Brawler Archive

Thread: How I use Warcry2 post nerf

Ciao
Sun Mar 23, 2003 9:49 pm
#1

I dont believe you!!



I am a Master Brawler, Master Pikeman and 4/4/0/0 Fencer, 0/0/4/0 Swordsman and 2/3/0/4 TKA with novice medic.


I cant see how you are able to WarCry2 the remaining mobs once they surround you, you would have to turn and face each one and let loose a roar then face the next mob and do the same. I can see killing a mob in 20 seconds though as I do that to Rancors all the time in the NS Caves. To be honest, you probably arent getting hit if you have a good template and when you are hit you dont notice as you are buffed.


However, I see WarCry being a little worse than before as it relates to a melee fighter vs. a ranged fighter in PvP. But oh well, lets see how the rest of the combat changes fall out. I am sure melee will suffer and I cant really blame them as this is a Sci Fi game and not fantasy game/





Roboute Guiliman
Melee Master
Rebel’s Bane
Vepyr
Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:06 pm
#2
First off, let me just say that WC2 was not "nerfed." A nerf is taking a skill or object that is over powered and lowering/altering it's effectivness to be more inline with other skills in the game. WC2 wasn't nerfed because it was BROKEN...not overpowered. It didn't work as was intended...how it is now was what was intended. It has been fixed. Not nerfed.


Secondly, it is FAR from useless. In fact...I use it more now than I did before. The previous use for it with most people was as a way to delay an oppenent who was knocked down so you could spam your high damage moves with impunity and kill easily. It wasn't meant for this, it was meant as a means of "crowd control." A way for a melee combatant to deal with mutliple opponents in a situation where you are outnumbered.


As it is now its more effective now than ever before! Why? A dizzy knock down will pretty much put anyone down long enough for a master brawler/master tk/fencer/swords/pike to spam away and kill off the opponent. Warcry use was just over kill, you really didn't need it for that purpose.The dizzy effect keeps the target down long enough on its own.


As it is now it's a great way to handle multiple, high damage mobs. Let's use voritor lizards on dantooine for an example. It's not uncommon for me to solo 4-5 voritors, with no armor. Why? I can pause them all, take one out. Then move on to the next keeping the others off me...Crowd Control.


Another way I use it: I'm Imperial and I run a lot of large rebel base missions. As I'm a tk master/master brawler I need to be close to attack. So I'll use a warcry2 and charge in. After the first guy is dead, I'll turn and target the next. I have a macro setup so with one hot key I will /follow. /warcry2, /heal self, /pause 5, /unarmedunge2, /unarmedhit1, /unarmeddizzy1 - this basically with one click, will pause the next guy at 25m away I hafta run down, where normally he could pound away on me while I'm closing the distance and healing...instead he's left useless while I have plenty of time to heal.


After which my unarmedlunge2/dizzy will pretty much garuntee he's on his back and not getting up once I've closed the distance, and he's prime meat for me to unarmed3 until dead.


Again, this skill was not nerfed. You just hafta get your heads out of your asses and think!


Tropicus
Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:46 pm
#3

The knockdown-warcry combination was disheartening to be pummeled by and truly did feel "broken".

It now finds similar use in my repertoire as the situations you just mentioned.
GTOfire
Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:13 pm
#4
one note I posted in another 'warcry has actually improved' post: if you use it more then before, that's your loss in the past, because it has in no way become MORE useful. Your use for it may not have been affected, but it is not possible to have your use be improved.


post-nerf: your use - PvE: You attack 5 voritors at a time and are, like any master brawler should be, surrounded by animals. You let off a warcry, thereby delaying your target at least, and 1 or 2 more if you're lucky enough that they're also in the Cone of Effect. Your target loses the effect immediately because you attack it. That means that out of 5 voritors surrounding you, 1 or 2 of them don't attack you, 3 or 4 of them do.


pre-nerf, your use - PvE: You attack the same 5 voritors that surround you. You KD your target and let off your warcry, delaying the same 1 or 2 extra targets in the cone of effect while your target stays down for 20 seconds. Out of 5 voritors surrounding you, 2 or 3 are still attacking, 1 or 2 are not, 1 is lying on it's back easily killable for 20 seconds and is also not attacking you.


post-nerf - PvP: You warcry your opponent to avoid him doing damage to you. You must take care however to time your attack and chase carefully, because your first succesful attack must be one that stops them in their tracks to avoid kiting. If your first attack fails to KD, they can attack you again.


pre-nerf - PvP: You warcry your opponent and chase him with a little more security. If you fail a KD, you're still safe from attack for a little while longer, allowing you to try one more time.


post-nerf: your use - PvNPC: great, they are unable to attack you while you run to them and heal, then you can KD/dizzy them and kill, brilliant!


pre-nerf, your use - PvNPC: news flash, that was already exactly like that. Difference is that if you lunge2 and fail the posture change down, they can attack you now, they didn't used to be able to.



All in all, I called it a nerf because that's the going term for it. How you define the term is up to you, but factually, the skill has in NO way improved, it has in 3 ways become far less powerful. Is that justified? I dunno.

Yes, warcry was a very powerful tool in PvE (not so much in PvP, against kiters you just live 20 seconds longer while they stay out of range, against melee the KD/dizzy is all that matters, warcrying them is just 200 HAM down the drain on an effect you already have with those moves), but was it overpowered or broken? It allowed us master brawlers/master melee prof to solo the same things ranged players solo, making sure we can hold our own in high level combat without requiring professions we're not interested in. With the current state of warcry, it is purely a means of running away. Crowd Control? not with the Cone Effect only inflicting the warcry on 2 out of 10 opponents surrounding us..



--------------------------------------------------
Ysh-Hon Eeryuu
General Manager, Intergalactic Society of Megalomaniacs (ISM) Enterprises
ISM Superstore - Tatooine (outside Bestine) -1735, -4917
M Tailor, M Artisan, M Merchant
Vepyr
Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:35 pm
#5
How it has become more powerful is it's AoE of increased a bit. As I read in a previous post is less cone-like in it area now. It seems to hit more targets, more often for me now.
Ciao
Tue Mar 23, 2004 9:49 pm
#6

I dont believe you!!



I am a Master Brawler, Master Pikeman and 4/4/0/0 Fencer, 0/0/4/0 Swordsman and 2/3/0/4 TKA with novice medic.


I cant see how you are able to WarCry2 the remaining mobs once they surround you, you would have to turn and face each one and let loose a roar then face the next mob and do the same. I can see killing a mob in 20 seconds though as I do that to Rancors all the time in the NS Caves. To be honest, you probably arent getting hit if you have a good template and when you are hit you dont notice as you are buffed.


However, I see WarCry being a little worse than before as it relates to a melee fighter vs. a ranged fighter in PvP. But oh well, lets see how the rest of the combat changes fall out. I am sure melee will suffer and I cant really blame them as this is a Sci Fi game and not fantasy game/





Roboute Guiliman
Melee Master
Rebel’s Bane
GTOfire
Wed Mar 24, 2004 2:41 am
#7
before the publlish they said cone-effect would remain the same, the changelog didn't say anything about better AoE properties either, so I think it's a slight bit of luck combined with wishful thinking that made you assume it had improved.



--------------------------------------------------
Ysh-Hon Eeryuu
General Manager, Intergalactic Society of Megalomaniacs (ISM) Enterprises
ISM Superstore - Tatooine (outside Bestine) -1735, -4917
M Tailor, M Artisan, M Merchant
RaptosKhywalker
Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:01 am
#8

I agree Warcry was too powerful, at least in PvE. I stated this before. What the did tho was break it.


Warcry instigates an attack andit only works on a front cone, if you can hit the mobs while they charge then it's great but even with the clothing I have to boost Warcry it's success rate is low. If you target a mob to WC and it sticksyou best swap that target out realfast or you'll be breaking it again.Considering howlaggy Dant and Dath are on my server you're unlikely to find a use forit that way.


Dizzy will not keep a Mob on the floor, just an NPC and another player. Don't expect that to work after Publish8. This was where Warcry was overpowered, KD a mob delay it for 20 seconds, that's 12k of damage (plus)it's going to take and return none. This does NOT work on players, they can still get up when delayed, they just cannot attack. Why didn't they make mobs/npc's the same way? So Warcry no longer keeps them down?


Warcry was overpowered and now it's just short of useless. I do still find uses for it, I'll try and Warcrymutliple mobs, if it sticks, great. If not I won't wasteHAM on it again that fight. I'd rather Intimidate them all and then area attack than try anddelay one for 20seconds with possibilityI may land an attack before the server registers I've swapped targets and waste the HAMand time I spent apply the Warcry.


No, you're right it is not totally useless but it's effect and cost make it's use expensive for toolittle gain. To the unbuffed player I doubt warcry often figures in their repertoire for PvE.



Well, I told you once, told you twice.
I told you before.
Just 'cause I'm the bad guy, don´t mean I'm gonna lose 'em all
The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my Guild, not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary
WormSeal
Thu Mar 25, 2004 9:25 am
#9
Anyone tested Warcry2 agains mutiple enemies in PvPafter the "nerf"?. In Tempest its so hard to find any groups of rebels so I havnt been abel to test it.


How does it work, do I only have to /warcy one target and everyone in the area get delayed or is it as before that I have to warcy them all?





|||||||||||| Prosac ||||||||||||
||||||||| Bloodmonks |||||||||

/rude SOE
Canceled
Sack Julio Torres!
www.dnl.net
RaptosKhywalker
Thu Mar 25, 2004 10:04 am
#10
Warcry2 was always a cone effect, even before the nerf.Against players it might be difficult to find some dumb enough to all stand close together but you can sometimes delay a large number of Mobs if you get them as they charge before they circle you, once they have surrounded you, unless you burst run away and get them as they chase you won't get more than one of them in it's effect.


Most I ever delayed (pre nerf) was 6 targets...The one I had just KD'd, it's Lair behind it, the Lair some 15-20mtrs behind that and the mobs surrounding their lair...not much good but the "....has been delayed" spam on the screen was kinda funny.





Well, I told you once, told you twice.
I told you before.
Just 'cause I'm the bad guy, don´t mean I'm gonna lose 'em all
The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my Guild, not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary
LordSaibot
Fri Mar 26, 2004 4:58 am
#11
the way you apply it to a crowd is to run away and warcry while retreating. Everything will fall into a fairly single-file line and the cone will hit them all. then you can resume attacking the one of your choice.




Gravis Temav
-LootTrooper-
WormSeal
Fri Mar 26, 2004 1:03 pm
#12
I never noticed any cone effect before the so called Nerf.





|||||||||||| Prosac ||||||||||||
||||||||| Bloodmonks |||||||||

/rude SOE
Canceled
Sack Julio Torres!
www.dnl.net
jkbond
Sat Mar 27, 2004 5:28 am
#13
i never noticed a significatnt difference between the patches, maybe i missed something



Jaycon Tabef - Jedi

"War isn't supposed to be easy. It's hard and the harder the better. Maybe there would be less war if it were just a little harder."



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