Bounty Hunter Archive
Thread: Link for Why DPS means nothing
based on my tests a weapon with higher dps and lower max dmg (better speed) outdamaged a weapon with lower dps and a higher max damage (worse speed).
there was a difference in speed after 10 shots using two specials to toggle between and the difference was directly correlated by the speed on my weapons. And this difference more than made up for the lack of total damage since I could get off another shot. So the dps is accurate it seems.
CaixCatab wrote:
DPS is calculated by (min + max) /2. In a system where the chance of hitting anywhere in that interval is the same, the DPS will provide an accurate reflection on the damage you will (statistically speaking) deal.
In a system where the chance of dealing damage in the amount ofany given number within that interval is not random, such as the system we have now, it means jack all. Whether CD timers are affected by speed or not; Where damage dealt is decided by max damage rather than a random dice roll, the formula used for calculating the DPS displayed on the weapons is incorrect.
damage is influenced by accuracy and defense mods and the product depends on the min and max of the weapon.
VexXev wrote:
i went for a new approach. A lot of people want SAC to be 90 or lower. I said forget that and went pure dmg/speed. I made my self a laser rifle with 955 moddified dps (unsliced with pup)and 132 sac. Specials are called specials for a reason. I start shooting with specials, then switch to the basic attack to regenerate then hit really hard, really fast. I am very happy with the results. I tried a powerup that lowered the SAC to 95, but it was much slower and didn't work as good. The standard attack still does good dmg especially when you attack really fast.
Thats sometimes true for rifles because they are slower, so you want as much damage as possible. However, for a pistols that shoot around 1 second, your screwed.
EldosAirheart wrote:
VexXev wrote:
i went for a new approach. A lot of people want SAC to be 90 or lower. I said forget that and went pure dmg/speed. I made my self a laser rifle with 955 moddified dps (unsliced with pup)and 132 sac. Specials are called specials for a reason. I start shooting with specials, then switch to the basic attack to regenerate then hit really hard, really fast. I am very happy with the results. I tried a powerup that lowered the SAC to 95, but it was much slower and didn't work as good. The standard attack still does good dmg especially when you attack really fast.
Thats sometimes true for rifles because they are slower, so you want as much damage as possible. However, for a pistols that shoot around 1 second, your screwed.
with 172 overall pistol speed, i can truely say , you are right since i'm firing "basic attack" at basicly 1 second intervals and can chain my most of my specials at 1.25. I do know that with rifles ( that are slower and so modified atttack speed are higher) it is diferent.
Alristico wrote:
damage is influenced by accuracy and defense mods and the product depends on the min and max of the weapon.
CaixCatab wrote:
Alristico wrote:
damage is influenced by accuracy and defense mods and the product depends on the min and max of the weapon.
Have you tested that? Some guy in the pistoleer forum tried a bunch of different guns and noted that they all appeared to hit at 95% of the max damage with whatever-special against whatever-mob. Min damage appeared completely irrelevant to the result, which meant DPS (that takes min damage into account) on the weapon was for from accurate in describing the gun with the biggest mayhem potential.
Alristico wrote:
Based on tests I've just done, the info in this post is incorrect. Speed does modify the cooldown timers.
based on my tests a weapon with higher dps and lower max dmg (better speed) outdamaged a weapon with lower dps and a higher max damage (worse speed).
there was a difference in speed after 10 shots using two specials to toggle between and the difference was directly correlated by the speed on my weapons. And this difference more than made up for the lack of total damage since I could get off another shot. So the dps is accurate it seems.
This is what I've found as well. For my tests I used a carbine and a rifle. The rifle had a slower mod speed since I had no rifle speed mods and for both weapons I used Adv Critical Shot. Looking at the time-stamped combat spam, I was firing ACS every 4-to-5 seconds with my carb but every 5-6 seconds with my rifle.
Granted, these tests where simply for myself so I don't have any screenies or the like to use as evidence, but from what I've seen the CD timer is influenced by speed.
What I'm not sure about is whether or not speed influences your basic CD timer. If you've noticed, you can fire off a different special while waiting for your primary to cool down (I think this is what the tester meant by alternating specials). In my case it's Imp Leg Shot while waiting for ACS. However, when I use ILS, I still have to wait for my basic CD timer (the timer that ticks around the specials' iconsyou aren't using). So if the basic CD timer is set at a static speed regardless of your mods, then yes, DPA would be key. But like I said, I haven't bothered to test this yet.
my test was using two specials and the basic CD was what was affected by the speed difference of the modified speed stat on the weapons. I think maybe its harder to tell a difference in the basic CD because the time difference is smaller, thats why I used a larger data set (10 shots) to magnify the difference.
SamousNemo wrote:
Alristico wrote:
Based on tests I've just done, the info in this post is incorrect. Speed does modify the cooldown timers.
based on my tests a weapon with higher dps and lower max dmg (better speed) outdamaged a weapon with lower dps and a higher max damage (worse speed).
there was a difference in speed after 10 shots using two specials to toggle between and the difference was directly correlated by the speed on my weapons. And this difference more than made up for the lack of total damage since I could get off another shot. So the dps is accurate it seems.
This is what I've found as well. For my tests I used a carbine and a rifle. The rifle had a slower mod speed since I had no rifle speed mods and for both weapons I used Adv Critical Shot. Looking at the time-stamped combat spam, I was firing ACS every 4-to-5 seconds with my carb but every 5-6 seconds with my rifle.
Granted, these tests where simply for myself so I don't have any screenies or the like to use as evidence, but from what I've seen the CD timer is influenced by speed.
What I'm not sure about is whether or not speed influences your basic CD timer. If you've noticed, you can fire off a different special while waiting for your primary to cool down (I think this is what the tester meant by alternating specials). In my case it's Imp Leg Shot while waiting for ACS. However, when I use ILS, I still have to wait for my basic CD timer (the timer that ticks around the specials' iconsyou aren't using). So if the basic CD timer is set at a static speed regardless of your mods, then yes, DPA would be key. But like I said, I haven't bothered to test this yet.