Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Had yet another Chef telling me that 25K is 'a fair price' for crated BSNs...
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PurpleWarrior
Wed Jul 14, 2004 10:47 am
#79
JohnnieFed wrote:
I paid 50-75k for each Schematic. I do not understand why other BE's do not do that as well. I see it as a fair trade. I paid for all the resources.. the meat the other organics, He did not have to supply those at all.
*coughs and splutters*
Taking trade away from BEs who actually want to make BSNs, and make decent profits and someone was willing to do it for 50-75K?
I wouldn't log in for that much, let alone make a schematic.
The profit for a BE who actually puts in the work is decent, if people will buy his stuff. BEs making cheap schematics for even cheaper chefs is just harming other BEs, in my opinion of course...
Meplorium
Wed Jul 14, 2004 11:06 am
#80
Dsabre wrote:
they also don't like being told what they should charge, I don't think ANY crafter likes being told that..what if a rifleman came up to you and demanded you sell him ahrisa for 40k a crate, or brandy for 70k cause his PA buddy sold him some for that much. haggling is different, but still after a while of that it does get annoying.
I get that all the time. Case in point, when vehciles came out I had a set price of 4cpu on them. They take a lot of metal so I had to buy it all. I bought decent stuff at 3 cpu. Another master artisan in a neighboring town was charging 2cpu for hers. They were made of cheap materials, but were still cheap. I got all kinds of hate tells on my pricing on those, even though they were very very modest prices.
This happens all the time, no matter what profession you are. It is to be expected. The only way to not get those pricing hate tellsis to be the one that is dumpingthe cheap stuff at stupidly low prices. Then no one will complain to you, cept maybe other crafters. That is just how it is. If you had someone selling meat to you for 4 cpu and they stopped harvesting and you had to buy from someone else for 15cpu you would be upset and wanting it cheaper. That is only natural and getting upset at the suppliers or the customers wanting a past deal they had with someone else isn't useful. Just expect it and deal with it. The other option is to get a bunch of accounts, make all your own stuff, then run missions in your own solo group for cash. You wouldn't have to deal with anyone then.
The key is to find good deals and enjoy them when you do. If you find someone selling 20k of meat for 4 cpu, buy it on the spot. If you find a chef willing to buy additives for 40k a crate, then set that arrangement up in a hurry. Enjoy the great deal while it last. There are far more bad deals out there than good ones and it takes work and luck to get the good deals. You will always get under cut eventually. Everyone is on the look out for a better deal. That is Chef that is getting those 40k additives will eventually find them for 30k. That BE that is selling their additives for 30k will eventually find a chef paying 40k. That is just how business works. Part of the game.
Cliffy
Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:58 pm
#81
really dont like the selling of schematics AT ALL...just doesnt make sense imho...hopefully devs will get rid of it...takes away from the ppl that actually want to sell & thats why I chose not to do this even tho it is quick money by doing almost nothing
Spazzers
Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:05 pm
#82
I must say, I go away from the forums for a few months and come back to the exact same discussions as when I left.
The chef - BE relationship hasn't changed a bit since chef tissues were created. Chefs are mad because they have to rely on another profession to make their products uber. Nothing new there. I must say though, tailors don't seem to have that same mind set. Without a BE tissue their clothes are...well, just clothes. Tailors love me and are happy to pay me for my tissues. They even tip me.
I've heard this arguement a jillion times too, "it costs a million credits for just one factory run." What you don't hear is how much they make when they sell the product from that one factory run.
How about this for a little mind food. We get rid of BE tissues and chefs go back to making the useless food stuffs they did before the change. How much you want to bet there well be 2 or 3 chefs per server (if that many) like there were in the time before tissues existed? Just think of the freed up skill points to play with. 
Kevie
Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:36 pm
#83
PurpleWarrior wrote:
JohnnieFed wrote:
I paid 50-75k for each Schematic. I do not understand why other BE's do not do that as well. I see it as a fair trade. I paid for all the resources.. the meat the other organics, He did not have to supply those at all.
*coughs and splutters*
Taking trade away from BEs who actually want to make BSNs, and make decent profits and someone was willing to do it for 50-75K?
I wouldn't log in for that much, let alone make a schematic.
The profit for a BE who actually puts in the work is decent, if people will buy his stuff. BEs making cheap schematics for even cheaper chefs is just harming other BEs, in my opinion of course...
SERIOUSLY
i don't make tissues very often and though it's rarely happened, i don't make schematics for them for people because i know i will be taking away business from other BE's who want to take the time to make them
i take the time to make my chef additives and a LOT of time to make my pets, and don't want to take away from the BE's that take the extra time to make tailor tissues
Okin_Sin
Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:41 pm
#84
"How about this for a little mind food. We get rid of BE tissues and chefs go back to making the useless food stuffs they did before the change. How much you want to bet there well be 2 or 3 chefs per server (if that many) like there were in the time before tissues existed? Just think of the freed up skill points to play with."
Or how about we just get rid of the BE's tissues and put em right in the chef line!!! Then the BE's can sit here and just whine about pets and pet meds.
I love the argument though ...
BE: NO I will NEVER make Chef tissues cuz I can't make as much as chefs make off of their food, and they suck to make
CHEF: Ok since you don't plan on making them and selling them, I will PAY you to make me a schematic
BE: OMG you think I would make you a schematic, the world would end and all of the BE proffesion would die
CHEF: How would it hurt your business if you aren't ever gonna make em?
BE: All chefs are greedy idiots who ruin the world /addignore all chefs!!!!!!!
Or how about we just get rid of the BE's tissues and put em right in the chef line!!! Then the BE's can sit here and just whine about pets and pet meds.
I love the argument though ...
BE: NO I will NEVER make Chef tissues cuz I can't make as much as chefs make off of their food, and they suck to make
CHEF: Ok since you don't plan on making them and selling them, I will PAY you to make me a schematic
BE: OMG you think I would make you a schematic, the world would end and all of the BE proffesion would die
CHEF: How would it hurt your business if you aren't ever gonna make em?
BE: All chefs are greedy idiots who ruin the world /addignore all chefs!!!!!!!
Dsabre
Wed Jul 14, 2004 10:46 pm
#85
Okin_Sin wrote:
"How about this for a little mind food. We get rid of BE tissues and chefs go back to making the useless food stuffs they did before the change. How much you want to bet there well be 2 or 3 chefs per server (if that many) like there were in the time before tissues existed? Just think of the freed up skill points to play with."
Or how about we just get rid of the BE's tissues and put em right in the chef line!!! Then the BE's can sit here and just whine about pets and pet meds.
I love the argument though ...
BE: NO I will NEVER make Chef tissues cuz I can't make as much as chefs make off of their food, and they suck to make
CHEF: Ok since you don't plan on making them and selling them, I will PAY you to make me a schematic
BE: OMG you think I would make you a schematic, the world would end and all of the BE proffesion would die
CHEF: How would it hurt your business if you aren't ever gonna make em?
BE: All chefs are greedy idiots who ruin the world /addignore all chefs!!!!!!!
Ok...Okin_Sin you're just taking this too far, and the only thing you're going to accomplish is the further degredation of the chef/BE relationship...geez, no wonder sooooo many BE's just view chefs as stuck up money grubbers...
as far as getting rid of tissues causing there to only be 2 or 3 chefs per server....you do realize that tissues have nothing to do with there being more chefs no...absolutely nothing. the major limiting factor on chefs before was that subcomponents needed high quality resources just to make a decent product...and they took longer to make than the actual finished product.
and as far as you "argument" bit goes...there are some bad apples on both sides...if anyone chooses to believe that all the bad apples are just on one side...well just keep on believing that because there probably very little hope of anyone ever changing their mind.
I'm also guessing that Okin_Sin is a "revamp" chef...one of those chefs that started up when the revamp hit, or close to it...and stuck with it since chef got 3x easier to handle, and with BE enhancements millions and millions of credits could be made.
virtually all of the older chefs wanted BE tissues to be more useful...perhaps not as useful as they are now (especially since only 1 line is useful...something chefs aren't happy with either)...but definately more useful than what they were before. and in general you'll see that in the way the older chefs will post on the forums...and a lot of the older chefs aren't too fond of some of the newer ones ruining some of the relationships we had with other professions...BE's and chefs used to get along pretty well...since we were both screwed up broken professions...heck chefs even used the "chef" revamp to help out some of our fellow broken professions (better tissues for BE's...new clothing for tailors...come on what other profession used their own revamp to ask that other professions get things...rangers, architects, melee professions, DE's, even BE's...)...thats the kind of attitude the older chefs had...something sorely lacking in the newer ones.
it probably takes being in a broken profession to build "character"...and sadly BE's are still more or less broken (that creature system could be soooo much better if it weren't for some really basic design flaws...not being able to experiment to lower cl, and even see cl when experimenting comes to mind) so there are now more BE's with "character" than chefs...since chefs aren't broken anymore, and a lot of the older chefs have moved on, quit, or are just afraid that asking for anything, or speaking up might result in a stealth nerf, or SOE somehow introducing another profession breaking bug into chefs.
I'm starting to think I might be the only chef who can understand/sympathize with the BE point of view that will post in this forum (I'm a chef/BE...BE only because early on in the chef revamp I couldn't find a good BE partner, or a reliably stocked vendor...but currently looking at going into making creatures...still learning it through the forums tho).
Meplorium
Wed Jul 14, 2004 11:29 pm
#86
I don't spend 40 cpu for meat. There was one spawn of tat carn meat that had all 4 stats 980 or more. That I paid 40 cpu for when it was in shift and could be had for 40 cpu. I usually do 4-10cpu for meat. I won't go more than 10 cpu, isn't worth it.
Something some BEs may not understand. An 82 additive does nearly as good as a job as an 88 additive. The difference is slight and can be made up for easially by a knowledable chef. So even the worst meat gets the job done. Of course skill tapes come in great use when using lower quality additives. So for a crate of medium additives that take 2000 units at30k is 15 cpu or 12 cpu for heavies.I farm all my own BE additive flora, although I often need to buy the different chef resources, since there are too many to get them all. So 15 cpu when I get my resources for them at the 1-10 cpu is a good doubling. My BE side makes good money as does my miner side. When those 30k additives get made into chef food and then resold for 60k, my chef side and my merchant side does well too. There are many middlemen there and I get to play them all. I do enjoy each in turn, however unrealistic it is to play each one. However dealing with middlemen that isn't yourself can be frustrating, which is why I try to do that as little as possible.
That is how the math actually works, at least for me.
JohnnieFed
Thu Jul 15, 2004 4:19 am
#87
Ok . this is kindof ridiculous.. there is NOTHING wrong with making a schematic for a Chef.. AND for your information I WAS Master chef WAY before the Revamp so all this BE stuff is not that new.. we just have alot more and have way better foods and drinks to makewith the BE components.
MAKING a schematic is NO skin off of anyone's teeth.It takes you all of 5 min's maybe?? to make 100k credits? with ingredients YOU didn't have to buy or harvest yourself??YOU sell pets and pet Stims that no one else can make and are in very much a demand??
ME as a BE would Gladly sell a Schematic to a Chef just so I dont' have to pay outlandish prices for the meats out there.. (which to me are WAY to much).
This is why the BE profession has very few people.. you guys really whine and complain alot about something you can't change right now.. Dang it I like to have fun and DANG it I'll have fun with what I've got..
Have fun everyone.. really , it's JUST A GAME !!! Make Due with what you have.. or Choose another profession
this is the last post on this thread from :
EMO THEORY master chef/novice BE
Johnnie Fed master fencer/ et all
Cliffy
Thu Jul 15, 2004 5:33 am
#88
anyway, why do we get these chefs trolling our forums? I've never posted on their forum
Okin_Sin
Thu Jul 15, 2004 6:21 am
#89
Dsabre wrote "I'm also guessing that Okin_Sin is a "revamp" chef...one of those chefs that started up when the revamp hit, or close to it...and stuck with it since chef got 3x easier to handle, and with BE enhancements millions and millions of credits could be made."
Well if by Revamp Chef you mean started Chef within the first three weaks after release ... then yea sure. And back then NO ONE needed anything from a BE to make food and it was great. When you are used to playing a class that is totally self suffecient, and then you have to rely on another class for EVERY food it does suck yes. The new Chefs are not chefs because of the BE additives, its because they completley reworked the entire foods lines and changed every single food, drinkand subcomponent, and also fixed many many bugs that crippled the old Chef profesion.
Cliffy as for "trolling" your forumns, I am a Master Bio-Engineer I think this is just as much my forumn, and yes if you look at the Chef forumn many of these same BE's post the same stuff there. The only difference is in the Chef forumns the BEs are not insta one-starred.
The main thing no one is seeing here is your making a SUBCOMPONENT that only ONE proffesion uses. A food tissue does nothing to a Rifleman or an Armorsmith. By game design, not my choice, you as BEs are given a very limited customer base ... its just part of the proffesion. Since you are selling these food tissues to only ONE proffesion, and even for them its just another subcomponent, you can't expect to price it the way Food is priced. Food is available to ALL proffesions, that is the key difference.
If you are paying 40c/u for resources that go in to a subcomponent, it is your own fault you can't make a profit ... you are paying WAY to much. The people that pay those types of prices put it in to premium products that have a high demand.
Cliffy
Thu Jul 15, 2004 8:30 am
#90
Okin I've been pretty civil so far & usually am but before you go spouting "The main thing no one is seeing" read the post at the top of this page please...It's been covered 
And also dont make general comments on meat prices when there are too many servers with different pricing involved
This is worse than the Jedi trolling the Anti-Jedi posts
And also dont make general comments on meat prices when there are too many servers with different pricing involved
This is worse than the Jedi trolling the Anti-Jedi posts
GarVa
Thu Jul 15, 2004 8:33 am
#91
Greetings,
This thread has been closed as it violates the forum policies against trolling. Please understand that you agree to follow the Forum Policies when you sign up for your forum account and we do enforce the policies.
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