Armorsmith Archive
Thread: Blixtev's 12pt nerf.
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Ruebacca
Sat Apr 09, 2005 11:34 am
#1
I cut this from anther thread becuse it is the explanation for the distruction of the elite AS professtion in the coming CU. "Protection stats" and "hindrance amounts" will be directly proportional. Right now a 12pt smith can provide the max "Protection stats" with less "hindrance amounts" than a smith with out skill tapes. This has made AS skill tapes the most valuble in the game. The advantage we have gained through great cost of credits and time is now considered an abuse. We will now be able to "push the envelope" buy buying loot drops that will alow us to hand craft afew peaces enhanced armor. These are going to be very expensive and only for rich customers. Ware as the game stands now all my customers benifit from my investment in skill tapes.
No matter how you look at it. It's a 12pt nerf. I can go on and on about the stupidity written bellow. Please comment.
Bold underline are added by me.
Bold italics are Blixtev's
Blixtev wrote:
In the first pass of armor we had toned down much of the encumbrance to just subtract from your efficiency stats. There was a choice between encumbrance/protection until the HAM system was pulled near themiddle of our internal alpha. All of a sudden even the modified encumbrance system didnt make sense after we had removed all the old stats. We deemed that if we reasonably expected most combat professions to wear armor they shouldn't have to suffer a massive loss of combat effectiveness. Hence the removal of "encumbrace".
Looking at Protection and Hindrance we see the following pattern(or should). As a smith raises the protection stats, the Base hindrance amounts will also rise. The hindrance system is a built in mechanism to keep players of the correct advancement level wearing the correct pieces of armor. This built in system prevents players from abusing any potential errant items, slicing etc. How does it do this?The combat professions are granted a series of "mitigators" if their mitigator is below the hindrance on the armor, then they suffer combat effectiveness/movement penalties for it. Smiths can push the envelope, however if broken loot drops ever get into the game, this should prevent players from wanting to use them because it would drive their hindrances up. This means we cannot let players experiment on this facet.
This leaves us with Condition and Protection and a much simplified system of armor crafting. This means a fairly straight forward crafting process. I did convert many of the old useless loot drops into a way to enhance armor, as well as modifying one of the RIS quest rewards so it would be useful on all armor, and you can see the Bio-Enhancement slot as well in there. This means much of how "good" a smith is will be judged on how they fiddle with the small add-ons you can put into the crafting. It should be a vastly easier process obtaining these as they now come in stacks.
Just wanted to give you an answer to why encumbrance was removed.
Weaponsmith_Drake
Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:24 pm
#2
I see the problem with the current system....but their idea of making it "fairer" is making all armor the same..... Before it was who could get the most amazing succes, best combo of resources, 12 points ect, there is no skill or even any work in the new system.. All the ffort i put into armor now will be worth nothing... Because some guy who just mastered armorsmith will make stuff the same...
Kesslan
Sat Apr 09, 2005 7:12 pm
#3
Speaking as some one who isnt even a 12pt AS atm. I actually totaly agree with everyone bitching about the 12pt nerf. Cause I've been investing too. It's part of the AS endgame really. And it's something I've prided myself in that even at 10 points I've managed to with abit of work and efford. Get reasonably decent HAM and still have good protection.
And as an 11 point AS (with a suit on long term loan from a far wealthier guildmate) I was able to up the notch just a tad. My resists went up with obtaining and using better materials. And my HAM droped a little bit from both the better resources, and especially that i was now able to squeeze in another 1-3 points into HAM reduction now that i"m getting better results thanks to the suit, and a bespin port drinking problem.
CharPrime
Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:12 am
#4
its there way to level the playing field. changing resources requirements, nerfing the extra points. you are basically starting over. they are trying to balance uber and noob crafters.
why don't they just delete everyone and reroll. good players will still be good, and the lazy players will still cry nerf and balance.
plonger
Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:33 am
#5
I don't think they are doing this to nerf 12 pointers, but it is rather a sadsideeffectof their lack of creativity in making a system that is both complex and fun. Instead of making wearing heavy armor effect how you move and fight, they make it so you just can't wear it. Want to use a gun your not trained to use, instead of making your accuracy horrible, they make it so you can't even hold it.
It is a simple system that was easy to code/port and in the end they have taken everything that is/was unique and made it so we are all cookie cutter templates. I guess all the creative folks were hired up by blizzard and this is the result of that.
Ruebacca
Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:10 am
#6
I don't think they are doing this to nerf 12 pointers, but it is rather a sadsideeffectof their lack of creativity in making a system that is both complex and fun. Instead of making wearing heavy armor effect how you move and fight, they make it so you just can't wear it. Want to use a gun your not trained to use, instead of making your accuracy horrible, they make it so you can't even hold it.
It is a simple system that was easy to code/port and in the end they have taken everything that is/was unique and made it so we are all cookie cutter templates. I guess all the creative folks were hired up by blizzard and this is the result of that.
It was fun making mistakes playing SWG. Using a Luancher pistol when i was not certified. I think we are going to lose alot with the CU. I will keep playing if one thing is solved. That is larg scale combat. Radient has has had some larg Pvp battles. But the sever cant handel them. If thats solved I will stay. One account not four.
WarriorCode
Sun Apr 10, 2005 2:36 am
#7
If te 12 point smith is finally nerfed our of the game, I would like a rebate systep put in place to somewhat offset the millions of credits I spent buying the armor attachments. During the first days after the UBER NERF goes live, junk dealers should buy back the AS experimentation and assembly clothes or attachments @ 1 million credits per point. THEY WANNA SCREW ALL THE SMITHS OUT OF THE ADDITONAL CRAFTING BONUSES< ATLEAST MAKE IT FAIR AND COMPENSATE THEM FOR IT!!!
Ruebacca
Tue Apr 12, 2005 8:47 am
#8
instead of writing another bitter thread. I am bumping this one.
I love the idea of taking my AS suit to a junk dealer. I was going to have my storage vendor ware mine.
I love the idea of taking my AS suit to a junk dealer. I was going to have my storage vendor ware mine.
Jereck
Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:13 am
#9
Level the playing field? THERES ONLY ONE THING TO EXPIRAMENT ON. He didn't just level the playing field, he took all variety out and through down the sh!tter.
ZionHalcyon
Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:22 am
#10
Hmm, interesting. Glad my guild has a 12 pt suit, so I didn't have to buy.
Ah well, live by the sword, bie by the sword fellas. 
Seriously, I would like to see more things experimented on, but to be honest, you guys are beating a dead horse.
The system how it will be WORKS. Rather than complain about something lost, look for something to gain and fight for it.
I guess what I am saying is that the encumberance thing that the devs laid out makes PERFECT sense from the big picture. However, I also am not a fan of lack of crafting variety. The devs WILL NOT change encumberance - that is a fight you will lose.
But rather than whine or cry or threaten to quit, come up with something else we CAN experiment on, that gives us a slight advantage at 12 points, but not an overwhelming one that new smiths can't sell their goods.
As a matter of fact, I think I will start a thread on that very subject.
UmmonPrime
Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:31 am
#11
I've already decided to just accept the changes. As long as they gave OQ+SR back, I'll be fine. I can find the special resources, don't like the idea, but I can handle it.
neosayberbum
Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:41 am
#12
This would be a very sad day indeed when this CU finally comes out....
I won't even comment on my distaste for the combat part of it...that's a longer story 
Over my near 2 years of playing I never thought I would enjoy a crafting profession until I acutally tried it out and discovered a whole new way to play this game. Crafting in SWG is the best and most fun system I have ever played in a game.
Does it has its problems? yes, what doesn't?
Is it still the best system every created? yes!
Will it be a sad day when all creativity and uniqueness disappear? Yes!
Right now as it stands.....it sounds like AS will be a no brainer crafting profession now....just dump your resources in and craft...no fun experimentations, no challanges to make better/lighter armor. Now we are no better than a tailor making 4 socket gloves...just point and click.
I don't really look at this whole issue as a 12 point vs non 12 point and all the wasted money on a suit. I have loved my suit...and used it enough to recover my losses (and even if I didn't recover the losses - it was still exciting to obtain)
I look at this as an end to the creativity of the AS profession in this game.....if there is no creativity in making armor what's the point of AS? Just have NPC's sell armor since the effectiveness/hindrance will always be the same.
Basiclly there is no longer an advantage of looking for a good, creative AS.....just buy it from anyone it will be the same.
Why don't you just have junk dealers sell armor now and remove AS from the game?
Its bad enough your making our huge supply of resources useless....but now your taking all the creatity out of this fun profession?
I might as well move on to the cookie cutter crafting in MxO...since that un creative system appears to be gaining ground on SWG after the CU!
warrenbassist
Tue Apr 12, 2005 10:48 am
#13
I highly doubt they will nerf the 12pt AS's. I'm thinking they may mess with the crafting mastery tree though. =/
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