Business And Economy Archive

Thread: Somethings going down with RotW

Aitsa
Thu May 05, 2005 11:55 pm
#1


I recently saw a feller on a swoop with a Proton Carbine, so naturaly I send him a tell asking who made it. He replys with "its a quest item from kyshyykk" So I stop to think about it, then I ask him whats the damage. I find out its ~450 base DPS, which is rather high, he said his modified DPS with a pup is over 850...

850 DPS...now as a rifleman with a decent puped t21 I can get a DPS of 645. With that said I see 2 problems...


1) People who purchase RotW get weapons from quests that can out damage any of the normal craftable weapons, thus giving anyone that is willing to pay money a gaurenteed upper hand in any sort of combat (pve or pvp) making the game dramaticly unbalanced between people who pay and those that dont


2) These weapons are from quests, not crafted and have higher stats then a crafted weapon. People will just do the quest, get the better weapon and there will be no need for weaponsmiths for higher end players, thus hindering the flow of money and demand for weaponsmiths.


I fear that this is just the 1st stage of making this game into a droped-loot-based-game like all the other SOE games, and that I dont want to see.




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Summerflame
Fri May 06, 2005 8:23 am
#2






Aitsa wrote:


I recently saw a feller on a swoop with a Proton Carbine, so naturaly I send him a tell asking who made it. He replys with "its a quest item from kyshyykk" So I stop to think about it, then I ask him whats the damage. I find out its ~450 base DPS, which is rather high, he said his modified DPS with a pup is over 850...

850 DPS...now as a rifleman with a decent puped t21 I can get a DPS of 645. With that said I see 2 problems...


1) People who purchase RotW get weapons from quests that can out damage any of the normal craftable weapons, thus giving anyone that is willing to pay money a gaurenteed upper hand in any sort of combat (pve or pvp) making the game dramaticly unbalanced between people who pay and those that dont


2) These weapons are from quests, not crafted and have higher stats then a crafted weapon. People will just do the quest, get the better weapon and there will be no need for weaponsmiths for higher end players, thus hindering the flow of money and demand for weaponsmiths.


I fear that this is just the 1st stage of making this game into a droped-loot-based-game like all the other SOE games, and that I dont want to see.






Im quite worried by this as well. But tbh Ive seen it coming for a long time..


ADK & Vendor search making it easier and faster for Combat players while at the same time lowering the need for crafters. Its sickening to me that most of topend weapons in this game are now quest rewards and I sincerely hope that SOE will rethink this.


I honestly do not understand why they didnt grab the opportunity to give crafters some content by letting the quest rewards be schematics for these weapons. Would have made for a much bettter solution and everyone would have been happy...


Again I seriously hope that SOE rethinks this and change the rewards to be scheamtics instead.





----------[N*W]Weaponry (+2 and FS)----------
@Danevang City Corellia 3434 -5534 and Danevang Mall 3325 -5633@
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QuiJonOz
Sat May 07, 2005 7:09 pm
#3

I have the same concerns as well, but evidently the need for combat players' instant gratification outweighs our need to have a role in high end content. When questioned about the lack of crafter survivability on harvester runs, the devs glibly responded that we should hire combat player bodyguards... so they accept that we have to rely on the combats, but heavens forbid a combat should have to go to a crafter to get a quest item assembled.



No decay + uber loot = /spit on crafters

Fix the economy and give crafters their $$$ worth... give us real revamp.

Remember... to Cancel you have to go to Register Expansion in the Launchpad.

BadChef
Sat May 07, 2005 9:59 pm
#4

Remember though, its a one time thing, so once its gone its on the wall for eye candy. I think it's more then fair for someone to earn a nice item like that for a time if they're not the rich grinding sort that can dish out near millions for the realy good crafted stuff. Don't sweat it too much, they'l be shopping at your venders after awile for a new weapon, if not for other gear.




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BadChef: Smuggler
Summerflame
Sun May 08, 2005 4:10 am
#5






BadChef wrote:

Remember though, its a one time thing, so once its gone its on the wall for eye candy. I think it's more then fair for someone to earn a nice item like that for a time if they're not the rich grinding sort that can dish out near millions for the realy good crafted stuff. Don't sweat it too much, they'l be shopping at your venders after awile for a new weapon, if not for other gear.





I wouldnt have as much of aproblem if it wasnt for the the introduction of the ADK



----------[N*W]Weaponry (+2 and FS)----------
@Danevang City Corellia 3434 -5534 and Danevang Mall 3325 -5633@
{{{Summerflame k Nalai{{{
{{{Angelic deliverer of Pboys pimp weapons{{{



MrHawat
Sun May 08, 2005 4:39 am
#6


Not to mention a few tweaks in loot drops. Shipwrights have had this problem since we were created. Sad to say but as a MSW/MPilot, none of my ships have crafted parts. They are all either loot or RE'd loot. I would not bet that with the current attitude of SOE they will not do the same to other professions when the Combat Crybaby's new toy decays.
Smart_Darwin
Sun May 08, 2005 12:17 pm
#7

The same is happening to shipwrights. All the new RotW ships are quest rewards. Though they are often bugged to the point of uselesness, they not only represent a lost opportunity for shipwrights, but also represent a direct attack on thier business (such as they are). I would not be worried, if I did not see a pattern. It seems pretty clear that the devs either mistakenly beleive all the kinks are worked out of the current crafting system, or they want us to crawl under a rock and decay. Niether is an acceptable proposition.


I have not tested this yet, but are the reward items a "one time deal?" Can we take these as rewards repeatedly and sell them? If they are a one-time deal, then I guess crafting proffs can take it on the chin one more time and survive. However, if these superior items are in limitless supply, then really we are useless.





Success is not sufficient; others must fail.
BadChef
Sun May 08, 2005 7:53 pm
#8

A few realy nice quest items is fine by me, but seeing all these new items show up every day makes your concerns a little more clear to me. Myself, I prefer to send my favorite tailors and other crafters custom orders for what I need at the time, not all top of the line things all the rich folks have but usefull things. But then I'm not very rich so its not my credits crafters will be missing. Im not much for composite gear, I'm not much for the neon color camo pants with form fitting shirt, and I'm definatly not much for the duster and sunguard look. I like being able to send in orders for what I like and not being limited to what everyone els uses.


I'm not going to be doing those quests anyway except maybe for the mineing ship, which would be nice if that was craftable by shipwhrites, so I'l still be spending what I have at your venders.




xfire name: thachef
__________
BadChef: Smuggler
Olib
Mon May 09, 2005 2:05 am
#9


i think the proton carbine is about 325 base DPS, my elite carbine is 333, so sure you can get normal weapons that are better, though it may cost you


EDIT:


2.25 speed
428-855 damage
90 cold elemental damage
329.89 estimated DPS

They are the stats on proton carbine.


It has elemental damage which i didnt know about, so it is better than craftablee.

Message Edited by Olib on 05-09-2005 10:08 AM



IGN Oli'b
Orryliakaloc
Thu May 12, 2005 8:35 am
#10


Just to take the devil's advocate sort of stance... what about vice versa? Suppose all these rewards were instead Proton Carbine Schematic, Royal Guard Interceptor Schematic. Then what? You sell it to a crafter (and nto for a whole lot), and then they craft and sell it for an enormous sum. Not all combatants have these huge sums of money. I mean, how much did a DE-10 or Berserker Rifle cost when they first came out? Certainly the price does down over time, but still, not everyone is very rich. Is it bad to give fighters who aren't as hardcore a chance to get a cool gun?


And, as someone said, eventually it will break anyway.




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Summerflame
Thu May 12, 2005 9:19 am
#11






Orryliakaloc wrote:


Just to take the devil's advocate sort of stance... what about vice versa? Suppose all these rewards were instead Proton Carbine Schematic, Royal Guard Interceptor Schematic. Then what? You sell it to a crafter (and nto for a whole lot), and then they craft and sell it for an enormous sum. Not all combatants have these huge sums of money. I mean, how much did a DE-10 or Berserker Rifle cost when they first came out? Certainly the price does down over time, but still, not everyone is very rich. Is it bad to give fighters who aren't as hardcore a chance to get a cool gun?


And, as someone said, eventually it will break anyway.






Well firstly the beserker and DE-10 schematic were looted items so attaining those schematics were a matter of luck which meant they were not only expensive to buy assembled, but was also very expensive for the crafters to buy.

These weapon schematics would be fairly common as everyone would be able to obtain them thorugh questing.

Instead of selling the schematic to a crafter you could ask them to craft it for you? Paying for their time and resources of course, but still less expensive than buying the finished product.

You state that you wouldnt earn much by selling the schematic to a crafter. Well I know and Im pretty sure that mos crafters would agree that if some weapons made from lootschematics sell well, then a lot of crafters are after these putting the price of these throught hte roof. So if the price of the final weapon was skyhigh, then the schematic price would be skyhigh. Those things are interrelated.

I have no issue with nonwealthy players getting good stuff once in a while, but I think they took a possibility of adding content to crafters and combattants and turned it into a situation where they added content to combattants and took away content from the crafters which IMO is a really really bad choice to make



----------[N*W]Weaponry (+2 and FS)----------
@Danevang City Corellia 3434 -5534 and Danevang Mall 3325 -5633@
{{{Summerflame k Nalai{{{
{{{Angelic deliverer of Pboys pimp weapons{{{



HNelson
Thu May 12, 2005 10:51 am
#12


These high powered loot items would be more acceptable if they couldn't be adk'd. The problem is, they would only get pulled out for those special occasions thus they would still last a long time.
EdOWar
Thu May 12, 2005 11:13 am
#13






Orryliakaloc wrote:


Just to take the devil's advocate sort of stance... what about vice versa? Suppose all these rewards were instead Proton Carbine Schematic, Royal Guard Interceptor Schematic. Then what? You sell it to a crafter (and nto for a whole lot), and then they craft and sell it for an enormous sum. Not all combatants have these huge sums of money. I mean, how much did a DE-10 or Berserker Rifle cost when they first came out? Certainly the price does down over time, but still, not everyone is very rich. Is it bad to give fighters who aren't as hardcore a chance to get a cool gun?


And, as someone said, eventually it will break anyway.







Most looted/quest reward schematics sold for good money. And a lot of them required special looted components to make, which increased the cost. DE-10 schematic went for around a million, then a good DE-10 barrel would cost another 500K to 1 million. That's going into the looter's pocket. Scythe blade schematics cost 750K to 1.5 million each, not counting the set of 7 yellow cubes and 7 pasts (another 500K or so). Beserker rifle schematics were 500K to 1 million, and the stabilizer unit for another 500K or so. Looters got rich selling this stuff to crafters. The weaponsmiths selling these weapons didn't have nearly the profit levels the looters did.


Anyelite combat professioncould get this loot, though it might take a little luck. How many casual gamers do you think arefarming Necrosis (or whatever his name is)?


And with an ADK, a looted weapon will never break.


Slim Vargo, Corbantis
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