Bounty Hunter Archive
Thread: WTH? Why are Nov BH's pulling better loots than I am?
edited for brevity: stop worrying about my loot. you want my loot do what i am doing. BHs have access to the best loot in this game at the moment. you should not be asking for it to be nerfed because if it is nerfed to a fair level all BHs will suffer greatly. (see DJK/DJM missions)
why should a MBH get a better mission then i do? i am double elite mastery (MR/MCM.) if i take the tough marks i should be rewarded the same as a MBH/MCM/whatever or any other BH. in fact the simple fact that BHs only have access to these incredibly high loot rates seems an imbalance more then the DJK missions where. while only master defender jedi or excellent kiters could solo the DJKs, anyone had the opportunity to do the mission. to makethese missionsMBH only would greaten that disparity.
EdOWar wrote:
This looks like something the Devs overlooked (gee, no surprise there). It sounds like they tied the bounty mission difficulty strictly to CL, instead of tying it to both CL and Investigation skill (which would make more sense from a game-balance standpoint, imo). The loot farmers have already figured this one out...I wonder how long until the credit farmers figure it out (assuming they haven't already).
Slim Vargo, Corbantis
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-200504:57 PM
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-2005 04:57 PM
alephen wrote:
edited for brevity: stop worrying about my loot. you want my loot do what i am doing. BHs have access to the best loot in this game at the moment. you should not be asking for it to be nerfed because if it is nerfed to a fair level all BHs will suffer greatly. (see DJK/DJM missions)
why should a MBH get a better mission then i do? i am double elite mastery (MR/MCM.) if i take the tough marks i should be rewarded the same as a MBH/MCM/whatever or any other BH. in fact the simple fact that BHs only have access to these incredibly high loot rates seems an imbalance more then the DJK missions where. while only master defender jedi or excellent kiters could solo the DJKs, anyone had the opportunity to do the mission. to makethese missionsMBH only would greaten that disparity.
EdOWar wrote:
This looks like something the Devs overlooked (gee, no surprise there). It sounds like they tied the bounty mission difficulty strictly to CL, instead of tying it to both CL and Investigation skill (which would make more sense from a game-balance standpoint, imo). The loot farmers have already figured this one out...I wonder how long until the credit farmers figure it out (assuming they haven't already).
Slim Vargo, Corbantis
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-200504:57 PM
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-2005 04:57 PM
perhaps i misunderstood what you meant in the original post. in fact i want this nerfed for many of the reasons you point out. making the drops ridiculous for only MBHs doesnt solve the problem, it only forces more people to become MBH. i have told my entire guild about it and have started 6-8 people, at least on these missions.
but the response i made was toward the comment that loot should be tied to CL + inv level. that to me would be even worse. the oppurtunity for loot should be relatively even. however this loot system is BH only and is a much higher drop rate then anything i have seen. (i have seen alot.) to make the rate higher for MBHs only makes it more imbalanced and exacerbates the problem you describe. is it better to have basically the same system but force looters like myself to be MBH? that really changes nothing.
EdOWar wrote:
alephen wrote:
edited for brevity: stop worrying about my loot. you want my loot do what i am doing. BHs have access to the best loot in this game at the moment. you should not be asking for it to be nerfed because if it is nerfed to a fair level all BHs will suffer greatly. (see DJK/DJM missions)
why should a MBH get a better mission then i do? i am double elite mastery (MR/MCM.) if i take the tough marks i should be rewarded the same as a MBH/MCM/whatever or any other BH. in fact the simple fact that BHs only have access to these incredibly high loot rates seems an imbalance more then the DJK missions where. while only master defender jedi or excellent kiters could solo the DJKs, anyone had the opportunity to do the mission. to makethese missionsMBH only would greaten that disparity.
EdOWar wrote:
This looks like something the Devs overlooked (gee, no surprise there). It sounds like they tied the bounty mission difficulty strictly to CL, instead of tying it to both CL and Investigation skill (which would make more sense from a game-balance standpoint, imo). The loot farmers have already figured this one out...I wonder how long until the credit farmers figure it out (assuming they haven't already).
Slim Vargo, Corbantis
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-200504:57 PM
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-200504:57 PM
You have a good point about other double elite combat professions not being able to get the same loot. That isn't fair. If they're going to give this kind of loot to BH's, they should change it so that any double elite profession can get similar loot through other means. That's only fair.
The reason it should be nerfed (and will be eventually, regardless of what I write here) is that it's bad game design. It's bad for the game's economy, makes farming way too easy (not just loot farming, but credit farming as well, which most people will agree is a bad thing). It also trivializes the bounty hunter profession, creating a situation where it is actually better to be a novice of the profession, instead of mastering it. That makes no sense at all. Also, why would the toughest marks in the galaxy just be hanging out a few meters from the mission terminal. Logically, these people would be heading to the most remote planets to avoid bounty hunters.
Loot is only special because it's rare. However, eventuallymost people will do what you're doing, then all the ph4t l3wts you're getting won't be worth a damn because everyone will have them. And a ridiculous amount of credits will enter the economy becauseeveryone will do30K mission by running 200 meters and killing one target...rinse and repeat ad naseum. That's worse than the old days of solo-group missions.
I hope you can see how this is bad for the game in the long run, no matter how good it may be for your bank account right now.
Slim Vargo, Corbantis
alephen wrote:
perhaps i misunderstood what you meant in the original post. in fact i want this nerfed for many of the reasons you point out. making the drops ridiculous for only MBHs doesnt solve the problem, it only forces more people to become MBH. i have told my entire guild about it and have started 6-8 people, at least on these missions.
but the response i made was toward the comment that loot should be tied to CL + inv level. that to me would be even worse. the oppurtunity for loot should be relatively even. however this loot system is BH only and is a much higher drop rate then anything i have seen. (i have seen alot.) to make the rate higher for MBHs only makes it more imbalanced and exacerbates the problem you describe. is it better to have basically the same system but force looters like myself to be MBH? that really changes nothing.
Unfortunately, it is better to basically have the same system, but force looters to be master BH. The major difference between the novice looters that have been described and the master BH looters is that a novice looter does not need droids to seek out their targets. A novice looter also always stays on the same planet, and can accomplish his mission with taking advantage of the situtation. (See novice investigation grinding. going to tyrena, having the mission terminal up, and the spyops guy close by. You can effectively have all missions either 200 meters from you, or right next to a shuttleport) A novice mission can run anywhere from 30 seconds to 5 minutes tops.
A master bh usually has to go to a different planet. Has to use droids to find and track their targets. May have a mission that is 5k from the nearest starport/shuttleport. Depending on these situations, a mission can run anywhere from 5 minutes to 30 minutes.
Even if the loot drops are the same between master bh and novice. (I don't think they are. By what I am getting in this string of posts, sounds like novice bh's are getting a aa/ca every few drops 5-10. As a master bh, I get an aa/ca every 20-30 drops.) The time difference and the benefit of time vs great drop is enough to be an imbalance.
so it is ok for MBHs to get more loot then any other profession? that messes up the economy in just the same way, you can argue on degree, but not principle. the way it should be: every lvl 80 full templated toon should have roughly the same ability to loot, with equiptment, skill, and dedication to it (i.e. time spent) being the determining factors.
to make BH the 'loot class,' which is what it currently is, is riduclous. BH should be the best PvP, PvNPC elite class out there. but balance cannot allow it to be this AND the best looting elite class AND the only elite class to have content.
i have 2 elite masteries, if i kill 5 level 82 35k ham bosses, i should get the same thing as you do if you kill 5 level 82 35k ham bosses. no less. if i am more efficient then you, then you can choose to do what i do. if you choose to not do it, fine that is your choice.
i am NBH because i want to loot, if you want to loot then go NBH. if you choose to be a MBH then that is your choice, you should be no more rewarded for it then if you chose any other classes yet you still have better loot then the tkm/pike/swords guys out there.
alephen wrote:so it is ok for MBHs to get more loot then any other profession? that messes up the economy in just the same way, you can argue on degree, but not principle. the way it should be: every lvl 80 full templated toon should have roughly the same ability to loot, with equiptment, skill, and dedication to it (i.e. time spent) being the determining factors.
to make BH the 'loot class,' which is what it currently is, is riduclous. BH should be the best PvP, PvNPC elite class out there. but balance cannot allow it to be this AND the best looting elite class AND the only elite class to have content.
i have 2 elite masteries, if i kill 5 level 82 35k ham bosses, i should get the same thing as you do if you kill 5 level 82 35k ham bosses. no less. if i am more efficient then you, then you can choose to do what i do. if you choose to not do it, fine that is your choice.
i am NBH because i want to loot, if you want to loot then go NBH. if you choose to be a MBH then that is your choice, you should be no more rewarded for it then if you chose any other classes yet you still have better loot then the tkm/pike/swords guys out there.
The point is, there is no reason why a novice should be better rewarded than a master. Master should get to reap the rewards after the hard work of getting there. Despite the fact the many have respeced their way there. I only respeced to MBH because the option was given to me. Had it not been given to me, yet still been a profession that could fit with smuggler, yes, I would have worked my way up the tree anyhow.
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-2005 08:41 PM
There should be levels. Defined by the mastery of professions. Master Rifleman should get better rewards than Novice Rifleman, and so on. But there is no reason for somebody to pick up Novice Bounty Hunter and get Master Bounty Hunter perks. That's like a Master Artisan / Master Droid Engineer picking up Novice weaponsmith and making top level weapons, putting the Master Weaponsmith out of business. If you actually stop and think about it, instead of coming in here and
Each combat profession should have something at master that separates them from novice. Loot tables should a part of that. Riflemen should have something, Creature harvesters, etc... But nobody should be able to pop in and grab novice and have it easier than the masters.
Message Edited by Dosi on 08-16-2005 10:01 PM
novice BHs have always had it easier then MBH*, why is it a problem now? because someone is get more rich then you. if you really believe that all classes should have something to equal the money making power of BHs then you wshould have stated that all BH loot MUST be nerfed until every class has the ability to get this kind of loot. loot is not something you craft, the payouts can be compared to that, not loots.
you are mad that someone with NBH can make more money then you. you are ignoring the 90% of combat professions that cannot make as much money as you because you do not care about them. it is not about fairness it is about you getting yours.
if this is not true then all you have to do to prove it is provide the link where you have argued that novice BHs should cap at 2k inv xp, or something similar.
*look in FAQ it says, i am sure, cap your investigation at 10k before training and train inv 1 and 2. why, becuase no investigation is much more efficient to get xp with then inv 1 or 2. if BHs capped higher the suggestion would be to get all the xp at novice and train all 4 together. where do you think i learned to do this? thats right, when i was grinding MBH the start of 2004
Message Edited by alephen on 08-16-2005 09:05 PM
alephen wrote:
so it is ok for MBHs to get more loot then any other profession? that messes up the economy in just the same way, you can argue on degree, but not principle. the way it should be: every lvl 80 full templated toon should have roughly the same ability to loot, with equiptment, skill, and dedication to it (i.e. time spent) being the determining factors.
to make BH the 'loot class,' which is what it currently is, is riduclous. BH should be the best PvP, PvNPC elite class out there. but balance cannot allow it to be this AND the best looting elite class AND the only elite class to have content.
i have 2 elite masteries, if i kill 5 level 82 35k ham bosses, i should get the same thing as you do if you kill 5 level 82 35k ham bosses. no less. if i am more efficient then you, then you can choose to do what i do. if you choose to not do it, fine that is your choice.
i am NBH because i want to loot, if you want to loot then go NBH. if you choose to be a MBH then that is your choice, you should be no more rewarded for it then if you chose any other classes yet you still have better loot then the tkm/pike/swords guys out there.
I like your line of thinking. With that, since I am jedi, and level 80. i should be automatically able to hunt NPC BH marks. I should also be able to wear armor. And be able to be very adept at shooting a rifle and carbine. I should also be able to get novice medic and be able to heal like a master doc/CM.
No wait that is different. Since I am a jedi. I should be able to get novice powers, and have cloak and lightning. I should also be able to get novice healer and get full heals. I have novice enhancer, so I should be able to get force armor, meditate, and force run 3. The other two I jedi skills I have masteries in. so it's the same right?
Or that as a novice artisan I can make AV-21s?
Or be a master defender at the padawan level?
Make uber armor at novice armorsmith?
All this is mine for the taking IF I have two master professions?