Brawler Archive

Hello!

In this thread you are encouraged to spill your guts about any issues you have with the brawler profession. Eventually I will be posting some more focused threads about brawler issues, but for now I would simply like to get acquainted with what brawlers everywhere see as issues with the profession.

In would like to say up front that I would like to keep a line drawn between issues that are more specific to the various elite professions and the brawler profession itself. I expect that to be hard to do however.

It may help to delineate a few different sorts of issues that I think are relevant here:

• Issue specific to those who are simply passing through on their way to an elite profession. I.e. gameplay on that path, balance issues between the four lines, etc.
  
• Brawler-specific content. This includes gameplay, balance and bug issues with intimidate, berserk, warcry, taunt and center of being. This is all the things that aren't simply building up what will be continued in an elite profession.
  
• General balance issues. This might include discussion of balance between ranged and melee players in the GCW, discussion of brawler players abilities to tank, etc.
  
• Discussion of, or bugs with new content. For now this will mean Center of Balance, the active brawler defensive ability now available on Test Center.
  

I've already gleaned several issues simply from reading back posts and such, but I would appreciate you dumping whatever you can into this thread. Post as many issues as you like. Later on I will try to summarise the results and begin some more focused discussions and threads.

Thanks for reading all of this and thank you for your replies,
StGabriel, a.k.a. Flynn and Gaffyn McDonnell

I've recently posted these:

1. We absolutely need a status icon showing when Warcry affects someone. It's simply too hard to read that one little line of type when the combat chat is going by a mile a minute. Especially for those of us who can't touch type (ie - need to look at the keyboard to type). I miss the opportunity to take advantage of my success nearly 65% - closer to 75% when fighting in groups.

2. Why is someone able to RUN if a warcry stops them in their tracks? This is a simple, LOGICAL, pan profession (we all get warcry) solution to atarget moving awayand kiting, while you are spammed with "that target is too far away".... Give it some range - (after all, you can hear a yell from some distance) - bingo, solution to a lot of problems.

Seena

We should get more warcry/intimidate mods somewhere on the brawler tree or along the elite professions.

It just cost too much ham to use the master version of those moves for the amount of times you miss. Either raise the mods or reduce the cost.

There have been times where i missed warcry2 5 times in a row. That cost me 200 ham each time since im wearing full compostie. Good things i have teras kasi buffs or i wouldve been incapacitated by my own move.

Add that to my main profession pikeman with its also high ham costs and i might as well no use any specials at all or i would only be helping the mob kill me.

Oh yeah and fix the toughness on the polearm side to be equal to the other melees. Or at least explain why we dont get as much

master brawler needs utilities akin to those found in the marksman ranged support line. Since there are already 4 trees, those utlities should be added to the exisiting lines.

Firstoff, an unarmed fighter's greatest advantage over the other weapon lines is their speed. So give this line a sort of 'speed boost' special. How about 50% speed increase during 10 seconds at the cost of 100 mind? Using any other special or ability 'breaks' this special attack's effect

1h sword's advantage is its flexibility (damage and speed). So give this tree another 100 mind cost , 10 second duration special that makes any attack hit the target as if the target was intimidated. Using any other special or ability 'breaks' this special attack's effect

2h sword's advantage is its damage.. so give this tree a special that increases damage output by 50% for 10 seconds at 100 mind cost. Using any other special or ability 'breaks' this special attack's effect

Polearm's advantage in-game is no different from the 2h sword... but a polearm is a long weapon.. so how about giving polearms line another 10 second duration, 100 mind cost ability that will KEEP target 10m away from him (out of melee range) and in the meantime the player can hit the target with normal attacks (if another special is used then the effect that keeps the target 10m away breaks).

And, like ranged support has its specials usable by all 3 gun types, these new specials should be usable by all the melee weapon types.

-- another issue is the Unarmed4 being *horribly* frustrating to skill up compared to other lines...which get significant damage increase by getting heavier damage weapons. Unarmed needs to receive something that will either increase their damage or their speed without penalizing damage (as vk's now do due to non-cert). A 'combat glove' made by tailor would do the trick nicely.

-- warcry/ intimidate ham cost too high. Same with most special moves. I have tried a character with 800 stamina and 800 strength and even in this case using more than 4 or 5 specials per fight was near suicide. All melee classes are the equivalent of Carbineers in their ham cost right now.. this is a serious problem for a class that is supposed to be TAKING damage in order to dish out damage (has to be in melee range) and that is practically required to wear ham-reducing armor!

-- need *new* ability at master brawler. lunge2, warcry2, berserk2... nothing really to say 'hey, im master brawler!'. How about giving master brawlers a self-buff to SECONDARY stats (just like tkasi buffs his action/health at the cost of mind... only master brawler should be able to buff strength/stamina at the cost of mind!)

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KaliMirchi wrote:

I've recently posted these:

1. We absolutely need a status icon showing when Warcry affects someone. It's simply too hard to read that one little line of type when the combat chat is going by a mile a minute. Especially for those of us who can't touch type (ie - need to look at the keyboard to type). I miss the opportunity to take advantage of my success nearly 65% - closer to 75% when fighting in groups.

2. Why is someone able to RUN if a warcry stops them in their tracks? This is a simple, LOGICAL, pan profession (we all get warcry) solution to a target moving away and kiting, while you are spammed with "that target is too far away".... Give it some range - (after all, you can hear a yell from some distance) - bingo, solution to a lot of problems.

Seena

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I agree a status icon would be nice for warcry. A tip though for when you use it, if it lands you'll see the icon above you as it hits. If you only see the ham numbers it didn't land, if uyou see ham numbers and the warcry icon floating above you for a second or two then it landed. If you have system messages turned on you'll also see the message on screen saying the results of your status affect moves.

For your second point, very well stated. If warcry is supposed to delay them for 10s, 20s...then that should include movement as well. Would defiantely solve the kite problem. Of course, then all ranged users would cry nerf because we could stop them from kiting

Thanks Rae, I didnt realize the icon in green meant it stuck..... Still, I'd like to see on icon just to monitor duration... heheheh and I do have the status message box active- I miss messages a lot, because I need to look at the keyboard to type.

With respect to warcry stopping someone from moving...well, the success rate isn't 100% - so I guess they'd have nothing to cry nerf over. (Well, they would because more than half of them areimmature twits to begin with)------ Hell, what about it giving a 5 sec delay with movement, while keeping the action at 10 sec?

This is SUCH a simple solution to this problem!

Seena

Personally, I don't care for the idea of Bomerang or any other thrown weapon.

Just uses up another hotkey - of which I'm in short supply as it is.

Making Warcry actually stop the person dead in their tracks would be much easier in terms of programming - and fits in the pre-existing scheme of things.

jmo.

Seena

Unarmed tree needs a unarmed weapon like brass knuckles or a power-glove.

It seems to me that an obvious, and relatively deadly, weapon could be added to the brawler arsenal which would alleviate the difficulty in fighting ranged attack opponents.'

The Boomerang.

These are surpisingly deadly in trained hands. The aborigines in Australia have been bringing large prey down with them since time began. The hunting boomerang is not anything like the sport boomerang, it's heavy, requires experience to use correctly, and leathal. Imagine being hit in the head or neck by 15 pounds of wood with a breaking edge moving at 40 mph.

And then there is always the Feral Kid's boomerang in "The Road Warrior." Metal, razor sharp, requiring a special catcher's glove to recover.

By definition the speed would be slow, flight and recovery are measured in TENS of seconds. It would also be fairly short range, no more than 30 or 40 meters. But it would have a fairly high chance of stunning, so that would make it effective. Of course, a MISS would be devestating to the Brawler, because he's not going to get another attack with it any time soon!

Just something to consider.

For the polearm side of brawler, the Long Vibro Axe should *not* be certified until at or after Novice Pikeman, instead of polearms III. It's the best weapon and because of the infamous range mods is suicide to use at such a low level. Also, I think intimidate and warcry HAM costs are a little too high.

antares
master pikeman

This should apply to brawler (seeing as you get this weapon in the brawler tree). The accuracy modifiers on a long vibro axe are -55 at all ranges at best. I don't see that as being right. Especially with the relatively low accuracy skill modifiers one would have at that point in brawler, a long vibro axe hardly hits. Even as a master pikeman it doesn't hit very often.

i recently got a holocron from a tkm (lol who saw that coming (waits for everyone to raise hand)) and umm at third tier in brawler, i was doing more damage than i did as a full first tier pikeman, seriously, how sad is that? at pikeman i killed banthas for xp, i had to rest after 2 each time, with swordsman, i was only on 2 handed 3 and i was killing 8 at a time before i needed to rest, is it the weapons? YES, is it the general skills? OF COURSE, what do i propose we do? TAKE AWAY THE DEVS DRUGS UNTILL THEY REALIZEHOW MESSED UP PIKEMAN ARE, how can someone with a gun hit more accurately then someone with a stick at 1 meter away? ITS A GIANT OBJECT, i dont think id miss in real life, i shouldnt miss here, ok it vibrates, theyre micro vibrations, its big and heavy, i can drop it on the enemy, and the heavy swordsman multipliier on hit 3 is 4x, we get a 3x, they have more power, they have more speed, and because of some glitch probably, they have more defense, what do we have? well we can hit action, ummm, o wait they get mind, IM FINDING MY TIME AS A SWORDSMAN SOMEWHAT EASIER, seriously devs, look for a little balance, theres a reason were the second least played class in the galaxy, BECAUSE NO ONE CAN EVEN BE A JEDI!!!!, and thats the only reason were not at the bottom, as a combat class we should be near the other melees, not at the bottom

GAMEPLAY

Kiting. By far, this is my greatest gameplay issue. I'm not talking about outright kiting, where the mob, NPC, or player simply runs away from you at the outset. No sir. I'm talking about working your Brawler balls off to get into melee range, land one hit, then get kited due to either (a) mobs/NPC's move at sprinter speeds and (b) client/server sync lets players move at "sprinter" speeds.

Solution. I recommend an unresistable "snare" strike that slows an opponent down to crawl speed. This rewards Brawlers for working their ass off getting into melee range - it lets them actually stand a chance in a fight. I suggest Snare 1 at Novice Brawler that lasts 10s and Snare 2 at Master that lasts 20s (similar to Warcry). My preference is that our Taunt skill be reworked into the Snare skill, as Taunt is rather useless.

Terrain/LOS. I hear this is addressed on TC, but I'd like to hide behind more than just trees, rocks, and buildings. A great weakness of Brawler is that most fights are "open field" despite oodles of nice cover due to LOS being absent from the game engine.

Solution. Implement an LOS system that accounts for broader terrain collision so that Brawlers (and ranged users) have more diverse options to defend themselves.

Taunt. Taunt seems to serve no function other than to drain your mind pool. What does it do?

Solution. Rework Taunt to be our new anti-kite skill, as suggested above.

Berserk. Berserk is generally useless at higher skill levels - the +75 damage boost is not worth the lost ability to execute special moves, heal yourself, or use /peace. Berserk 2 is a particularly bad offender as it locks you in berserk mode fora lengthy time period (anyone havea specific number? I recall 60s).

Solution. Berserk needs to be reworked to give a viable boost to damage output. Either keep the +75 damage but allow other actions (e.g., special moves, heals, or /peace)or restore Berserk to a percent based damage boost and keep the berserk mode penalties.

Balance

Master Brawler. Master Brawler doesn't offer anything that's very attractive. Warcry 2, by far, is the nicest offering, but that's an amazing amount of skill points for a single ability.

Solution. Higherdefensive (ranged, melee, toughness) and offensive(speed, damage, accuracy) bonuses would make Master Brawler more attractive. Right now, bonuses are the same level as you get at Novice Brawler. Double them for Master.

Weapon Accuracy/General Accuracy. Melee (and Pikeman/Heavy Swordsmanin particular) get some horrendous to-hit penalties on their weapons. Essentially these weapons become usable at only the highest skill level, and even then, the miss-rate is overly high compared to ranged professions.

Solution. Need to fix weapon schematics to eliminate those range penalties.

Weapon Balance. Melee weapons, in general, do not scale well. The best weapons are currently obtained in the 1st or 2nd tier certifications. The more advanced weapons turn out crappy due to specific resource requirements, which more often than not, either have horrid stats for melee weapons (e.g., poor shock resistance) or are simply missing requisite attributes (e.g., unit toughness on solid petro).

Solution. Need to fix weapon schematics to balance progression.

Damage variety. Melee classes generally don't have access to the damage variety of out firearm counterparts. Our damage types tend to be the most commonly resisted.

Solution. More damage variety. More weapon variety.