Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Critter Resource Availability
Page 20 of 20
Fred_Skinner
Thu Apr 15, 2004 6:58 am
#248
Thanks for the support
Lyekka wrote:
...snip...
A very well written proposal, I wish you luck with it!
. Only thing is we need for you guys to also tell the devs your problems and why you think 200cpu for meat is a tad silly. For some reason we were told that they would be open to fixing the problem if they (the devs) heard of a compelling reason from the rest of the community to do so, and so far they had not. Therefore, just our efforts are not enough (dev's words, not ours, btw). You guys will have to help us convince them that something is needed now, and not till x-mas or after the SE.
ThGilsRooc
Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:51 am
#249
I soooo agree with calc here. As a master ranger for the second time (and soon a third time with my alt toon), the two traps that are given on the ranger trapping tree works well when it does. Unfortunately, they're just not effective enough to be considered an elite prof tool. Scouts get 8-9 traps (can't recall the number), whereas ranger gets 2. I was hunting with a levelling tka/CH last week. If people haven't noticed, when grouip hunting, you get a notification over who harvests/loots what. I was upset to see that my friend with hunting 4 was getting just a bit less than I. I was going to keep ranger as my main, but it's a waste of skillpoints at the moment. My alt will pick up master ranger just for the camouflage skill since it will be BE.
According to a recent dev chat, TKA will be nerf'd again (i believe it is damage output they're decreasing). Because of this, it only makes sense I just grab a second combat prof and keep hunting 4. I'll kill more and yield more organics. Ranger simply takes up too many skillpoints to be deemed worthy. My alt will keep ranger so it can poke rancor in the bootie without detection.
ArthurDentOnBria
Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:16 am
#250
Well, the biggest effect of a ranger harvesting increase is likely to be that there will be a lot more avian meat and wooly hide on the market which helps armorsmith and doctors mainly. I can't see buff prices going down any even if this were to occur as mainly we're paying for the doctors time and people already have trouble finding a doctor willing to buff for 10k/set (which is a quarter of a million credits revenue for doctors, using only a little over 100 units of avian for those keeping score). So mainly that just pads doctors pocketbooks and they really don't need padding.
You could argue that if the market would get flooded with avian the price would come down enough that suddenly other markets might be viable (like supplying bio engineers with meat). But that is probably wishful thinking as that is just a huge huge chasm right now between what a ranger can get for avian and what a BE is willing to pay for say reptile meat. Rangers are of a mindset that artisans are greedy and rip them off by buying at anything lower than 40-50cr/u and have suggested harvesting boycotts and other nonesense like that, so I dunno.
Message Edited by ArthurDentOnBria on 04-15-2004 11:18 AM
Lyekka
Fri Apr 16, 2004 8:20 am
#251
ArthurDentOnBria wrote:
Well, the biggest effect of a ranger harvesting increase is likely to be that there will be a lot more avian meat and wooly hide on the market which helps armorsmith and doctors mainly. I can't see buff prices going down any even if this were to occur as mainly we're paying for the doctors time and people already have trouble finding a doctor willing to buff for 10k/set (which is a quarter of a million credits revenue for doctors, using only a little over 100 units of avian for those keeping score). So mainly that just pads doctors pocketbooks and they really don't need padding.
You could argue that if the market would get flooded with avian the price would come down enough that suddenly other markets might be viable (like supplying bio engineers with meat). But that is probably wishful thinking as that is just a huge huge chasm right now between what a ranger can get for avian and what a BE is willing to pay for say reptile meat. Rangers are of a mindset that artisans are greedy and rip them off by buying at anything lower than 40-50cr/u and have suggested harvesting boycotts and other nonesense like that, so I dunno.
Message Edited by ArthurDentOnBria on 04-15-2004 11:18 AM
Glad to see you're not bitter, Artthur! 
Seriously, though, if you really feel this way, then perhaps the other proposal that I've heard several people mention would be useful. That idea would allow the high level Ranger to harvest ALL the resources from a creature. For example: Leathery Hide, Carnivore Meat, and Bone. This would certainly help with supply onthe resources that are not normally taken, like Bone. Quality would probably be an issue, as it is unlikely that any creature would be dropping more than one high quality resource at a time.
Another thing you have to remember about hunting, is that just like with any resource, there is not always anything goodavailable. There simply is not always a high qualityAvian Meat to hunt, even if you wanted to, which I don't. (see previous post- I only hunt that for my own personal doctor). An increase in the amount that a Ranger could harvest would almost certainly resullt in a lower price for Avian meat. As I mentioned before, I can and do hunt meat for a BE for 20 cpu (very high quality), because I can make just as much doing that in the same amount of time, IF the meat is dropping on a good planet for hunting.
Not all Rangers think Artisans are greedy. Some of us play both kinds of characters, and understand the problems of both. I do admit that I cringe when I see an Artisan on Lowca charging 4 or 5 times what I charge on Tarq for an item. Most of them don't last long, though. And I am always pleased to find an Artisan who does high quality work at a reasonable price. Almost as pleased as when I find a Ranger to sell me meat at a reasonable price on Tarq!
ArthurDentOnBria
Fri Apr 16, 2004 9:59 am
#252
Lyekka wrote:
Not all Rangers think Artisans are greedy. Some of us play both kinds of characters, and understand the problems of both.
Hehe, well, that's exactly what almost all artisans I know do. Either they have a template that includes enough combat and hunting to supply a considerable amount of their own needs, or they have two characters, one for hunting, one for crafting. Solves the problem very nicely.
KapowBzapp
Mon Apr 19, 2004 1:48 pm
#253
I found this while searching for whether milking gains you XP (been master ranger too long, still no idea.)
On my server, Kettemoor, milk prices only grudgingly ever pass 5cpu unless the quality is very high. But milk is in some ways the most brutal animal harvest because, on top of requiring active player effort, it takes a huge amount of time. You can kill several animals and harvest their corpses in rapid succession. Milk goes at a set speed, usually has to be one animal at a time (unless they hold still in proximity), and started over any time an animal bolts.
Raising the question of why you can't milk a dead animal. The milk's in there, right?
But I'm not complaining about the low prices. It keeps one commodity available to low level scouts. Still, even if I could get milk from rancors, it just wouldn't be worth my time, especially if they were worth killing for some harvest. Milking them would actually REDUCE my earnings per hour!
Oh, so on the farm issue - as a Ranger I'm of course concerned, but for reasons you might guess I'd not be at all opposed to farms as a Ranger-free source of eggs, milk, and domesticated meat. Why the hell am I hunting in the wild for domesticated meat?
On my server, Kettemoor, milk prices only grudgingly ever pass 5cpu unless the quality is very high. But milk is in some ways the most brutal animal harvest because, on top of requiring active player effort, it takes a huge amount of time. You can kill several animals and harvest their corpses in rapid succession. Milk goes at a set speed, usually has to be one animal at a time (unless they hold still in proximity), and started over any time an animal bolts.
Raising the question of why you can't milk a dead animal. The milk's in there, right?
But I'm not complaining about the low prices. It keeps one commodity available to low level scouts. Still, even if I could get milk from rancors, it just wouldn't be worth my time, especially if they were worth killing for some harvest. Milking them would actually REDUCE my earnings per hour!
Oh, so on the farm issue - as a Ranger I'm of course concerned, but for reasons you might guess I'd not be at all opposed to farms as a Ranger-free source of eggs, milk, and domesticated meat. Why the hell am I hunting in the wild for domesticated meat?
Message Edited by KapowBzapp on 04-19-2004 01:52 PM
mookee
Mon Apr 19, 2004 2:37 pm
#254
i totally agree with you on every point.
as a master bio engineer, i require 'creature food' (meat) to craft BE additives for food, it is ridiculously hard to find stacks larger than 4k of meat to craft with, because of this i have to make small factory runs and i end up with small batches of food.
the only ranger i found refused to harvest me a 100k stack of meat for less than 50 cpu..i simply cannot afford that for what im using the meat for. it would make the finished product incredibly expensive and just not worth it.
i believe i read somewhere that there used to be creature harvestors?, i would MUCH like to have that! i mean i guess it would nullify the ranger/scout professions, but it would sure make me as a bio-engineer happy
as a master bio engineer, i require 'creature food' (meat) to craft BE additives for food, it is ridiculously hard to find stacks larger than 4k of meat to craft with, because of this i have to make small factory runs and i end up with small batches of food.
the only ranger i found refused to harvest me a 100k stack of meat for less than 50 cpu..i simply cannot afford that for what im using the meat for. it would make the finished product incredibly expensive and just not worth it.
i believe i read somewhere that there used to be creature harvestors?, i would MUCH like to have that! i mean i guess it would nullify the ranger/scout professions, but it would sure make me as a bio-engineer happy
SpaceKidAmnesiac
Sun Apr 25, 2004 3:30 am
#255
justapilgrim wrote:
I am all for giving a bonus to rangers, but would that solve the problem?
I don't 100% know how resources are "shifted in"
Is a resource (like hides) in rotation for a set amount of time? or is it untill the supply is exhausted?
so....does a resources have a random generated time in rotation (like 3 days up to 12 days)? or is it that there is 20 million or so of a resource and it hangs out for 12 days or untill exhausted?
What I am saying is this.......if a resource "shifts" in, and if there is a set amount of that resource to be gathered, it doesnt really matter if rangers can harvest more. The only thing that would change is that rangers have more hides than other fighters that have novice scout, and not help our supply or demand issues.
If a resource is around for a set period of time regardless of how many hides are harvested, I am all for the changes. If it isnt I dont think this really solves any issues, but is nice for rangers
The truth of the matter is that it doesn't matter either way how animal resources shift, if Rangers were able to collect more per creature, there would be an overall boost to the amount of resources available to everyone and an overall reduction in costs. Sure, if there was a set amount of each resource then the shifts would happen more frequently and the "casual" harvester will tend to get less of a particular resource than they do now.But if the a good resource comes around, you know that then is a good time to spend more time gathering resources or to pay a Ranger to get them for you. And for those that buy their resources in bulk, they could get a lot more resources for the same price (or less) than they are paying now.
I think the main reason that Rangers don't get much more than Scouts is because the developers are overly worried about the economy and so they've made animal resources one of the largest credit sinks, which makes armor, food, and stimslarge credit sinks in return. But they don't have to make it so that a durni gives 1000 of each resource and nobody is asking for that. We just want an increase that is comparable to the increases in demand due to the recent elite profession changes and to the lack of ability to be the "ultimate hunters" we Rangers are supposed to bewhen compared to every combat profession out there. Imagine what it would be like if Master Artisan was required for Novice Armorsmith and a Mastercould only make advancedchitin armor and you'd be in the same boat that Rangers are in.
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