Architect Archive
Thread: Idea's For Arch/Crafter in the GCW
My First Idea is to have Faction Specific Craftable items. For example maybe there could be a Rebel Specific home (with secret compartments to hide illegal items), and also Imp. Specific Homes (with some sort of imperial perk). I think in order to place and own these houses you would have to have a certain amount of Faction Points, and also I think to build these buildings you would also have to have the right skillbox AND the right amount of faction points. I think this could also work for all the other crafting professions (i.e. faction specific weapons, armor, cloths and droids. With some work it could even be possible to do faction specific vendors and even food.) Also imagine how cool it would be for Imp Cities and Rebel Cities to have their own Imperial Guild Hall, or Secret Rebel Guild Hall.
Anyways i want to hear other's ideas, and if we get enough ideas here, maybe the DEV's will look at them
Circe' Pojia
Khristen wrote:The banners are really something I'd love to see. But a faction guild-hall.....that would ROCK! Makes it real easy to tell if a city is Imperial or Rebel if you walk in and see huge Imperial banners hanging off their guild hall.I'd also love to see the faction furniture you can currently get be transformed into a limited use schematic for an architect with the right amount of skill and/or faction can make. The only problem is that if you make it so only a factioned person can use that schematic you run the risk of not being able to find someone.The thing that has always come up when discussion how to bring crafters into the GCW is what is the risk to the crafter to be factioned. Fighting has it's own risks, factioned or otherwise. Maybe there doesn't need to be any. I don't really have the answer. I just worry that if there isn't some potential consequence for being a factional-aligned crafter making factional goods you'll see a ton of "faction grinder" crafters flood the professions. The hologrind was bad enough; we don't need faction grinders, too. A TEF (under the current system) is most certainly not the answer. I don't imagine you'd have too many factional crafters if they get a TEF every time they make a piece of furniture and JoeL33tImp comes along and sends them to the cloning center. LOL
Good Point Khris. Right now i don't have any ideas for the risk's of crafter's aligning with either faction. I will keep thinking... hopefully everyone else will too
What does everyone think?
linusboarder wrote:
Ok i had an idea last night about risk involved for factioned crafters. First i think that you should have to use special crafting stations to craft factioned items... and these stations are TEF'd, then they could be destroyed, which would be a huge pain, but it wouldn't result in a crafter being TEF'd. I know this is a small idea, but i think it's something to build on (especially if you have say rebel and imp factories that could be attacked and destroyed or damaged).
What does everyone think?
I move my stations to a shop (i.e.: not in same house with vendors) and declare it private. You now have no access to destroy my station. And don't suggest that my harvesters be likewise factioned.
I agree this is going to be a problem. A crafter making factional items should be aligned, although that would be agamerule, not necessarily reality.I suppose there is some arguement for "impartial arms dealers, loyal only to their bank balance." The big problem with factioning is that crafters have no way of defending themselves from elite combat classes. Personally, it would suck to go service my harvesters, only to have a patrol of ST's turn me overt (or a probe at the starport). Have that happen two or three times running, and suddenly the game's a lot less appealing.
This gets into the overall concept of the TEF and overt status. I don't think we can solve the problem for Archi's alone. It's going to take a broad, game-wide solution, of which we'll only be part. So here follows my plan, such as it is.
It's a given that each side in a war tries to protect (through some form of counter-intelligence and secrecy) their non-combatant support personnel. If we were at war with China, wewouldn't have ourengineers who design tanks fly through Bejing airport. But in the "real" world, it's not necessary for those engineers to go out and collect their raw materials (oh gawd, I may just have given them the idea they need to force us to buy our resources from "miners," who will probably be the very same elite classes lying in wait to kill us at the starport...).
So, instead of the whole TEF/overt thing, a factionally-aligned character with either:
- merchant, or
- an elite crafting class, or
- an entertainer class
AND who hasno elite combat class,
can not be forced overt by scanners, probe droids,or ST's. He or she is always assumed to be covert.How would they know anyway? Upon entering the Rebellion (or Imperial Service) you became one of thehidden support network with a super-double-sekrit-identity when you operate in public. 
The sole exception would be minefields and scanners in the player-crafted factional bases (once they work, heh), to prevent gimp exploits during base attacks. "Quick, send in theEntertainer to shut their base down! They'll never suspecta belly dancer!"
Thishas the advantage of allowing non-combat classes the ability to be in a faction, without having to worry that they are certain to die for it. Repeatedly, in fact. By preventing all but minefields and player-base scanners from declaring them overt, they can now even come along on attacks, and set up buff/heal camps well away from the enemy base; attacking players can retreat there to have their mind wounds removed and get rebuffed. Of course, the defending players will try to locate the support camp and counter-attack to kill the weak, respawned characters, but at least the Entertainer is not toast. (Oh, and now you need a scout along too, for the camp!)
One question I can see here is the treatment of CH's, doctors,and combat medics. Allowing them to be non-tef'd would be in keeping with our 20th century "civilized" notions of warfare, but would inevitably mean doctors standing right in front of enemy turrets, healing the pikemen smacking on it, or CH's using their creatures to stand guard around the camp without fear of being attacked. And Combat Medics are *meant* to be in the battle. So I'd have to say, doctors go under the entertainer/no combat immunity, CM's and CH's do not. Note that all of these characters can still choose to go overt, in order to go on faction missions or to take their chances in PvP. And any elite crafting character that gains an elite combat profession loses their immunity.
Oneadditional caveat: -- a doctor healing/buffing someone overt while s/he is OUTSIDE a camp will get a TEF. If s/he remains within a camp, s/he's immune from attack, even if the target is outside. (What, you thought it would be easy tocounter-attack the enemy's camp?) I don't know what the range for player-base scanners is, but it would obviously have to extend to a radius around the base (or simply, prevent camps from being placed within 64 meters of a base) to prevent exploits.
I'm not deep into the GCW, so there may be holes/pitfalls in this I have not seen. Please feel free to poke them so I can refine the idea; once I feel it's workable, I'll take it to the GCW forum and post it there. I don't think we're going to find a "perfect" plan, but one that's workable would be nice.
CrimsonSplat-Okay so crafting stationed can't really be made Factioned, but what about factories, guild hall's and other buildings.
My idea is that if a city is declared a certain faction, then certain buildings become factioned buildings (Guild Hall's, Town Halls,Cloning Center's, Garage's, Factories.. you know things that would be targets in war) and these factioned buildings coul;d now be targeted. Then crafter's could build defenses for these buildings and the opposing faction could attack the building, and the defenses. Building defenses could include gun turrets (Built by weaponsmiths) Security Droids (obviously build by DE's) Building Plating (built by Arch's) and Building Shield Generators (built by Armorsmiths). While the turrets, security droids and plating could be destroyed normally, the shield generator would have to be sliced by a smuggler.
I know this would lead to some cities staying neutral and really be factioned. But maybe if a certain % of citizens inside city limits are factioned a certain way, and a certain % aren't of the other faction then it is automatically declared as factioned (the same way a city gains rank).
People let me know what you think
linusboarder wrote:
I like the ideas that are coming in... if the DEV's look at this post i think they will have a very good base to work from.
CrimsonSplat-Okay so crafting stationed can't really be made Factioned, but what about factories, guild hall's and other buildings.
My idea is that if a city is declared a certain faction, then certain buildings become factioned buildings (Guild Hall's, Town Halls,Cloning Center's, Garage's, Factories.. you know things that would be targets in war) and these factioned buildings coul;d now be targeted. Then crafter's could build defenses for these buildings and the opposing faction could attack the building, and the defenses. Building defenses could include gun turrets (Built by weaponsmiths) Security Droids (obviously build by DE's) Building Plating (built by Arch's) and Building Shield Generators (built by Armorsmiths). While the turrets, security droids and plating could be destroyed normally, the shield generator would have to be sliced by a smuggler.
I know this would lead to some cities staying neutral and really be factioned. But maybe if a certain % of citizens inside city limits are factioned a certain way, and a certain % aren't of the other faction then it is automatically declared as factioned (the same way a city gains rank).
People let me know what you think
You missed the part where I said "definately not the harvesters," didn't you? :-)
Look, it sounds great in theory -- ol' Sun Tzu would have loved it, but in the end, this isn' t war. It's entertainment, and there is no way any sane person should want to open themselves to that kind of griefing. I do NOT want to see a full run of walls go poof because some jerk elite pikeman, whom I can't touch in combat skills, is camping my factories every night. And the automated defenses are not going to work; they'd have to tough enough to hold off duos and small parties, would cost a fair bit themselves, and still I'd be getting hammered. The whole point of giving us roles in the GCW is to give us a market so we will be paid to replace stuff the enemy blew up, not so we can endlessly replace our own harvesters and factories, plus suffer the losses of all just-finished or stored items inside them (so much for that tactic!).
The more i think about it, the more I think this would lead the way to help an overall GCW restructuring. Yeah it's entertainment, but it's entertainment based on war... and what better way to be entertained than to add strategy and tactics to a war roleplaying game? The biggest downside of the Arch economy is that buildings can only be destroyed through neglect, this would help the Arch economy by allowing a replacement of buildings, and also not hurt the arch, and other crafters, by allowing the destruction of their factories... even though now we are back into the foray of what does a crafter risk by declaring a faction.. to which there seems to be no easy solution
CrimsonSplat... i love the discussion keep the ideas and counterpoints coming