Architect Archive

Make the 4 survay skills relavent, Have a Mining elite proffession, 4 trees, Organic, Inorganic, Chemical, Renewable. Then alow for any player to place a personal harvester, with no bonuses. The Miner proffession would be granted, mining instilations at novice miner with a 10-15% reduction in the BER of the mining instillations, the first tier should allow for a 10% bump or something for those groups of resources. Organic, inorganic and Chemical all gain at the same rate. Second tier you are granted the cert to opperate mediums, BER 10-13. But as in novice you should have a reduced BER rate of 10-15% of the total BER. The Third tier will grant you the total BER of the Medium instillation. The Fourth and final tier will grant you the usage of the Big boys, with the same 10-15% reduction in total BER, This makes the skill point usage vital to hit master where you get the whole BER of any harvester you can use. Now the renewable rescoure tree is a little differant, this is where you would place solar, wind and radioactive, I also want to include Water hear as well. The first skill box on this tier will allow you to place water harvesters, this is a mute point due to the fact that nothing requires much water at all. This also keeps them dependant on the economy of power. The second box will grant you wind bonuses, ie 10%. the third box is the solar power box, with no bonus. and the final box allows for the placement of a fusion gen, though this will have a 15% reduction in the BER. At master you get the 15% bonus, thus allowing you to harvest everything.

The creation of a mining proffession wouldhelp the economy, you limit usage of the harvesters to select few, thus driving up the price of "uber" rescources. Second you will have some Archie / Miners out their as well as crafter / gatherer. This will also help the Archie make a viable proffession in the future. This might seem crazy, but make radio active only harvestable by Fusion gens, make water required in more quanitys or higher stats. Thus with the higher price of the rescources, the Heavies will cost a ton. There will be a demand for lower level harvs, that are capped so there is no "fake" economy. It would be easy to impliment this too, make a check for harve cert when you go to pay maint or deposit power. If there is an unsuccessful cert check then you cant add to it. Then after a while the farms dissappear, and the miners come out to play.

This is a very easy thing to fix, and it requires 0 coding. As your demand goes down, lower your extraction. Instead of dropping 50 harvesters with your lot swapping, drop 5. It costs you less and you harvest less for a dwindling supply. Mind you some things will ALWAYS be in demand. Those things that are required to make consumable items (stims, buffs, food, some weapons, armor, etc.). Honestly, some of the prices on these resources are simply outrageous. I refuse to pay more than 3cpu on ANY resource. If that means I have to plant a harvester or two myself, then fine... or if I have to go without that uber stimpack, then fine. i willmake due with a lower quality one and be a little safer. Prices are out of control. Maybe reduced demand will help get them back in control.

---

Pawlin wrote:

Deflation of the resource market is not necessarily a bad thing IMHO. I don't mind paying less. I think that what we're seeing right now with lower prices is supply reacting to demand. We've also got some 'Walmart' type miners out there impacting the market as a whole with more supply and lower prices.

Miners won't stop mining as long as they make money. Mining is high profits even at 1cpu. If you've got some guy static mining with 90 lots then he'll stay in the business as long as money is flowing in. Lower prices will drive out the casual miners who are only in it for a quick buck, but not the bigger operations.

But irregardless of resource costs, if resource demand slows down then harvester demand will drop. We have seen that after the hologrind bubble burst.

---

I'd love to see a bit of a crash, it would get the people who are just in it for the buck out of the way, and stabilize things a bit. Harvester certifications would be a great touch too, I'd be a master miner in a heartbeat if they'd re-introduce that profession into the game.

That being said, my business hasn't slowed down a bit, nor have I lowered my prices.I do a lot of contract work though, as opposed to just having a ton of static harvesters, and I've been mining since July, so I'm not a "typical" miner if there is such a thing.

I'll try here since it is sort of related and my other post didn't get anything but negative response. I would really like to see some discussion about harvestor decay. Here is what I propose:

Add harvestor decay so that the BER decays with so much usage. For example 1 BER decay for each month of actual use of the harvestor. Tie this to durability experimentation so that maybe if you have bad duribility it would go down 1 BER in 2 weeks and if you have good durability it would go down 1 BER in 2 months. Of course the amount/timeframe is open for tweeking.

This would cause more demand for new harvestors even if you limited the decay so that it would only go down to say 1BER for personals, 2BER for Mediiums and 4BER for large. At some point the user would say I need a new harvestor. You wouldn't want the minimum to be right at the worst resource worst experimented harvestor because then the new architects wouldn't be able to sell anything, because the market would be flooded with "dead" harvestors.

For those who complain that you pay maintenance to keep the harvestor alive, either change the maintenance to property rental or just say maintenance doesn't cover the drill bits/ extraction mechanism.

I realize that this would be a major nerf for some, but I think it would improve the viability of the Architect profession for the the long run.

Oh, and I forgot to mention that it would have the added benefit that you could actually tweek BER rate maximums on harvestors then because the BER would Decay and you would eventually have to get new ones. So even though some people have High BER harvs now, if they use them at all they will degrade in value just like any other renewable resource.

sorry, double post

Message Edited by Kerico on 03-27-2004 12:44 AM

WOW. Thats all I have to say. Imaka you should tell them about the 900OQ 900PE Class 4 that spawned on gorath 5 or 6 months ago. People are paying anywhere from 80-120cpu for it. Why well its the best ever to spawn for docs. Sure we got another class 4 spawn since then 60OQ and 500 PE. Resource decay BAH. IMO Gorath has a steady economy. We have people selling grinding resources at 2-2.5cpu all the way up to 10cpu for thehigh OQstuff on the server.

Message Edited by tandisbrother on 03-27-2004 02:29 PM

I'd love to be a miner.

I think everyone agrees that resource decay isn't gonna happen for a variety of reasons.

Giving architects something that ensures continues (even if slowed) harvester demand seems important though. I think decaying extraction rate sounds like a good proposal.

Message Edited by Kerico on 03-28-2004 01:36 PM

dont know if i have anything to say but maybe a requirement of Nov artisan to use personals , engineering /domestic arts 4 for med harvester operation and Nov Elite crafting for large harvester operation .

That would keep the guy who has 10 friends getting him materials toned down a bit

---

Kerico wrote:

I think everyone would agree that harvesters are the big sellers for architect, sure we've gotten alot more houses since player cities. Lights are nice but not big ticket items.

Since the dreaded experimentation patch (which accidently put in experimentation and raised heavies from 7 to rate 10) then the followup correction patch (which raised it to a rediculous ber 13), the resouce economy has been floating on a bubble... The bubble of hologrinding... and guess what's leaving the game.

Resource prices are already dropping (someone on Ahazi wanted to find a dependable buyer for his weekly resource pull of 3.5 million units a week!)

There are far too many people harvesting at far too fast a rate! Lot swapping, increased resource awareness (swgcraft), massive resource hoarding and exagerated extraction rates... add it up.

1 person can easily extract 750k units a week! (8 heavies on 75% deposit for 7 days) Who but an architect can even craft away that many resources!? That's 75 vehicles or 3500+ guns or 250 suits of composite... who can sell that much?!

When the resource market crashes and these dabble miners can't find anyone to buy their supply, they're going to get out and dump these thousands of medium and heavy harvesters back on the market... and guess where new harvester sales are gonna go?? Right down the bowl!

Heavy prices have already dropped back to pre-experimentation prices. Archs are doing factory runs of heavies which is an almost rediculous concept.

Architecture's harvesters are an odd market... we sell to crafters (or thier miners) instead of combaters. All other crafters require far less resouces to make things that we do. They're building up massive stockpiles of resources (filling thier homes, input hoppers and banks with 100k stacks). Pretty soon they're gonna realize, they have enough to last them a lifetime, They'll scaleback harvesting only grabbing more when the truely wonderous resouce appears. They'll essentially be out of the market.

When the resource buyers are gone, the harvester buyers are gone...

I shudder to think about it but we need to.... nerf harvesters? add resource decay?? We certainly don't need higher BER...

Message Edited by Kerico on 03-19-2004 12:17 AM

---

Normally I would be inclined to disagree but I really do things are in a bubble situation atm and it is already in the process of deflating. Your points are correct, IMO. Most crafters can last a hideously long time on a few hundred k of this, few hundred k of that, so at what point does everyone have everything they need for the next 5-10 years? As if the game will last 10 years...

Here's what I recommend...put back the Miner class NOW! Then, only Miners get certs for medium and heavy harvs. Now if you want to sell resources you have to spend skill points. Of course, the impact of this change is mitigated by everyone having alts, but this would still be another 92 skill points for everyone to spend on.

Just my opinion...