Architect Archive

I don't usually think much of pplexploring the system to it's maximum, unfortunatly the Devs seems to be very bad at predicting the future and they didn't see cross-server lot trading happening. I don't think they intended for anyone to operate 60 heavies, that is 6 characters right there. I believe that may be just another factor in the out-of-control situation we have now. I think it should be stoped, how I don't know...

You say you make a lot of money, wouldn't you be as rich if you somehow got your lots in the same server? Renting/askign/buying, that way the number of slots in a server would still be 10 times the number of characters there and you'd still be in business.

I run a small mining/architect company we have 28 harvesters all from ppl in server, mostly friends of mine who play more casual and don't have use for them. I provide what I can for them free of charge and I get the slots. I sell at 3cpu to a couple of crafters who order from me, so I'm not a static miner. How do you run your business from 60 static harvesters? Do you sell for architects only? Grinders?

Arianrhod

Message Edited by RotorofCorRng on 06-09-2004 06:27 AM

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ThothTheWise wrote:

Greetings,

The Rumour Mill is whispering about The Devs possibly changing how the administration of all structures functions.

Come the Space Expansion and the "influx" of newer players, I'm hearing that they feel those of us who have done extensive LOT Trades will have an unfair advantage over them.

I myself operate an extensive Mining Operation upon Lowca, and Have taken Steps to try and get this topic into the forfront befor they just up and state "This is what we are going to do because its best for... whatever".

I do not fight against this blindly, All I would Like to see is them come INTO the game and look at what I am doing and work with us to discover possible Options and reach a compromise.

To this end I am now writing this post in all the Crafters sections and will do My best to Keep up with them all.

Now My Email Sent to TH;

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An Offer to Explain The Mining Profession as it stands.

(Sir, As the Players Representative I am sending this to you Alone. Feel free to forward this to anyone you deem might be interested.)

Greetings,

My name is I'Thoth from the Lowca server. My guess is that in the future the developers will/might think to change how the Admin works on Structures and Harvestors/Factories.

I would Like to take the time to show and Explain My business model to those who might be interested as well as discuss the potential detriments they might forsee of us doing our chosen vocation.
I have over 300 harvestors and spend a great deal of my time simply doing that alone. It takes 3 hours just to retrieve the resources from them and twice that to add the cash and power bi-monthly.

For those of you Not aware..that equates to 30 million credits and 30 million units of power I put into them Bi-Monthly. This also does not include the Storage facilities i operate to store all this stuff befor the weekly sale as well as storing some of the excess that dosent.

I rotate my stock and Have a thread I Update Weekly at http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=lowca_trade&message.id=79583.

Before any decision is made on this endevor...I would greatly appritiate it if I might be allowed to champion the Miners Cause, By showing Those who might be interested EXACTLY what I do and the Cost vs Gain of what we do. We are always at risk of those we lot trade with deleting their chars..as well as the Market trends and the Competition of others doing what we do better or cheaper.

Any way I am not the best writer to be had...But if anyone even wishes to learn about what we do from the ground by a Real Mining Co...not from some odd data gained from the servers....I am willing to spend as much time decribing things as is neded or desiered.

Thank You for reading this and considering this Proposal,

I'Thoth
Helfire Mining Co.
LOK / Lowca

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I would really Like to start discvussing the options and think about things as they might, so when it finally comes..we have a well thought out and reasonable Face to give to them...complete with Solutions and compromises to their potential issues.

Thank You for your time, And I hope to continue this discussion with you all,

I'Thoth

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Not that i understand exactly what your concern is, butlast time i checked there was no "Miner profession", developers never intended to have people create never used toons on servers just so people can have 100's of lots to mine like crazy.

A player is given 10 lots, if he want more, he can borrow some from his friend wich then obviously has less lots to play with. This i think is what the devs intended.

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RotorofCorRng wrote:

Cross server lot trading sucks and it is an unfair advantage over those that dont have the time or are new. I hope they make it impossible for you guys that take such advantage of an obvious unintentional way to overpower a portion of the game.

Message Edited by RotorofCorRng on 06-09-2004 06:27 AM

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There is no unfair advantage when it coems to cross server lot trading. anyone at any point in time during their SWG life can make a cross-server lot trade, newb or otherwise.

The only reason you see it as unfair to new people is because they do not have the credits or the resources to procure a multitude of harvesters. I have gone through the same feelings you have, the frustration and anger but it all comes down to this - Within the rules of the game written or otherwise it does not infringe on the fairness of anyones game play.

if you are against cross-server lot trades solely on the basis of "fairness" then any master profession holder shold drop all there skills and become a newb. Masters have worked hard or at least devoted more time than a newb player who has come in 3 months after launch. its not fair that a master architect has all the business against another newb who wants to be an architect.

as for having enough time, other players dont control how much you play. if they can play more hours than you so be it. its not their fault that YOU choose not to play as often as they do. everyone has a different time schedule so deal with it.

to conclude i see your point, a point that barely touches on a mere moral issue hardly worth debating at this time. if its such anobvious "error" how it is unintentional? this issue has already been addressed by the devs and as of now, it is deemed fair. so make you peace with it, and a little advice:

"those who wish ill fate upon others often findan ill fatethemsleves."

Farewell and good journey

They're getting rid of the ability to easily swap lots?

Finally.

I just hope I will be able to play my other toon too. If not, I'm willing to accept that.

I think the best way to stop lot swaps is make placing a medium or heavy miner require amaster artisan. That will stop most cross-server trading as people wont want to invest the time grinding just ot swap lots.

I do believe lot swapping is inherantly wrong. I do it myself, I wont lie. But I have professed since day 1 that it should be removed from the game.

I'm not clear: why is cross-server lot swapping wrong? And how is it an abuse of the game mechanics? It's not exploiting or cheating. It doesn't hurt you (or at least, you haven't explained how it hurts you). How is it any different from renting or borrowinglots from other people on the server?

I don't use cross-server lots, mainly because it sounds like a tremendous hassle, and I generally only trust people I know. But I don't have a problem with other people doing it, if they so choose.

I've noticed a tendency, across all professions (and generally mirrored in real life as well), for people to complain when others are doing better then they are. Instead of creditingother's success to hard work, it's attributed instead to cheating/exploiting and a call goes out for the Devs to "do something!". I've seen in it in calls to stop cross-server lot trading; I've seen it in calls to cerftify harvestors; I've seen it in calls to restrict buffing to Master Doctors only; and in many other ways. Unless someone is using a real exploit, instead of worrying about what others are doing, just worry about what you are doing. Their success takes nothing away from you.

Slim Vargo, Corbantis

/sign.

Making harvs require certifications is a bad idea. I'm stating that now. End of discussion.

Now, if lot swaps are an abuse of the game mechanics, why does SOE allow them? For that matter, explain to me how they even are an abuse?

Also, to clarify, when I'Thoth says the miner profession, he doesn't mean an actual profession...he's just referring to anyone who manages a large number of harvesters. Heck, I do it myself...I operate 70 or more fusion harvesters at any given time, and sell bulk power.

Another way to consider this. I'Thoth is far from the only person who does this on Lowca. A friend and guildmate...two, in fact (Iaan and Tzimisce) also run similar operations, though Iaan's are more mobile harvesters on lots rented from guildmates...which is irrelevant, really - I've actually heard a few details on the changes, and they would affect him and the mobile lots, not just statics from cross-server trades. Anyway, I know that a lot of large armorsmiths and weaponsmiths will occasionally put in orders with Iaan for some new thing that shifted in...either that, or they've got a similar operation of their own to help supply them with minerals. Such operations or purchases from another person with such an operation are certainly expensive, but the bulk availability offered by either way allows the manufacterer to do two things - sell at a lower cost, and produce FAR more items to sell. Restrict such people to such a tiny number of lots, and they'll have far more trouble supplying their customers needs, which will in turn result in those customers producing fewer products and having to charge more for them.

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EdOWar wrote:

I'm not clear: why is cross-server lot swapping wrong? And how is it an abuse of the game mechanics? It's not exploiting or cheating. It doesn't hurt you (or at least, you haven't explained how it hurts you). How is it any different from renting or borrowinglots from other people on the server?

I don't use cross-server lots, mainly because it sounds like a tremendous hassle, and I generally only trust people I know. But I don't have a problem with other people doing it, if they so choose.

I've noticed a tendency, across all professions (and generally mirrored in real life as well), for people to complain when others are doing better then they are. Instead of creditingother's success to hard work, it's attributed instead to cheating/exploiting and a call goes out for the Devs to "do something!". I've seen in it in calls to stop cross-server lot trading; I've seen it in calls to cerftify harvestors; I've seen it in calls to restrict buffing to Master Doctors only; and in many other ways. Unless someone is using a real exploit, instead of worrying about what others are doing, just worry about what you are doing. Their success takes nothing away from you.

Slim Vargo, Corbantis

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If you had read my post you would see that this has nothing to do with anyone doing better than me, I do lot swap, I have about 100 harvs down, i get as many minerals as anyone could ever use. I have also seen this type of activity ruin other mmorpg's, I really doubt sony intended servers to be inhabited by thousands of accounts that are never used and are only there for the prupose of giving their lots to another player, and in my opinion anything that is using the system in a way that is unintended is shady at best.

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Velisimner wrote:

if you are against cross-server lot trades solely on the basis of "fairness"

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I am also against it 'cause if were intended part of the game, YOU would have been given 200 lots to use.

Here is a credit back, your two credits worth wasnt worth that much.