and work for what they want, just likeeveryone has to in real life.
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