Armorsmith Archive

Thread: How experimentation now seems to work on Test

Cocoa_Boy
Sat Feb 28, 2004 11:45 am
#14



When TH first announced this (pub 4 or 5) I was vehemently against it. This sort of change would make crafting too rigorous for me to enjoy. When this does go live, I'll just retire from AS.


This new system will penalize younger crafters whereas established players will have a better resource selection and more than likely a larger bankroll to draw upon. Terrible idea, imo.

Message Edited by Cocoa_Boy on 02-28-2004 11:05 AM





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OneStarBandit
Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:25 pm
#15

They'll probably make it so old armor cant' be removed from crates, as they did with flameout and FWG5s.






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JaatoWaals
Sat Feb 28, 2004 2:11 pm
#16

If you want to know the basic impacts on armorsmiths, this is what I think is going to happen:


1. Novices/armorsmiths with less then about three to four months of resources will be completely unable to compete. Don't even bother. Seriously. Your armor will be so inferior it won't even be funny. Estimate around double HAM and half the resistances of a good arch-master made suit. In economics lingo, this is called a "barrier to entry." The net result is that prices of arch-master made armor will rise, everything else will drop. Established armorsmiths rejoice, because between horded segments/armor and this new barrier to entry, the cost of a good layered composite suit will probably approach a million.


2. The average encumbrance of arch-master made armor will go up slightly, resists will go down slightly. Expect about a 1-2% decrease in resists (due to less effective resistance experimenting on layers) and a 10-20% increase in HAM costs on most armors.


3. It will become easier to make ultra-heavy armor. Expect to max out at around 72-73% with extraordinary resources pretty easily. Encumbrance will be slightly increased, probably around 10%, but who cares about that on ultra heavy suits? As a result the price of ultra-heavy armor will probably drop.





Waals Industries

-Armor for the new Imperium-

www.hrafnwarband.org
Epukag
Sat Feb 28, 2004 3:02 pm
#17

I expect to see our first "Pre-Nerf" armors



\ AkMe /
(Master Armorsmith +26 Armor Experimentation | Assembly | Repair | +FS Experimentation)

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MrMud
Sat Feb 28, 2004 3:42 pm
#18

I just want to cry



Seltak
(Retired) Master Armorsmith with 12 Experiemental points, RIS capable
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Brissa
Unlocked 24 April 2004 @ 32 professions
Abelomosad
Sat Feb 28, 2004 3:44 pm
#19








JaatoWaals wrote:

If you want to know the basic impacts on armorsmiths, this is what I think is going to happen:


1. Novices/armorsmiths with less then about three to four months of resources will be completely unable to compete. Don't even bother. Seriously. Your armor will be so inferior it won't even be funny. Estimate around double HAM and half the resistances of a good arch-master made suit. In economics lingo, this is called a "barrier to entry." The net result is that prices of arch-master made armor will rise, everything else will drop. Established armorsmiths rejoice, because between horded segments/armor and this new barrier to entry, the cost of a good layered composite suit will probably approach a million.


2. The average encumbrance of arch-master made armor will go up slightly, resists will go down slightly. Expect about a 1-2% decrease in resists (due to less effective resistance experimenting on layers) and a 10-20% increase in HAM costs on most armors.


3. It will become easier to make ultra-heavy armor. Expect to max out at around 72-73% with extraordinary resources pretty easily. Encumbrance will be slightly increased, probably around 10%, but who cares about that on ultra heavy suits? As a result the price of ultra-heavy armor will probably drop.







Is this all written in Stone now Jaato or is there anything you can do to get them to re-evaluate this?


By re-evaluation maybe a delay whiel they can take a closer look at things maybe read the Crafting Forums.


One thing I really like about SWG is it's economy, player driven meant player driven in this game. And while competition is a great thing to see and be part of, this will be ugly.


If they refuse to re-evaluate could you maybe get a small explanation as to why they feel this is the best route for Crafting in general and specifically the Armorsmith?



Sidenote:


I realize all correspondents do this of their own free will, and just wanted to recognize you as being one of the more in tune Correspondents of the forums I visit, whether it will be of benefit to anyone besides yourself to hear this I don't know but I thought it may be due.





Abelomosad/Rook
~ Master Armorsmith ~
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JaatoWaals
Sat Feb 28, 2004 4:06 pm
#20

Last time the devs attempted to make this change it provoked a huge outcry and was shelved. Whether the two are connected, well, only the developers know.



Waals Industries

-Armor for the new Imperium-

www.hrafnwarband.org
Shilak
Sat Feb 28, 2004 4:19 pm
#21

Im not quite sure why they are doing this as it seems to penalise the new armoursmiths a lot more than the established ones, and personally I think the new armoursmiths need more incentives rather than hinderances.


Maybe it would be a good idea to change the algorithm based on item complexity so that you can cap effectiveness on the low end armours with less experimentation points (4 on bone for example) and maybe limit the maximum number of experimentation points allowed as well so that a reasonably skilled armoursmith is capable of producing top notch bone and being master armoursmith only gives advantages on the higher armour types, e.g. ubese, padded, composite, RIS.


On my server I have noticed there is very little in the way of low end armour available, and the stuff that is available is very low quality. Master armoursmiths dont tend to make mabari or bone because the profits are less and they dont have the time to collect resources for more than a couple of armour types. Allowing lower specced armoursmiths to produce the best possible bone/mabari/chitin/etc would help fulfil this gap in the market.


I still think the high end armour is far too good which is why using lower end armour offers little benefit. Using armour should always be a compremise between taking less damage and using more HAM for specials, but the current state of the food and buffs within the system means that the penalty for wearing heavy armour is near non-existent. This has a knock on effect of making the lighter armour meaningless in the longterm. There needs to be more emphasis on balancing the HAM costs with the protection rather than the current method of getting the best protection and buffing to compensate for the HAM penalty. This probably wouldnt be an issue if they changed the HAM cost algorithm away from the linear one the system currently uses, to one that doesnt allow complete negation of HAM costs.


Sorry, got a little off subject at the end there.




M O R T A R I U S
Master Bounty Hunter / Master Pistoleer / Small Blue Fly on Chimaera

Vigeant
Sat Feb 28, 2004 5:39 pm
#22


is everyone dumb or something ?


the change means that:


you will be able to experiment layers to 100%


you will be able to experiment segments a little higher (unless you already hit 88% exp or more and then can hit 100%)


you will be able to experiment armors to alot more than you do.


that means you will be able to make 67% base with a few crappy ressources and we'll prolly see the cap on composite.



The change is GREAT but will require alot more tries on every subcomponent to get the maximum amazings.


1 pt mazing = +1 to max exp.

If you do 90% actually then you can hit 100%

Message Edited by Vigeant on 02-29-2004 01:42 AM



Vigeant
Master Armorsmith
Nerfed Jedi Master
SWG Beta Paying still cancelled.
Krallic
Sat Feb 28, 2004 6:54 pm
#23


Vigeant wrote:

is everyone dumb or something ?

The change is GREAT but will require alot more tries on every subcomponent to get the maximum amazings.






What most are thinking of is that experimenting in one direction is getting a slight boost, while if you don't want your composite to end up at 1000encumbrance this change is not for the better. Since you always have to add all your points to max a bar it is very hard to keep todays resists while also keeping the hamcosts of today. So in fact only 12 point smiths can even dream of makeing slightly the same armor as before.
pyclone
Sun Feb 29, 2004 2:29 am
#24

I think i speak for everyone when i say to the devs:



FIX THE GOD DAM PSG'S BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING ELSE!!!!!





Zocli a ilcoZ
Killer Doctor t Jedi Crafter
Vigeant
Sun Feb 29, 2004 4:58 am
#25






pyclone wrote:

I think i speak for everyone when i say to the devs:







no you don't.



Vigeant
Master Armorsmith
Nerfed Jedi Master
SWG Beta Paying still cancelled.
Dowlster
Sun Feb 29, 2004 7:58 am
#26

This is stupid. Why Break a system that already works?

All i can see this doing is making the prices of armor sky rocket, Master armorsmiths with deep pockets becoming even more richer.

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