Architect Archive

I'd even go further:

Medium Harvesters: only usable by Elite Artisan classes (DE, Architect, Weapon Smith, Armor Smith, Cook etc. AND a new Miner Tree

Heavy Harvesters: only usable by Master Miners (so yes, excluding Architects)

This would ofcourse lower the demand on Harvesters, but then again, if architects finally raise their prices as they should do, it shouldn't be to much of an impact.

Add to this working experimentation to diversify the crafted goods and the class should be completely viable again. I expect tho that architects overall aren't willing to restrictthemselves from using something they craft (Like Weaponsmiths that can't use all the guns they produce andDE's that cannot use the seeker droids they craft)

Goff McMerrii
Miner

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EvaBrurikaen wrote:

After reading several posts about the inability to place harvesters, and my own troubles finding a spot of unspoiled land to place things down, I started thinking of how the whole architect system could be revamped.

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You shouldn't have to have trouble finding a spot to place you harvesters, even now. Yes, it does require you to travel to spots that are 3 or more hours away from town, but there's lots and lots and LOTS of free space on very lucrative veins to be found on any planet. Lastweek I placed 4 Medium Harvesters on a 80+% LGO spot on the very very very left top on the map of Rori. More then 3 hours walk and (no surprise) no competetors around. I could've placed 100 Heavies if I had them and the slots required.

Goff McMerrii
Miner

Lets see..

Limiting Heavy harvesters to Miners might work if there actually was a Miner profession.

Although making it so that you cant use something you crafted seems to be a silly idea. Lets not forget the mass amounts of resources that architects must have to even make heavy harvesters. So no I don't think that Heavys should be limited to "Miners" Maybe they should be limited to Master Architect since there really are no other reasons to gain this level.....

Also...

Walking 3 hours to place harvesters might work if there was a way to check them from a different place.

Otherwise I would spend more time walking to the harvesters, and have no time to craft items with them. Unless I quit my job, and played full time. Which wouldnt be so bad if it payed the bills.

Why is it that a camp can alter the shape of a mountain to lay itself down, but a harvestor cant be placed on the slightest of slopes?! If anything this should be reversed. Real miners will take out a whole mountain to get the resources, but we are stopped my a minor bump in the ground.

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Limiting Heavy harvesters to Miners might work if there actually was a Miner profession.

IMO, it's absolutely needed to "fix" (or "guide the community towards") most of the problems architects and other crafter classes face.

Although making it so that you cant use something you crafted seems to be a silly idea.

All Master Weaponsmiths can use all weapons they craft?
All Droid Engineers can use all droids they produce?

It's not a silly idea at all. It actually is absolutely in line of "the vision" that DEV's of games like this hold as a holy grail (and they should IMO)

Lets not forget the mass amounts of resources that architects must have to even make heavy harvesters.

So? Buy 'em from your Friendly Neighberhood Miner for a fair price of 3cpu. Sell off the product you create out of it for 6 ~7 cpu. It's up to the architect community to set their own price. The economic prices are not a design issue, they are set by the community and can go up and down. Somehow everyone thinks prices can only go down. In RL prices usually only go up (even at Wall-Mart), it's called inflation and usually hovers around 7% per year. If you think your sell prices are to low to keep you in business, then take your responsability: raise 'em.

So no I don't think that Heavys should be limited to "Miners" Maybe they should be limited to Master Architect since there really are no other reasons to gain this level.....

Face it, making one class viable on it's own isn't going to happen, ever. Better work with the "basic rules" developers set for themselves then to ask unrealistic things that won't ever going to happen. It's not realistic to say: "No-one should be able to use XXX, except for me"

In order to get the possitive parts of your proposal to work, some negative parts need to be introduced. It's not a new concept and happens in every discussion and diplomatic and economic agreements: you give some and you gain some.

Actually I advocated harvester certifications for those who have the surveying line in artisan. levels 3-4 would give you access to harvesters that work at the rate they are supposed to 3 mediums 4 heavies. I also think if they add mining as a profession I think they should add some ability to place on uneven terrain (they do it with POI's all the time flatten out the area to make room for a tent or something) they should also get higer effciency in extraction and power consumption. I also think they should get access to some exotic harvesters maybe an off shore harvester placable in water. Something interesting like that

"So? Buy 'em from your Friendly Neighberhood Miner for a fair price of 3cpu. Sell off the product you create out of it for 6 ~7 cpu. It's up to the architect community to set their own price. The economic prices are not a design issue, they are set by the community and can go up and down. Somehow everyone thinks prices can only go down. In RL prices usually only go up (even at Wall-Mart), it's called inflation and usually hovers around 7% per year. If you think your sell prices are to low to keep you in business, then take your responsability: raise 'em."

Have you ever tried to sell any architect Item for 6-7cr per?

and yes I am sure that DEs can use all droids they produce, and I am sure that even with penalty Weaponsmiths can use the items they produce. The difference is that Items in the Weaponsmith line require a Cert. If they HAD to use their items to move forward in their profession I am sure the devs would have made it so they could use all without needing certs.

The fact remains that to craft serveral PA halls, or other Large structuresthere is no way that you can amass the amounts of resources needed with Personal, and Medium harvesters, atleast not and stay in Business long.

Darn no edit button.

""No-one should be able to use XXX, except for me""

Ok then I want to be able to use a Rancor without Getting CH.

That sounds fair.

Fact remains that you're not open to "restrictions" posed upon yourself, while you are willing to restrict everyone else. You'll have to keep the whole picture in mind, not simply your own profession. When drafting suggestions in games like this keep in mind:

1. What do I want to have added as ability


2. What am I willing to give up to be able to get that ability

Restricting Heavy Harvesters to only architects alone,won'tchange the current situation your profession isin. The only thing it'll do is breed MORE architects (see other threads on it) who will dump their product at low prices because they have to make them to get XP *shrug* Those players become Architect because they want to place Heavy Harvesters. Your initial suggestion actually has the exact opposate effect as the one you'd want: More Current Customers that become Master Architects to be able to use Heavy Harvesters, dumping everythingless thenHeavy Harvesters for a lower price to recoup a bit of cash on their combines.

On topic of prices, again, is not a design decission, it's a player decission. You and your fellow architects set the price. I sold deeds in UO for 150K (where my fellow woodcrafters would sell them for 75K) and I sold 20 of them a day on average. "Them's undercutters" can't keep up with the demand, they realy cannot. The customer in this game doesn't look for _lowest price_ he looks for _I want it NOW_. He might state he can get it somewhere for a lower price (and he's right, there are architects that sell it for lower)and who'd blame him, customers are always looking for the lowest price possible. But in the end, if he has to wait 1 week or even a few days for his order to be made by the cheaper architect (and the great resource spot he've just found has shifted again), then he WILL rather buy it from the more expensive architect that can deliver on the spot.

Ask your fellow Architects here around, there's plenty of them that sell for 5cpu and haven't seen the huge decrease in sales you are expecting.

"Restricting Heavy Harvesters to only architects alone,won'tchange the current situation your profession isin. The only thing it'll do is breed MORE architects (see other threads on it) who will dump their product at low prices because they have to make them to get XP *shrug* Those players become Architect because they want to place Heavy Harvesters. Your initial suggestion actually has the exact opposate effect as the one you'd want: More Current Customers that become Master Architects to be able to use Heavy Harvesters, dumping everythingless thenHeavy Harvesters for a lower price to recoup a bit of cash on their combines."

If they are willing to spend all their skill points to get MA for the sole purpose of getting heavy harvesters then more power too them.

You say I am unwilling to give anything up.. ok.. heres the deal.

I will gladly give up the right to use personal harvesters. Lets take away the Weaponsmiths ability to use personal crafting stations, or the Armorsmiths ability to make their own armor segments. Then we will talk about Heavy harvesters.

There seems to be another flood of novice archs on the Intrepid server. Their grinding has allowed me to see personal harvesters go for 200 credits on the bazaar (bought them up and sold them in my shop). Many of these novice archs are interested in one branch onlly......installations. They end up dabbling in the other branches and then the undercutting gets worse. Ugh.

I do not agree with the 'Mining' profession because architects are quantity dependant on materials. I do agree to some extent that the installations branch has to be made more difficult. Want to make and use heavies? Then pony up valuable skill points and get Construction IV done as a pre-req. The other crafters are NOT dependent on quantity, so if they choose not to commit to heavies, they will do fine with mediums and personals. Maybe the level of exp pts should be upped to qualify for a skill. This may deter some of the players from 'playing' architect. Not too unlike weaponsmith, where you are worthless until you get by experimatation III, which represents a slow and painful grind.

Exactly what I have been trying to say..

Thank you