Armorsmith Archive

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Ciirybeccaskyr wrote:

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kayxfour wrote:
I'm tempted to go AS since my jedi can automatically choose any template I want plus the force sensitive crafting boxes when pub9 hits.

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lol

if you are just thinking about it you certinaly dont have the massive amount of insanly expencive reousrces, factories, harestors and other infastrucure required.

I am however doing this but then i spent 60mil so far on getting my +20 in tapes various resources i didnt have setting up all my factories ect and that doesnt even count the 50mil resources i had before i ever decided to do this from weaponsmithing and harvesting top resources along the way.

Even if they dont give me the force exp i a going to do this and enjoy it will still be a 12pnt smith the min i hit master anyhow whit the field of factories all set and ready to start pumping out my armor.

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Actually I have the means to do it, its just a matter of whether or not I want to work for it.

If that's true... hmmm no more need to do the quests.

I'd like to formally recognize the people who were too shortsighted to accept this crafting benefit from the FS system. Thank you for destroying what could have provided a growth path for crafters everywhere.

By insisting on no item improvement capability, you have ensured parity for all, and rendered the FS system into nothing more than a convenience - so people don't have to work as hard to get good results. Of course we have to work just as hard as the combat professions to get the FS abilities, and unlike us (thanks to this thread) they actually gain proficiency in their skills for their efforts, above and beyond what they could do before. We get City Specialization Version two.

Way to go.

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Govo wrote:

Absolutely not true! All force experimentation gives is a better chance at amazings and assembly. The armorsmiths with the best resources and tapes still win!

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check the date of the original post, it was 5/27 when ittov placed this, that was during the time when we heard from fan fest that we would get 2 more exp pts from the FS experimentation tree

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Sevarhin wrote:
I'd like to formally recognize the people who were too shortsighted to accept this crafting benefit from the FS system.

Way to go.

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You're welcome Sev. Really, it means a ton coming from someone who did nothing but craft the **edit** out of schematics during the one day crafting changes and then charge out the ass for them during the following months. I find an insane amount of irony in the fact that your sig states that you're "advancing the state of the art", when in fact you sold product made from months old schematics for quite some time. Truly state of the art.

Based on your previous actions, your opinion means absolutely zero to me, and that's a generous appraisal.

Message Edited by DirthNader on 09-05-2004 07:17 AM

If the FS crafting were 2 extra experimentation points, the pre-9 unlocks would have had HUGE advantage over any and every other crafter. At 9, the holo-grinding unlocks were given the ability to point and click any profession (or combo) with their 2nd character slot. Many of them, when FS crafting was announced to be 2 more points, were bragging and crowing about how they were going to give their 2nd slot the suit of 20 points and resources and become, overnight, the absolute best in their galaxy without any way for anyone else to even come close to matching them for many many many months (rather how the 1 day crafting change would have made undue advantage to old crafters). Personally, I am glad that form of griefing has been denied.

However, I do not put it past the devs to change FS crafting to experimentation points in the next month or so.

As it is, there is a perception in the minds of the customers that it is a great improvement. Fickle customers don't always look at stats, they look at hype.

As for the 10 lots with the 2nd slot. When the new method was first announced, it was even part of the FAQ that it would only be 10 lots -per account- that the lots would be shared. TH even clarified that in several different profession and other forums. No additional lots with the unlock. However, the pre-9 unlocks have an additional 10 lots. I don't know about the between unlocks, I haven't heard from any of them, and there haven't yet been any post-10 unlocks. If only the pre-9s get the lots, then it is truly and utterly sucky that they are rewarded (and coddled) yet again.

Agreed, Tess - we would currently have a mess due to the awarding of a pass through the FS Experiment tree, setting others at a massive disadvantage to catch up at far greater effort. Waiting for those free trees to be used before implementing the original concept is not a bad idea.

But really we're talking about a long time, since you'd need to give people who had to craft time to earn it. I think once the holo-based tree giveaway was implemented, it became very difficult to make that reward a reality in a fair manner.

Message Edited by Sevarhin on 09-05-2004 02:58 PM

Sev, I'm not invoking Eola's name as a insult. IF you turly knew Eola (which I'm not doubting you did), you'd know that he was just as against the 14-point crafter as I am. We bounced commments off of each other in various forums, and we agreed that the 14 point crafter was a horrible idea.

Now, if you want to keep the arguement from getting personal, I'll agree to that. That being said, yes, my comments were made in anger, but there was an underlying bit of relavance there. Let me explin.

You spent your time as a newbie crafter in the architect field. You made your fortune there, and you switched into the armormsithing trade. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but in the process you skipped over the newbie stage(s) that a lot of us go through. As an armorsmith, you didn't fight a limited budget, and you were always working with quality materials. As an outsider, it didn't appear as if you had much difficulty at all in changing professions. Again, I don't begrudge you for that, as no one should be punished for success, but I don't think you have any personal perspective on what it's like to be a new armorsmith with extremely limted funds, resources, and name recogition.

The new guys are why I had a problem with the 14 point smith idea. Most servers are already mature enough that the gate to entry is at the very least a lot of credits and a slew of the best materials to spawn on the server (some of our newer smiths are still hurting compared to the older, estacblished ones because they weren't around for a bey copper spawn over a year ago). On many of the larger servers having 12 exp points is a must, especially if you want to get into stun comp where it actaully makes a difference in resists.

If the 14 point system had come in, you're looking at yet another immense gate to get through for these new guys. That's not to mention the havoc it would've cause the existing crafting community - the people with holocredit getting instant access and completion to a 2 additional points that aren't even available to no hologrinders for another six weeks, the non-hologrinders going into seclusion to grind out enough FS crafting xp to complete the branch as soon as it was available, etc.

Look, I'm in the same boat a lot of older crafters are. I've got enough resoruces to last me months if I decided to stop harvesting / buying, enough credits to last mutliple lifetimes in SWG, and have done just about everything an armorsmith can do (I killed enough GDK's to build a suit of RIS before the multi-drop bug kicked in). I'd love to have two more points. I'd love to feel like we were moving forward in a significant manner again. But the FS crafting trees and an extra two points from them is not the way - the side effects are just too costly.

Sorry about the typos, getting bitched at by my friends for holding up the movie...

I know he was against it... for the same reasons you were. My biggest heart-break upon returning was finding out that he was leaving, that the coming FS system was cited as a big reason he was doing so, and having not been here to talk with him about it at the time, to help work out frustrations and try to convince Verant to be sensible about it.

Wow. Eola was, above all else, a crafter of the highest integrity who strove continuously for perfection, and was one of my closest in-game crafting friends - we spent evenings grinding in tedium together comparing strings of amazings as we crafted schematics in the garden in our city. And you try to invoke his name in an insult?

"Did nothing but", eh? You sure know me! Nevermind that the game is over a year old and I've been crafting at the top of my fields just about the entire time.

Of course I spent my time online on March 16 exploring how to put that system to use; I was already making the highest base composite at that point, and I specialize in making nothing but the best - I'd have been a fool not to. And by the end of the day, I'd made schematics for one type of composite chest plates (kinetic), and a suit of 80 kinetic Ubese. Of which I sold very few of either (nowhere near enough even to pay the maintenance on the tax-free city that I fund). After that, I was out of the game for most of the next 6 months, barring a few days here or there. Which is unfortunate, since I missed out on this discussion during this time (hence my surprise and anger over the changes during that time). So yeah, if you walked into my shop during that time, if you saw anything at all it would have been "months old" stuff. Bravo.

I don't really think you meant this attempt to sum up my entire crafting career in some sort of derogatory manner on the basis of a few chest kinetic composite plates and some suits of Ubese, legally made using a system we all knew about, as anything more than an angry response to the (admittedly angry) posts I made about this issue.

I'm the one who made it personal, so I guess I don't really have room to complain if you choose to try and lash out in return. I'll continue the debate - in a less personal manner - in a current thread.