Bounty Hunter Archive
Thread: Tanks, now that only MBH get Jedi missions...
Ahh but there within lies your answer Jedi_Xan. All those things you mention have the answer there.
Ok except for the Assault armour 
To me it makes no sense that a 'tank' profession, as per the combat upgrade overview, shouldn't wear 'tank' armour. To me they should have had Battle Armour. That's one point i'll give ya, however, you're not specifically made to only wear one type of armour. No more than a pistoleer is made to use one set of armour. You can just as easily pick up another profession and gain another armour certification.
MBH has rifles, carbs and pistols. Commando's have acid rifles, lightning rifles, flame throwers, grenades, launcher pistols. Know the difference? MBH has a master cert weapon for every weapon they have. Commando's have 1, and one that doesn't use mod's in their profession. Is there a desparity there? You be the judge.
Bounty hunters are the only profession that is given the 'opportunity' to hunt the supposed alpha class. Truthfully I cholse Bounty Hunter not, because I could hunt jedi. It's because Bounty Hunter gave more Mod's to my character than picking 2 other elite professions. To me thats just BS.
Sure BH's hunt Jedi, but that doesn't mean they should get everything. If thats the case, I want weapon mods for my creature handler in creature handler, and I want some weapon skills to use also (ranged/melee please). I also want some healing since my pet's can't hold aggro for shinzer and these monsters tend to beat me up badly 
I could go on and on with this
TatterSalad wrote:
Valkyrie36 wrote:
Jedi_Xan wrote:
wildcard1973 wrote:
Jedi_Xan wrote:
I have killed a 226k mark. Albeit, I had one helper, but he wasnt even level 60. I am frustrated because everytime I turn around, they get more and we get less.
Why does a BH have ASSAULT : IE KINETIC resist armor. What kind of friggin joke was that.
Oh and lets go there.
We HAVE MBH specific RIFLES, CARBS, AND PISTOLS... Who else? NONE.
We are the ONLY profession that hunts an ALPHA class. Who else? NONE. Not unless they have BH
We are the ONLY profession that hunts primarily against ENERGY damaging targets, yet we have KINETIC armor. THAT is BS.
And once again, since you're learning impaired...if you were force ro only have BH skills, you'd have a complaint, but you can supplement with any number of other professions, and boost your offense, defense, or crowd control abilities....as well as get other armor certs. YOU CHOSE NOT TOO. Stop asking the Dev team to make the choices for you.
Learning Impaired. Lets see, YOU don't have to supplement your Jedi skills. YOU don't have to worry about being a master doc. Jedi can heal themselves, heal their wounds, infuse force, channel force, innate armor, force shields, valor, aura, the have a built in cloaking device, lightning, lightsabers that CUT through ASSAULT armor. ....
OH wait, that means that YOU can beat a BH.... OH, well, now I understand. If it is a challenge to you, then ABSOLUTELY NOT, OUT of the question. CANT HAPPEN, cause JEDI are UBER.
Oh, God, I am not in the mood for this crap. Isnt it funny that it is JEDI who scream the loudest. It is bad enough we have to PAY for our defenses, your come innate with your SKILLS. But you want to make dam sure that you can never be beated 1 v 1.
Jedi piss me the hell off.
First and foremost... we have the wrong armor type. We should get Energy armor, not Kinetic. That is botched.
Second, we need at least 2 novice skill trees to get MBH, that is 30 points invested. How many do Jedi need? 24?
Third, I am a MRifle also, and even with MBH/MRifle, I still have that little gun appear under my HAM everytime I use a weapon, even a rifle. So does everyone else.
If I have to take whatever mission without knowing who it is, then I want to be able to know that as a MBH, I can confidently stand up to a full template jedi and give him a good fight. Right now, I have to spend a million on food and 4 million on armor to accomplish this. You dont. All you need is to turn on your macros, and you are good to go.
Heres the deal..if you have a Jedithat can heal themselves, heal their wounds, infuse force, channel force, innate armor, force shields, valor, aura, the have a built in cloaking device, lightningyou have a Jedi with 1 sp left. This Jedi will have no defences against states, no offence other than lightning (ie..NO LIGHTSABER) and couldn't even run up a small hill.
We all have to make sacrifices to get skills we really want.
Right on valkyrie, I laugh when I read these posts were people have no idea what they are talking about.
Message Edited by Valkyrie36 on 07-05-2005 11:41 AM
Let me try to help you out and be a little more friendly about it. Just as an FYI a jedi can pull two full professions and half of another before they run out of skill points. let me show you the problem you run into with your above statement.
Jedi_Xan wrote:
wildcard1973 wrote:
Jedi_Xan wrote:
I have killed a 226k mark. Albeit, I had one helper, but he wasnt even level 60. I am frustrated because everytime I turn around, they get more and we get less.
Why does a BH have ASSAULT : IE KINETIC resist armor. What kind of friggin joke was that.
Oh and lets go there.
We HAVE MBH specific RIFLES, CARBS, AND PISTOLS... Who else? NONE.
We are the ONLY profession that hunts an ALPHA class. Who else? NONE. Not unless they have BH
We are the ONLY profession that hunts primarily against ENERGY damaging targets, yet we have KINETIC armor. THAT is BS.
And once again, since you're learning impaired...if you were force ro only have BH skills, you'd have a complaint, but you can supplement with any number of other professions, and boost your offense, defense, or crowd control abilities....as well as get other armor certs. YOU CHOSE NOT TOO. Stop asking the Dev team to make the choices for you.
Learning Impaired. Lets see, YOU don't have to supplement your Jedi skills. YOU don't have to worry about being a master doc. Jedi can heal themselves, heal their wounds, infuse force, channel force, innate armor, force shields, valor, aura, the have a built in cloaking device, lightning, lightsabers that CUT through ASSAULT armor. ....
OH wait, that means that YOU can beat a BH.... OH, well, now I understand. If it is a challenge to you, then ABSOLUTELY NOT, OUT of the question. CANT HAPPEN, cause JEDI are UBER.
Oh, God, I am not in the mood for this crap. Isnt it funny that it is JEDI who scream the loudest. It is bad enough we have to PAY for our defenses, your come innate with your SKILLS. But you want to make dam sure that you can never be beated 1 v 1.
Jedi piss me the hell off.
First and foremost... we have the wrong armor type. We should get Energy armor, not Kinetic. That is botched.
Second, we need at least 2 novice skill trees to get MBH, that is 30 points invested. How many do Jedi need? 24?
Third, I am a MRifle also, and even with MBH/MRifle, I still have that little gun appear under my HAM everytime I use a weapon, even a rifle. So does everyone else.
If I have to take whatever mission without knowing who it is, then I want to be able to know that as a MBH, I can confidently stand up to a full template jedi and give him a good fight. Right now, I have to spend a million on food and 4 million on armor to accomplish this. You dont. All you need is to turn on your macros, and you are good to go.
Jedi_Xan wrote:
Now, lets take a look see...typical FOTMMDEF/MLS/ENH xxx2/HEAL 3xxx
What does this do?
Force Aura, Force Valor, Inate Jedi Armor, and Avoid Incap. (MDEF)
Ranged KD, Melee KD, ARMOR break, and Attacks for every state under the sun. (MLS)
Healer 3xxx (Force Infusion) oh, lets not even get started, kk.
ENH xxx2 -- Channel Force, Force Shield, Force Wave (oh, how nifty, they get a snare too).
Even before you start, a BH has to deal with 255 melee, and 235 ranged defense. Add in BE clothing/CA's with +25 melee/ranged defenses, and that raises the bar to 280 melee and 260 ranged defense. Now, lets add all the force defenses, and the jedi is now uintouchable. They will take a BH's 1100 damage rifle and reduce it to a pea shooter. Combine that with 1500 heals every what? 9 seconds? and then add Channel force. Oh great, now they'll never run outta force. Not before the BH's mind is shot from healing, or the BH's stomach gets full, or the BH's action bar is reduced to fumes.
Jedi are elevated on every level. It is not, nor will it ever be a 1 v 1 fight. If placed on a level playing field, BH v Jedi is a no brainer. Even a skilled BH cant take on a Knight by himself.
Once again your ineptness shines through, since 3000 healer will give you 1K Max heals, not 1500, and you need at least 400 health and 40% in action and mind too channel. Infusion lasts for 60 second and costs 12% mind to use, as does force heal......and to top it off you said ALL Jedi have the abilities you listed, then you followed up with one possible template.
Oh and BTW a you don't ave to worry about a Jedi having 255 melee defense, since as a BH, rifleman you shouldn't be using a melee weapon. Maybe that's the actual reason you're haivng so much trouble.
so basically the OP is saying in the immortally words of Freddie Mercury, "I want it all"
Ya just gotta love Queen
Just another quick note, if you read my sig, you will see my Jedi's template. I have many of the skills you are referring to, but I also have many weaknesses and my offensive abilities are very limited. I don't have a single mastery and as such my force pool suffers. I don't recieve the full benefit of any of my skills because I have mastered none. My strength is in my ability to use the majority of the skills available even though at a reduced effectiveness if used at the right times it can be very beneficial to be that flexible. I chose the flexibility as opposed to strength and my force pool. Many others chose their skill sets differently and will be much better than I am in specific circumstances.
I rarely win my battles against expereinced BH's but I also rarely lose. What this means is that I escape. I chose to build my template for survival not to conquer. I have a large variety of skills which can allow me to survive just about any BH attack unless caught completely off guard. That is where being a BH comes in handy, you have the ability to wait until the time is right, I can not attack you until you have initiated combat, so you decide when to attack and you have the option of waiting to try and catch me off guard. But in my case you get one attempt, if you do not get me in your first attempt I can and will escape nearly any BH.
That being said, you do not see my BH template listed in my sig (simply no room for it) but with my BH I have the skills to kill nearly anyJedi within 2-3 shots if I catch them at the right moment, yes this even includes master defenders so long as they don't have avoid incap running. Half of my BH's ability lays in his template, the other half lays in his equipment, and absolutely none if it is worth anything at all if I don't understand how best to use it. I still have much to learn, and still need to work on patience if I really want to succeed at hunting. Currently hunting is more of a hobby for me than a profession because I lack the majority of the patience needed in order to really succeed. When I am in the mood I will go out and stalk my prey and yes I have had a couple outings where I literally spent hours hunting and watching them waiting for the opportune moment to strike.
Learn more about the professions you hunt, and learn more about your own professions. "with knowledge comes power" and this is particularly true in being a bounty hunter. I have seen BH's that were significantly better than me take out marks with far lower quality equipment than I use. It is the knowledge and understanding that will help you win, your gear while important has far less impact on your success than knowledge and experience do.
Message Edited by jason67 on 07-05-2005 12:04 PM
Now, lets take a look see...typical FOTMMDEF/MLS/ENH xxx2/HEAL 3xxx
What does this do?
Force Aura, Force Valor, Inate Jedi Armor, and Avoid Incap. (MDEF)
Ranged KD, Melee KD, ARMOR break, and Attacks for every state under the sun. (MLS)
Healer 3xxx (Force Infusion) oh, lets not even get started, kk.
ENH xxx2 -- Channel Force, Force Shield, Force Wave (oh, how nifty, they get a snare too).
Even before you start, a BH has to deal with 255 melee, and 235 ranged defense. Add in BE clothing/CA's with +25 melee/ranged defenses, and that raises the bar to 280 melee and 260 ranged defense. Now, lets add all the force defenses, and the jedi is now uintouchable. They will take a BH's 1100 damage rifle and reduce it to a pea shooter. Combine that with 1500 heals every what? 9 seconds? and then add Channel force. Oh great, now they'll never run outta force. Not before the BH's mind is shot from healing, or the BH's stomach gets full, or the BH's action bar is reduced to fumes.
Jedi are elevated on every level. It is not, nor will it ever be a 1 v 1 fight. If placed on a level playing field, BH v Jedi is a no brainer. Even a skilled BH cant take on a Knight by himself.
Jedi_Xan wrote:
Now, lets take a look see...typical FOTMMDEF/MLS/ENH xxx2/HEAL 3xxx
What does this do?
Force Aura, Force Valor, Inate Jedi Armor, and Avoid Incap. (MDEF)
Ranged KD, Melee KD, ARMOR break, and Attacks for every state under the sun. (MLS)
Healer 3xxx (Force Infusion) oh, lets not even get started, kk.
ENH xxx2 -- Channel Force, Force Shield, Force Wave (oh, how nifty, they get a snare too).
Even before you start, a BH has to deal with 255 melee, and 235 ranged defense. Add in BE clothing/CA's with +25 melee/ranged defenses, and that raises the bar to 280 melee and 260 ranged defense. Now, lets add all the force defenses, and the jedi is now uintouchable. They will take a BH's 1100 damage rifle and reduce it to a pea shooter. Combine that with 1500 heals every what? 9 seconds? and then add Channel force. Oh great, now they'll never run outta force. Not before the BH's mind is shot from healing, or the BH's stomach gets full, or the BH's action bar is reduced to fumes.
Jedi are elevated on every level. It is not, nor will it ever be a 1 v 1 fight. If placed on a level playing field, BH v Jedi is a no brainer. Even a skilled BH cant take on a Knight by himself.
this is all very true, but if you play your BH right and get one of us with this template off guard you can easy take us down. what you all seem to forget is Channel eats a lot of health action and mind each time we use it. We still have to use foods too. And yes our force gets low. So is it easy to kill a completed Jedi... NO and it should not be. Jedi are supposed to be strong. Avoid Incapp now snares the hell out of us and takes a crap load of Force.
Jedi_Xan wrote:
Now, lets take a look see...typical FOTMMDEF/MLS/ENH xxx2/HEAL 3xxx
What does this do?
Force Aura, Force Valor, Inate Jedi Armor, and Avoid Incap. (MDEF)
Ranged KD, Melee KD, ARMOR break, and Attacks for every state under the sun. (MLS)
Healer 3xxx (Force Infusion) oh, lets not even get started, kk.
ENH xxx2 -- Channel Force, Force Shield, Force Wave (oh, how nifty, they get a snare too).
Even before you start, a BH has to deal with 255 melee, and 235 ranged defense. Add in BE clothing/CA's with +25 melee/ranged defenses, and that raises the bar to 280 melee and 260 ranged defense. Now, lets add all the force defenses, and the jedi is now uintouchable. They will take a BH's 1100 damage rifle and reduce it to a pea shooter. Combine that with 1500 heals every what? 9 seconds? and then add Channel force. Oh great, now they'll never run outta force. Not before the BH's mind is shot from healing, or the BH's stomach gets full, or the BH's action bar is reduced to fumes.
Jedi are elevated on every level. It is not, nor will it ever be a 1 v 1 fight. If placed on a level playing field, BH v Jedi is a no brainer. Even a skilled BH cant take on a Knight by himself.
This templates weekness is mobility...dont let it get within 32m of you while you continue to damage it.
I would say a MBH/MCM/0004 Pistoleer would have a fighting chance to DOT, control movement and stay alive with this template. 3xxx healing heals for 1000 not 1500 btw and it uses mind and force to heal. A MCM can outheal a 3xxx Healer anyday of the week now. Also..channel only gives a small amount for force back, but uses 33% of the Action and Mind pool to use it, so a Jedi using channel in a battle is a good sign your about to win....especially if you have skills to reduce its mind and action regens like an MCM has.
While your current template may have trouble with this Jedi...others can be tailored to be better at battling it. You do not expect to have an all around BH template that can defeat all permutations of Jedi do you? Jedi can't even do that...
Message Edited by Valkyrie36 on 07-05-2005 12:35 PM
Message Edited by Valkyrie36 on 07-05-2005 12:36 PM
wildcard1973 wrote:
Once again your ineptness shines through, since 3000 healer will give you 1K Max heals, not 1500, and you need at least 400 health and 40% in action and mind too channel. Infusion lasts for 60 second and costs 12% mind to use, as does force heal......and to top it off you said ALL Jedi have the abilities you listed, then you followed up with one possible template.
Oh and BTW a you don't ave to worry about a Jedi having 255 melee defense, since as a BH, rifleman you shouldn't be using a melee weapon. Maybe that's the actual reason you're haivng so much trouble.
blah blah blah, yada yada..... 1000... 1500... what difference does it make. For me to have a chance against you I have to invest in Offensive skills, and buy me defense up, which leaves little room for a measley bacta shot worth 400 pts. Stim D's and ruby work, but only for a very short time.
Basically, Jedi mitigate 80% or more damage and outheal the rest. We have to invest most every SP to be able to apply what damage we do, and even that isnt enough. We make a request to ask for some simple things to "help" level the playing field, and we are basically ignored. And since you are Jedi, then I basically discount every word out of your mouth as politically motivated hodge podge because you are afraid that if BH's get any real power or abilities then you will no longer be able to pwn the kiddies and show off in the square..
If we are forced to 1v1, then we should be able to beat you 1v1.
Message Edited by Jedi_Xan on 07-06-2005 08:03 AM
The thing I dont' like is that it completely gets rid of melee BH's! I almost think there should be a new profession for the melee type of BH! Why must all bh's be ranged? Not everyone is the same so why make them to be so! They should have a new profession that is like ranged Bh but instead of having a pistols row they have a swordsman row or pikeman row! Just an idea... back to the argument you guys/gals are having.
Giving certs of all armors would not only be cheap but not right. Anyone can wear any armor they want... they just have hinderance of some sort. jedi don't get that luxary.. if you want to wear that armor you can... you will just walk/shoot a little slower. If jedi wear it.. they can't do ANY MOVES!!! NOT ONE! so I say, stick it up and learn to deal with it! Right now, MBH/MCM or MBH/MDOC is about the cheapest combo in the game. so stop crying and learn to play with new rules like everyone else in this game has had to do for 2 years now!
Just remember what it used to be back in the day when BH's were pathetic. I am sure the dev's could return that if you wish! so live with your upgrade and not a downgrade!
Message Edited by anruth on 07-06-2005 06:22 AM
anruth wrote:
LMFAO! wow, I have had a bh for a bit and I also have a jedi! I don't think Bh's need to have all armors! you can get MBH with other professions as well!
The thing I dont' like is that it completely gets rid of melee jedi! I almost think there should be a new profession for the melee type of BH! Why must all bh's be ranged? Not everyone is the same so why make them to be so! They should have a new profession that is like ranged Bh but instead of having a pistols row they have a swordsman row or pikeman row! Just an idea... back to the argument you guys/gals are having.
Giving certs of all armors would not only be cheap but not right. Anyone can wear any armor they want... they just have hinderance of some sort. jedi don't get that luxary.. if you want to wear that armor you can... you will just walk/shoot a little slower. If jedi wear it.. they can't do ANY MOVES!!! NOT ONE! so I say, stick it up and learn to deal with it! Right now, MBH/MCM or MBH/MDOC is about the cheapest combo in the game. so stop crying and learn to play with new rules like everyone else in this game has had to do for 2 years now!
Just remember what it used to be back in the day when BH's were pathetic. I am sure the dev's could return that if you wish! so live with your upgrade and not a downgrade!
nevermind that jedi have innate armor. geez. why do you need armor anyway.
BH's are classified wrong. They have assault armor certs, which is mainly a hunting type armor. It should be battle armor, at the least, since that offers higher resists against what BH's fight most, energy. This is borked and needs to be fixed.
Besides, unlike other professions, BH's should (rightly so) be versatile. We should be able to use dirty tricks, which we really dont have. What about traps. Why cant traps be used on NPC's? All these things that BH's should have, but don't. And yet we are expected to solo against FT Jedi who are at least 1.5 times stronger.