Artisan Archive

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joined42904 wrote:

Halaster,

Folks will migrate to any profession that has certifications in order to mine with at least their secondary or alt characters if certifications are implemented. What you are asking the devs to do assumes that professions are fixed. In fact, they are quite fluid with elite crafters having quite a bit of artisan on average.... And it doesn't take much to get the rest again.

So now you have to have 2 accounts to be a miner? How's that in the spirit of the game? And yes, elite crafters do have quite a bit of artisan. They just don't have the lots free to mine, nor do they have the time to mine for themselves.

For a full discussion of the certification issue the devs are encouraged to look at any of a number of certification threads, including those which Guruweaver has made available to them.

If you're that hot on the topic,please post a footnote for Guru, as requested. Let's get the best arguments for and against in front of the devs and let them (force them to) make a call once and for all.

Certification is, even in my opinion, in the final analysis subordinate to removing admin on harvesters as a way to curtail massive mining operations and reward the individual player who spends time getting the right resources for elite crafters to use.

Why remove admin? There are better ways to curtail off-server (cross-server) mining operations, such as eliminating demand for crap resources. That change (probably) requires zero coding, so we can then ask the devs to CODE US SOMETHING COOL instead of something limiting.

I would never assume that a problem will fix itself if absolutely nothing is done to address it. I certainly wouldn't take the problem of having utility bills or a mortgage in real life and address it in that way. Because once a problem is identified, such as cross-lotting, something should be done to correct it on a more or less permanent basis.

I would never assume that it's smart to over-fix a problem. Especially one that doesn't exist. Go to the Naritus trade forums. Ask around how much you'll pay per unit for Miti and Obivium. These are two high-quality WS resources that just finished their spawns. If there is a resource glut, you should expect to pay close to 0.5cr per unit (because a glut means over-supply and in economies where supply radically exceeds demand, prices approach cost). You will instead pay over 3.0cr per unit, probably closer to 5-7. There is no resource glut.

If there is one on your server, please let me know the server name so I can go there and be a WS there at low cost instead!

X-server *is* a problem, only because it's against the spirit of the game. But we don't need to further shorten the resource supply that is drawn by on-server miners to solve it. All we need to do is eliminate the demand for junk resources (as will happen ina big way, though maybe not 100%, with publish 10).

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Korlan wrote:

OMG dude.... I don't know what you are getting on with... seriously...

Artisans were given the survey tree FOR mining... hence in a word... we are pretty much a"Miner" class.

As for lots, i like the idea of sperate lots for harvestors.

Personally I save 4 lots for my harvestors, and spend hours looking for the top percentage.. once I find the res that I like I place my harvestors. To say that artisan won't harvest because they don't have lots is... well... total BS... a good artisan will make room...

which makes me wonder... are you even an artisan??

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HalasterTheBlack wrote:

Yes, I'm a Master Artisan / Master Weaponsmith.

I had to ask because of your vary "loud" point of veiw on the issuse. one needs to know whos he is dealing with.

I don't know what sort of artisan you might be, nor how popular your goods are.

I hold my own thank you. I make enough to pay for everything i need to run my shop with enough profit to keep me going. My customers are loyal and my prices are more then fair.

However, if I absolutely *scrounged* I could free up 3-4 lots for harvesters. With that many rigs running, I could not keep up with the demand for my products. I could make weapons for about a week, then retire for a month or two while I gather materials again.

and why don't you? If your products are good, then people will wait for you to come out witht he new line... and you can still make your "profit".

I *must* buy from others. Others who mine just to be miners.

You must be well off to afford the prices for good materal. at this point... i envy you.

And, no, Artisan was *not* given Survey to be miners. They were given Survey to FIND RESOURCE SPAWNS.

And then what? We go hire a miner who charges more then he is worth?

Miners were there to be miners. When the devs had to cut that skill, they gave the ability to plant rigs to everyone. Everyone gets to be a miner.

I can't help but feel they cut the profession, due to the fact that it could be better covered by the Artisan profession.

Which, to finish the circle, works well for me and for many (most?) artisans. Because those of us who sell reasonable quantities of finished goods lack both the lots and the time to mine everything we need for ourselves.

This is the whole point of crafting. to make time to collect the things you need. And go out of your way to make GREAT products. You don't have to be like a Wal-Mart to be a "elite" crafter.

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Damn.. this is fun

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Korlan wrote:

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HalasterTheBlack wrote:

Yes, I'm a Master Artisan / Master Weaponsmith.

I had to ask because of your vary "loud" point of veiw on the issuse. one needs to know whos he is dealing with.

I don't know what sort of artisan you might be, nor how popular your goods are.

I hold my own thank you. I make enough to pay for everything i need to run my shop with enough profit to keep me going. My customers are loyal and my prices are more then fair.

However, if I absolutely *scrounged* I could free up 3-4 lots for harvesters. With that many rigs running, I could not keep up with the demand for my products. I could make weapons for about a week, then retire for a month or two while I gather materials again.

and why don't you? If your products are good, then people will wait for you to come out witht he new line... and you can still make your "profit".

Because doing so will not net me the quantity of the quality resources that I need to keep up with demand. How good is my rep if all that can be said of me is, "Well, he has weapons on his vendor about once every other month, but they're damn good when they're actually there"?

I *must* buy from others. Others who mine just to be miners.

You must be well off to afford the prices for good materal. at this point... i envy you.

I wouldn't say well off. But I manage myself reasonably well and I'm unconcerned with hitting the billion credit mark. I just want a reasonable profit, and I can do that paying what miners of quality resources on Naritus charge.

And, no, Artisan was *not* given Survey to be miners. They were given Survey to FIND RESOURCE SPAWNS.

And then what? We go hire a miner who charges more then he is worth?

No, I tend to hire miners who charge what they're worth and ignore those who overcharge. Someone might buy from them once in a while, but the miners I have on "retainer" if you will make consistent money. It's worth it to them to charge reasonably. We all win.

Miners were there to be miners. When the devs had to cut that skill, they gave the ability to plant rigs to everyone. Everyone gets to be a miner.

I can't help but feel they cut the profession, due to the fact that it could be better covered by the Artisan profession.

If you researched the history, you would find that they cut it because they had to cut things to achieve their release date. They wanted it in. If they had wanted to cut it to give it to artisans, they would have made mining the exclusive purview of artisans when they made the cut.

Which, to finish the circle, works well for me and for many (most?) artisans. Because those of us who sell reasonable quantities of finished goods lack both the lots and the time to mine everything we need for ourselves.

This is the whole point of crafting. to make time to collect the things you need. And go out of your way to make GREAT products. You don't have to be like a Wal-Mart to be a "elite" crafter.

I'm hardly Wal-Mart. I specialize in particular items. I make them with very high quality. I'll go back to the same analogy I've been using. Ford, the Artisan, is not interested in mining. However, they're interested in buying steel from miners. It makes no more sense for a weaponsmith or artisan or chef to be mining than it does for Ford to be.

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Damn.. this is fun

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Guruweaver wrote:
Weapon powerup crafting improvements: Currently there are one melee, one mine, six ranged, and two grenade powerups Artisans can craft. Looking at Ranged weapon powerups, the type of powerup (barrel, grip, etc) seems to have little to no effect on the resulting stats in the finished product. The quality of the resources and experimentation skill do factor into the number of stats and the value of those stats, however which stats are present is random. We would like to see a more deterministic system for powerup crafting. The type of powerup should factor into what stats it modifies on the weapon. For instance, barrels only effect range, damage, and recoil (speed), grips effect HAM costs, speed, and accuracy, etc. This would give us greater control over powerup crafting and allow us to more fully leverage what could be a much more lucrative market.

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Uhm.. I might be kicking dead horses or maybe not, but for as far as I know, this already is the case. The only thing is they are random, but not completely random.

A grip has an action modifier, but not a mind modifier. A scope has a mind modifier, but not an action modifier. A stock does health (I think), grips have a primary in speed, which any others don't have. Barrels have max/min combo possibilities, which all the others don't have, etc.

So correct me if I'm wrong please, but what you're mentioning here already exists to my knowledge.

I however totally agree that we should have a bit more influence as *what* the combinations are specifically, instead of having to experiment 50 powerups to get one speed/dam. Although that's kind of fun in itself, and after a while you'll start recognizing the forumulas and algorithms used, so now I can actually get to what I specifically want quite fast.

Mad

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joined42904 wrote:

This may already be subsumed within #1 but I say we make Issue #5 that the devs should create a tool which allows them to track resources as they track other areas of the economy. Bianca has concurred with this request in another thread.

Those who wish to place restrictions on harvester use and those who do not have each accused the other side of not having sufficient data to back up their claims. A repost of Holocron's statements reveals that the devs themselves do not presently have a resource tracking tool.

Given the nature of the largest credit sinks in the game, I propose that the devs develop and implement resource tracking tools to keep track of resources asresources represent an important componentof the SWG economy.

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