Artisan Archive
Thread: Artisans want harvestor certifications. Please Read and submit your comments.
And of course, that's the Artisan that build the crystals...
Dene wrote:
Point taken, but these people also do not use harvesters.
I am a master doctor, and I *have* to use heavies. People may balk at 10K for a buff set now, but you ain't seen nothing yet if I, or other docs, can't place the harvestors we need. The game economy would suffer hyper-inflation that would rival 1920s Germany. Even simple furniture items would be beyond the reach of many in the game. Housing sales would suffer because housing would no longer be easily available. This in turn would affect player towns causing a radical reduction of play cities within a few months. New players would find housing unafforable driving them away from the game.
In the end, any short term gain to Master Artisans would be negated by every other class taking such a hit as to completely wreck the game.
Oh, and I totally agree with this stance. Cafa was my first character, and Fivo got purchased at Fry's when I found out that I couldn't be a Doc/TKM and an Artisan.
Fivo Asia
>Go on the Tempest trade forums. It's the high-end fighters selling looted SEAs for 18 million, not crafters.
>Also, last time I checked TKM/Smugglers hacking Janta missions make 40k every 15 minutes. Not too many crafters work that >well. Aukum made 30 million on a solid run of Janta missions on our server in under one month. I sure as heck haven't made that >NET from architecture sales lately.
Point taken, but these people also do not use harvesters.
I am a master doctor, and I *have* to use heavies. People may balk at 10K for a buff set now, but you ain't seen nothing yet if I, or other docs, can't place the harvestors we need. The game economy would suffer hyper-inflation that would rival 1920s Germany. Even simple furniture items would be beyond the reach of many in the game. Housing sales would suffer because housing would no longer be easily available. This in turn would affect player towns causing a radical reduction of play cities within a few months. New players would find housing unafforable driving them away from the game.
In the end, any short term gain to Master Artisans would be negated by every other class taking such a hit as to completely wreck the game.
I only see 1 who fits this description in the thread! Sadly it is you! Can't get your way? Why not call every single PC in all servers morons!
Sinist wrote:
But the game in its mechanics are flawed, not how much people are making on missions or paying on maintenance but by how much people are producing and by how much people are harvesting in resources.
And well if they programmed their game balanced then taking 150k out for every 100k that went in would of meant NOONE would have made money. Instead the game was horribly hacked, and as of right now it has no integrity just by not what they broke but what other people broke. Nice.
So there are 10000000000000000000's of duped credits, 10000000000000000000000s more resources being mined then should be, and people are making 10000000000000000000000 more items then they should reasonably be making.
Yeah vote NO for harvester certifications you morons.
RankorCity wrote:
Wow. Talk about greed....
Look at it this way:
If only Master Artisans can use medium/hvy harvesters, the cost of resources will go thru the roof (as if Ahazi's isn't screwed up enough as it is). This will affect the entire economy, from the dancer to the bounty hunter in such an adverse way most couldnt afford to be competive in any PvE/PvP sense.
You are only allowed 10 lots. Put down a house, there goes two lots right there. Leaves 8. Eight lots for the Master Artisan to use. Not alot of resources can be gotten from 8 lots). That now, most likely, forces you to buy from other MArtisans, who are gouging their prices. That in and of itself will cause resources to skyrocket. Having the ability for everyone to place a harvester keeps prices down. If its made that only Master Artisans can use them, then my next profession will be Master Ranger, and I will charge YOU out the wazoo for hides. I can bet alot of other players would do the same. Its a never ending cycle. Where a pair of boots cost a couple hundred credits now will cost several thousand.
I can see it now....Someone with a Master Artisan/Smuggler title wearing a black trenchcoatis standing in Theed Starport (the susspool of spam)having thefollowing conversation:
Player 1:"Psst...Hey buddy...I got yer steel right here....200 cpu and its yours"...
Player 2: "But its OQ is 12!!! I just need it to grind up to Armorsmith!!"
Player 1: "Tough tookus...Do you have a couple of medium harvesters to get it for you?"
Player 2: "Ummm...no"
Player 2 bends over and takes it where the sun doesnt shine
The ability for everyone to place harvies keeps the economy somewhat in check, and allows the casual player (not a powergamer)to be able to be semi-competitive in all aspects of the game. Further, think about this: Say you need 100K gemstone to make a factory run of whatever. You go to one of your eight harvies and hope you have one already mining it. If not, you have to take the time to survey for it. Place your harvester(s). Come back in however many days (depending on the rate/concentration of spawn) and hope the spawn hasnt shifted. Or look on the trade forums, where someon is selling crap gemstone for out of reach prices. Where as before, you merely had to do a /yell at a busy starport, or again check the trade forums.
What you are wanting to dowould screw the mission terminalscompletely out of the game and blow the economy sky high. The devs would have to increase the mission terminal payouts, effectively negating whatever money you thought you were making before hand. Sure you may sell 1 million creds worth of items on a vendor in a given day. But how is that any better now when it cost you 900K to produce those items?
Ok i hate to single you out here but yet again this another reply where obiviously a non artisan/crafter wants to call us greedy for wanting a fair shake. Why is it that so many post reflect the "its the end of the galaxy as we know it attitude"? what, if certs are implemented no one can every become artisan again and the galaxy will will left with just the small handfull of artisans to supply their resource needs? Absolutely not, As with every profession upgrade that has ever occured in the game there will be a massive redistribution of skill points thats all. Players will maybe forced to give up that little bit of medic to have artisan so on and so forth which is as it should be! You call us greedy you are a master doc/rifleman/CM most guys in your positionrun mokk missions etc. averaging 100-200k an hour and all the while harvesting resources @ 13berthat you have not invested 1 skill point now again who ids being greedy here. you want to harvest resources re think the way you have invested your skill points period.
OuttaControl
outtacontrol wrote:
Ok i hate to single you out here but yet again this another reply where obiviously a non artisan/crafter wants to call us greedy for wanting a fair shake. Why is it that so many post reflect the "its the end of the galaxy as we know it attitude"? what, if certs are implemented no one can every become artisan again and the galaxy will will left with just the small handfull of artisans to supply their resource needs? Absolutely not, As with every profession upgrade that has ever occured in the game there will be a massive redistribution of skill points thats all. Players will maybe forced to give up that little bit of medic to have artisan so on and so forth which is as it should be! You call us greedy you are a master doc/rifleman/CM most guys in your positionrun mokk missions etc. averaging 100-200k an hour and all the while harvesting resources @ 13berthat you have not invested 1 skill point now again who ids being greedy here. you want to harvest resources re think the way you have invested your skill points period.
OuttaControl
Well he cant have much in rafle and CM if he is a master doc, but I guess the point being currently using a harvester now requires no skill points. No matter what your template is.
There are fears of what would happen and there is masssive speculation on both sides of the argument. The main problem is it is easy to argue the negative impacts because they are obvious and no hard facts and numbers are out there to give 100% credibility to either side. Until that is done the perception will stay at "one class wants to nerf everone so they can have a skill which every one is allowed to usesoley for themselves that has a large income potential", and hence the immediate greed argument.
Because one thing ius true and that is the Artisan profession is designed to be the stepping stone to elite crafting and is more of a "jack of all trades" profession and there is a good argument to say that does not make them the miners of the galaxy.
My alt is a MA and I dont agree with certs at all. When I make a list of good vs bad impacts I do see that the potential badimpacts that could happen with a change like far outweigh the goodbut without hard numbers the analysis is incomplete. But that is my opinion
joined42904 wrote:
Dene,
How would simple furniture items become out of reach? I just don't understand. They don't require *that* many resources. And combat missions do pay money. So the combat professions have money to spend. It's their choice as to whether they will buy the buffs you or something else or both.
(I really have the feeling that buffs are "too good" because they often triple or more a character's stats. And that just seems a bit unreal to me. And unlike any of the SW movies. But I think the devs will balance everything in the combat revamp and don't want to give you doctors a chance to complain that I'm in favor of nerfing your buffs at the same time that I don't want you to be able to use heavy harvesters.)
Many of the mayors of player towns are architects. I had an architect give me a house for free if I lived in and declared residence in her town. And I've had many other offers of free housing. Given that architects understand heavy harvs well enough to make them, I don't see why they shouldn't be certified in them. (In fact, certification in anything one can make I think should be a general rule.)
If a master architect with two accounts wants to run a city...there will be housing in that player city. And there will be parks and shuttleports and furniture and whatever else that master architect wants there to be. Trust me on this one. Maybe the architect in question won't be able to make as much architect profit due to city concerns, but that should change once the population stabilizes. And there's always the likelihood that such a kind person would receive gifts of resources from the crafters in the architect's community. I really see no likely impact on player towns due to factors outside normal econonomics that you're not seeing here.
Housing sells would suffer greatly. That's interesting to me. Since I see houses for 6k at the bazaar. That's right...a place to live is selling for less than one of your buffs.
I myself am amayor and Master Architect. WHile I have never seen the need to give houses to new citizens I believe it is a nice perk. However if harvester erts ever went in these cheap little 6k house would jump to probably around 30k at a min. WHy? because 95% of the resource income has been killed off. Supply and demand plus human greed would cause these prices to sky rocket 5x,8x, maybe even 10x for basic resources.
PLease do not tell me economics would bring the prices down to normal as this would not work in this situation. IF the certs went through then there would be no resource companies and the individuals resource production would be limited to 10 lots. Lets say someone is selling 100k of decent steel at 8cpu(a hypothetical market price) another individual sells for 7cpu, and a individual sells for 2cpu(todays market price). What happens? weol the 2 cpu will be sold extremely fast, 7 cpu would sell fast but not as fast as the 2 cpu and the 8 cpu would still sell all be it slower than the other two but it would still sell. Why is this? Because you have the same numberof crafters requiring massive amounts of resources in a market where there is a major shortage. We have already said the 2 cpu seller would sell the fastest, but who makes the most money? The 8 cpu seller. Why would you sell for 2 cpu when you could sell the sameresource for 8 cpu? Since the resource companies will have folded by this point being a low seller will not carry any advantages in the economy as his low price will not make a dent in the mass of single person resource sellers.
Why do i say this?Because i have first hand experience with this ingame. As i have said several times I operate GodaPower which at one time was a the largest on chilastra. Early on I was in a friendly competition with Atib of NovaPower. I started with fewer fusion gens and sold at 1 cpu, while he had the backing of a guild, moregens, and sold at .75 cpu. He sold out of power the moment he pulled the power out of his gens. YOu would think I would not have had a chance. However since the market was in such a demand I also sold out very quickly. What do you think happened? We both sold the same power but I was making 33% more money per resource, meaning that I had more profits to buy gens with and to expand. Guess who eventually won? well if you read the first sentence you know.
Thisi s a prime example of what would happen but on a much larger scale with resources should certs go through.
hoenix
outtacontrol wrote:
Ok i hate to single you out here but yet again this another reply where obiviously a non artisan/crafter wants to call us greedy for wanting a fair shake. Why is it that so many post reflect the "its the end of the galaxy as we know it attitude"? what, if certs are implemented no one can every become artisan again and the galaxy will will left with just the small handfull of artisans to supply their resource needs? Absolutely not, As with every profession upgrade that has ever occured in the game there will be a massive redistribution of skill points thats all. Players will maybe forced to give up that little bit of medic to have artisan so on and so forth which is as it should be! You call us greedy you are a master doc/rifleman/CM most guys in your positionrun mokk missions etc. averaging 100-200k an hour and all the while harvesting resources @ 13berthat you have not invested 1 skill point now again who ids being greedy here. you want to harvest resources re think the way you have invested your skill points period.
OuttaControl
