Architect Archive
Thread: Housing prices from a Master Architect
I just wanted to point out, that many people on many boards have commented on how the "economy will just even itself out." Just like in the real world, if you don't use the economy it won't even out. People say wait it out, and such, but the bottom line is you have to remain competitive in the economy in order for it to prosper. This is not Socialism, everybody does not get the exact same price as everybody else. You have to at least have a shred of business prowess in you in order to survive, otherwise the economy will just continue to be massively inflated from the resource stand-point and horribly deflated from the crafted items standpoint. If you keep working now and stick through the rough times, then everything WILL even out. However, if you "wait it out" then enjoy sitting by and watching the economy collapse right before your eyes.
Lu'uka (sorry, i don't mean to come off as a jerk....:smileywink
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The originator or the thread was exactly right. There is one main force at play in the economy right now.. a whole server of new people trying to level their characters up. This leads to a couple of things. 1) Architects trying to level up are willing to sell cheap or even at a loss just so they can quickly grind out xp and get rid of what they made instead of destroying it. 2) An incredible demand for resources because people are grinding out xp. All of this means lower housing prices and higher resources prices currently. Once people no longer need the xp they are not going to be willing to sell cheap or at a loss. Also, once the grinding is over (for the most part) resources will be lower in demand, and prices will drop.
It's all about opportunity cost really. I've heard people say they can make 10-20k an hour running missions. If an architect can't find a way to make that much, less people will want to be architects. Supply will fall, and prices will rise accordingly. The economy will even itself out in the end.
Im not an architect, but just thought I would share a couple of observations:
I bought my small house on Naboo for 13k. Overpriced compared to others spamming the hell out of the cantina? Yes. But as a Master Artisan, I believe in paying a fair price to those peeps building things in the game. Also, I demand good service, and I chose my Architect based on the level of service they provided me.
For Master Architects there is no reason to build strctures for less than or equal to mineral costs unless as part of a PA effort/inititive. What's the point?
There will always be up and coming architects willing to sell the small house at under a fair market price in order to boost their xp. Hell if I could find someone that would take the600 blaster barrels I have to churn to make my basic weaponsmith skillz, I would sell them for 1cr a piece I personally think that just as in the real world, those with more advanced skillz will find that their right place is building more complicated things. Asking a Master Architect to built a small house is like asking a Master Weaponsmith to build a Scout Blaster. Sure it can be done by why bother?
ImmaHaxor: Master Artisan/Novice Weaponsmith, Intrepid/Naboo/Moenia
Well,
Seeing as you guys (all the upper lvl craftersactually ) who have played 18 hrs per day, and flooded the market with cheap wares so you could be "Uber". You didn't care then (heh 2 weeks ago) about everyone else that can't even keep their harvesters running cause you discounted you prices to under cost. Why do you ask for sympathy/support now.
Personnally, I don't even think I can play an Architect now you guys borked the economy so badly. I don't think anyone is gonna care one bit for any little guy (or ppl just now reaching the second skill tree) under-cutting you any chance they get.
Credits are an unsupported currency, like the US dollar is now. Previously it was supported by a gold standard, therefore the dollar had an intrinsic value. Now it is manipulated by the Fed through interest rate changes, essentially changing the supply and demand curve. Unlike Everquest, you can't just go to a vendor (The Fed) and trade in your credits for goods. So, what is a credit worth? Credits are generated through destroy and delivery missions, which means they can be equated to a unit of player time (labor). Roughly 20 minutes for two missions (about 2800 credits for me). They are consumedduringthe production of inorganic resources, flora and water, and thourgh maintenance of houses. Hides, bones and forages have no input credits, and are therefore separate. 2800 credits per 20 mins is 8400 credits per hour. This is different for each character based on their ability to do destroy missions.
Now that we have a theory on the value of credits, lets look at pricing. Supply and demand curves determine price in perfect markets. I'll leave out the Greater Fool theory, because there is little arbitrage going on yet. The supply of houses is determined by the number of people making them, the availability of the required resources, and the number of people wanting to buy. What is the lowest price they will be sold at? In the LONG RUN, it will be the marginal cost of the input materials. Which is directly tied to the credits needed to maintain harvesters and energy production. This marginal cost will DECREASE as more efficient methods of production are developed (i.e. Large Harvesters). Currently with personal harvesters the marginal cost of the production of a unit of ore at 70% concentration is 1 credit. With medium harvesters, its .54 credits.
In the SHORT RUN, I can't find anyone to build me a large harvester. There is a limited supply of skilled architects. Pricing at 3-5 credits per resource consumed is reasonable. I have 150k and not a **edit** thing to spend it on right now. Demand for lower level items like small houses is relatively high, but will drop drastically as players level up. Demand for higher end items will increase beyond what it is currently, but supply will ramp up as well.
An interesting question is: Are the number of credits coming into the system higher than those consumed through maintenance? My assumption is that players will do fewer Destroy missions in the future, what effect will that have on the economy? Should we expect inflation?
according to some stat the dev post in and after beta....
the economy have much higher rate of credit incoming then outgoing so the money supply on the servers are indeed growing. Harvesters maintence is no where near the rate of incoming credits... i think the dev were mumbling something about new money sinks
I'm not Master Architect yet, but I've had a pricing formula set up from the beginning, and have followed it from the beginning. I will not change it once I hit Master Architect, either.. I am close, I am 4th tier on every USEFUL branch (now I'll do experimentation just so I can get to master).
My pricing is basically a per-unit pricing... it is in an Excel spreadsheet, and set up so that I can weight resources based on... well, whatever... like, Metal is weighted at 1, meaning a 1 to 1 cost, but ferrous or non-ferrous metals are weighted at 1.1, and specific metals like steel, aluminum, copper are weighted at 1.2... even more specific types are weighted at 1.3 base... if a type is absent from the planet, I will temporarily weight it higher, and if it is super-abundant, I'll lower it even lower than 1. Ore I think I have weighted at 1.3 normally, since it is usually found in low concentrations, and carbonate ore at 1.4 or 1.5 (depending on whats on the planet at the time).
This is how I determine the "total resource cost" of the structures. basically, if something takes 1000 metal, and 500 aluminum.... and for some reason aluminum does not exist in the galaxy, lets assume my weightings at the time are 1.0 for metal and 1.5 for aluminum (higher than normal because its hard to get)... means my pricing assumes 1000*1.0 + 500*1.5 = 1750 resources required. I then have a multiplier that I charge per "weighted resource".
This basically gives me a flowing, flexible pricing structure that I can adjust on the fly for resource availability. Also, things like identical parts and factory use are added in, the cost of the schematics assumed in part of the price, as well as a very small charge for factory usage... then, I have 1 more attribute assigned to each item, which is a 'skill mod' or 'demand mod'... I have this all at 1 for everything right now, but I am able to make a specific item higher cost per resource due to its placement on the skill tree, or the fact that EVERYONE wants one...
This works VERY well for me... and while there are a lot of people selling for a lot less than I do, I think my prices are very reasonable, even cheap, and I have a LOT of customers. More than I can handle, really.
By my current setup, assuming all resources are easily available on the planet, the prices come out about as follows:
Small house: 16,599
Medium house: 99,899
Large house: 184,279
Medium Harvester (mineral): 18,899
Solar Generator: 24,549
Heavy Harvester (mineral): 186,989
Heavy Harvester (gas): 133,469
Guild hall: (approximated based only on resource cost, not including any required identicals if there are any): 441,359
Furniture... well, can't remember the prices on this, but most things on the lower teirs are from 300 - 900, and the tier 4 cafe table is around 1.5k, the dinner table is around 4.7k... I think... don't have the sheet here, so most of this is from memory, but I believe really close if not the same numbers.
I'll hit master today.
My prices for housing on Flurry have never changed from this rate, and I think i'll keep them there.
13k small
55k med. (60k med. Generic (**edit** is there and extra wall for???))
145k Lg.
I wont even bother with installations. For the small amount of credits people are willing to pay for them its not worth my time to chase around all the different materials required to build them. I'll happily stick with houses and furniture.
I take orders only by email, and people that continually /tell me with n00b questions like 'is it done yet' 10x often find themselves on the ignore list with no house at all. I craft because i like it,not because i'm obligated to sit in one place 12hrs a day building houses for players.
Its saddening how many crafters are about to give up crafting because of the impoliteness/rudeness of their customers.