Weaponsmith Archive

Thread: Uber loot what no, you didn't say! A mind set that destroys the game(for now I hope)

Trean
Sat Feb 12, 2005 2:30 am
#1
Yeah so a while back I posted a sort of medium length post about how the economy is shifting towards a much more loot based economy and how this will be bad for crafters, and weaponsmith in specific since they are very directly affected by uber loot.


Well, when I made the post, no one believe me. I bumped it up a month or two ago, and still only a hand full of people were truly concerned.



I am here to simply say, I told you so. With the implementation of Anti-Decay Kits, loot weapons will rule the game. The mind set of the economy is not that the weaponsmith can create the best weapons, but rather the weaponsmith either can't beat the looted weapon or needs quite good to awesome enhancements to create top of the line stuff. The mind set is completely shifted now, and I don't see how you can contest. I know we all still sell weapons, but this will change too over time as more people get anti-decay kits and realize how to use them best(or worst for us atleast). I know we still sell weapons to grinders to, but who buys more weapons grinders or power players that are trying to get loot that will no longer decay thus eliminating the need for us .



I truly truly hope the combat upgrade whatchamacallit will fix this. I don't see it being mended over a short period of time though, the inflictions are great. All I can do now is continue to make the best I can and hope that the developers will get a few senses for the crafters left in game, and Felton doesn't lose his voice while screaming at them of course . So with that...


Let's Hope



Trean Speyr-Caggeyder
Former SWG Player
Voted Starsider's Best Weaponsmith - August 2005

ShugFlurry
Sat Feb 12, 2005 3:36 am
#2
/worship Trean...

I'm tempted to buy a 750 max hammer with 400 condition for 8m since I could just anti-decay it.

How could the devs overlook something like this? I'm sure they said that the game will have an economy in which crafters will play the biggest part, NOT LOOT.



Shug
12pt Master WeaponSmith Master Force Crafter
-843 2827 Dantooine, Mining Outpost
Kemp4x
Sat Feb 12, 2005 3:53 am
#3
anti decay kit is the end of the game, now who have money have ever more more power..... only 1 question.. made anti decay kit not tradable is too hard to think???

bha....




Master Weaponsmith 12 exp. point
Master Armorsmith 12 exp. point.
IGN: Kemp
*****Arcadia Weapon Vendor***** Corelia-Arcadia +3118 -1697
*****Kinaski HQ Resource-Armor Vendor***** Corelia-Coronet +684 -3892

please offer auction item into my Arcadia vendor
Eclipse442
Sat Feb 12, 2005 4:41 am
#4

I just have to add my two cents.. I've been itching to do this, but was trying to hold myself back. Oh well.


First off, it's not as bad as you think. I've been counting the ADK's up for auction, andso far on my server, the total is 18. Which means, 18 people will have non-decaying weapons? Sure, maybe more, but how many more? With the Lightsaber fix, it would appear that 99% of these kits will go into third and higher generation sabers to protect the valuable pearls, but hey, guess what! Lightsabers dont affect Weaponsmith sales! I hate to come off on the wrong foot, but I think this ADK "problem" is being blown out of proportion. As far as I see it, it is infusing LOADS of money from [mostly] Jedi players into the hands of non-Jedi, which means they will be looking to buy our acklay PH's and Scythes. T-21's and the like of ranged weapons will still sell, because for the most part, a good ranged player will not damage their weapon enough to justify using a kit on it. I think the reason it was a 12 month reward, and not a 3 month reward was for the fact that these kits are primarily for Jedi, which most 12 months have, or are close to unlocking. This reward was placed with the intent to protect pearls, IMO, not some 700+ PH. Think of it this way -- Does it make sense to put something worth 12-20 million credits into a 5 million dollar PH, or "uber" looted one, -OR- sell your kit to a Jedi [or insanely rich player]and buy 2, 3 even 4 more identical weapons down the road, assuming you'll even need to replace these items at all?(It's rumoured that the CU will fix the repair mods, and with the emergence of 100% kits, what are the chances that such a weapon *will* break down the road).


I realize that most of you have lost intrest by this point, so I'll re-itterate my point. This isn't the end of the world! NDK kits affect the top 1% of players on all the servers. Realistically, there is no way to support the idea of putting a 12 million dollar (if you traded for one) NDK into a 5 million dollar weapon - It just makes no fiscal sense! However, if you've spent this equivalent building up your lightsaber with premium pearls, you can safely justify using one.


Thoughts? Flames? Post away, the can of worms has been opened!


edited to clarify some points

Message Edited by Eclipse442 on 02-12-2005 03:48 AM



Emmily Fray +12 point Weaponsmith
Vendors in League City Dantooine
Kyodor
Sat Feb 12, 2005 4:46 am
#5
Remember that the NDK will only be available to 12 month Vets, unless people buy them.

The entire High/Middle/Low player market is still open. Only the extreme - high players will want to NDK their uber LS'.

Unless the Influx of new players is halted, in which case the game would pretty much die anyway, you still have a large market.



Logic
Grammar
Ratification

Got Coherence?
Luzenit
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:20 am
#6

Emmily states:

I just have to add my two cents.. I've been itching to do this, but was trying to hold myself back. Oh well.


First off, it's not as bad as you think. I've been counting, so far on my server, 18 have been put up for auction. Which means, 18 people will have non-decaying weapons? Sure, maybe more, but how many more? With the Lightsaber fix, it would appear that 99% of these kits will go into third and higher generation sabers to protect the valuable pearls, but hey, guess what! Lightsabers dont affect Weaponsmith sales! I hate to come off on the wrong foot, but I think this NDK "problem" is being blown out of proportion. As far as I see it, it is infusing LOADS of money from [mostly] Jedi players into the hands of non-Jedi, which means they will be looking to buy our acklay PH's and Scythes. T-21's and the like of ranged weapons will still sell, because for the most part, a good ranged player will not damage their weapon enough to justify using a kit on it. I think the reason it was a 12 month reward, and not a 3 month reward was for the fact that this reward was placed in mind to protect pearls, not some 700+ PH, because think of it this way -- Put something worth 12-20 million credits into a 5 million dollar PH, or "uber" looted one, or, sell your kit to a Jedi and buy 2, 3 even 4 more identical weapons down the road, assuming you're unlucky enough that you got a critical failure while repairing your current weapon (and it's rumoured that the CU will fix the repair mods, and with the emergence of 100% kits, what are the chances that such a weapon *will* break down the road anyway?).


I realize that most of you have lost intrest by this point, so I'll re-itterate my point. This isn't the end of the world! NDK kits affect the top 1% of players on all the servers. Realistically, there is no way to support the idea of putting a 12 million dollar (if you traded for one) NDK into a 5 million dollar weapon - It just makes no fiscal sense! However, if you've spent this equivalent building up your lightsaber with premium pearls, you can safely justify using one.


Thoughts? Flames? Post away, the can of worms has been opened!




You must remember that the SOE auction boards represents only a fraction of players. The ADK market is alive and well in-game. Also, the consider the number of Jedi comapared to the number of Non-Jedi. There are far more fighting non-Jedi out there. I do not agree that these kits are targeted for Jedi. Pearls are not a problem with the big spawns of krayts now occuring. Jedi are talking on my server how they are sitting on quite a nest egg of premium pearls. There are those that have multiple accounts, so a select toon can be outfitted with many of these kits. The rich are buying -snapping them up quickly. Far more than 1% of players WILL be effected by these kits.


Repeat business on elite weapons (money makers such as T-21s) will dry up. Why would a toon settle for anything less than an uber T-21? They can grind away with no fear of decay using the one weapon. This would not bother me as much since the need for multiple weapons is coming, but there are the multiple kit holders. While this may cause a rough time in sales, the impact of the new elite of players owning many kits will become more evident to the game as a whole. Looted weapons already have taken a toll,and those weapons will be very much sought after. Easier to get when you already have an ADK weapon to camp the loot droppers. This causes a bigger disparity between the newer players and poor classes in game play.


I would have not minded these kits if they were a no-drop/no-trade item - especially with the upcoming changes.







Kazara____ Weaponsmith___Master Commando____


"Imperial Gal of Fiery Pwnage"


[KAZ]mart Theed -5171, 3385:::::::::Mission Market Restuss 5444, 6370



Ybagi
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:36 am
#7




Eclipse442 wrote:


NDK kits affect the top 1% of players on all the servers.

And these 1% of players are were the ones that were buying 70% of the enhanced weapons.




Yv
Undead Warrior
Alchemist
Malganis Server
World of Warcraft
ShugFlurry
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:41 am
#8

Ybagi wrote:

Eclipse442 wrote:
NDK kits affect the top 1% of players on all the servers.
And these 1% of players are were the ones that were buying 70% of the enhanced weapons.




If not 90%, and also are the people who have the best looted stuff.



Shug
12pt Master WeaponSmith Master Force Crafter
-843 2827 Dantooine, Mining Outpost
Ybagi
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:48 am
#9
A krayt tissue auction and noone bids, if thats not a sign of how badly the devs screwed this one up I don't know what is



Yv
Undead Warrior
Alchemist
Malganis Server
World of Warcraft
EdOWar
Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:43 am
#10




Ybagi wrote:

A krayt tissue auction and noone bids, if thats not a sign of how badly the devs screwed this one up I don't know what is






Damn, those tissues went for the 750K min each...what a joke. A few weeks ago tissues like that would have gone for millions. The Devs really screwed up with the loot drops, imo. Maybe this, along with the vendor changes, is an attempt by the devs to reduce prices for all goods, maybe in anticipation of the CU (even though it's still months away). Or maybe the Devs just screwed up...


As for ADKs, I'm still not too sure if it will be as Apocalyptic as a lot think. Everyone who sells their ADK no longer has one to use on their weapons. They will also have millions of credits now...maybe for the first time since they played. I think it's likely they'll spend their new found wealth on some really nice weapons, now that they can afford them. Weapons that will decay...because they no longer have an ADK.


I also have to wonder how many of these are going to be used on armor pieces with really nice AAs, instead of weapons. Some of those AAs are far more valuable than even really nice Acklay hammers and Krayt guns.


Making ADKs non-tradable, non-transferable would be a huge mistake, imo. Because then eventually everyone will have an ADK, and if they couldn't trade or sell it then they'd definitely use it.


Slim Vargo, Corbantis

Luzenit
Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:14 am
#11

Making ADKs non-tradable, non-transferable would be a huge mistake, imo. Because then eventually everyone will have an ADK, and if they couldn't trade or sell it then they'd definitely use it.


I disagree.You assume evryone fights. Pure crafters who have no fighting skills may have preferred to select an action figure or a piece of furniture instead as a reward. Even if each toon who had only one ADK, and used it, would not have that much of an impact game wise, especially after the upcoming changes.







Kazara____ Weaponsmith___Master Commando____


"Imperial Gal of Fiery Pwnage"


[KAZ]mart Theed -5171, 3385:::::::::Mission Market Restuss 5444, 6370



SlaserX
Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:51 am
#12

Trean... I agree completely with you. I personally think they should nerf the krayt, make them drop tissues maybe 2% of the time, and the other 80% of the time make it drop pearls. Their value would drop, but it would also start a cycle of money leaving jedis and going to the fighters... either that or the jedis would camp all the krayts 24/7 >_> Oh well.



As for the ADK... I think I've repeated myself enough about this. Tag one of the other 10 threads to see what I have to say about it lol.




Hokage:
The ORIGINAL Wookiee Jedi... ok, so I was the 7th, sue me.
ana-mo-cara
Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:58 am
#13
Its not that krayt tissues shouldnt be rare, but lets be honest its melees wipeing the floor with the krayts. So it makes sense that the devs just said to hell with it and evened the playing field. Especially since odds are they are going to start capping weapons and so on with the CU. Atleast I hope they do. Yes poster your right and beleive it or not I said what you said almost a year ago.


Temp schems the warnings arose becomeing a loot economy folks. Back talk about combat crafter cooperation pushed the naysayers down. The guild pets won round one. Needless to say alot of crafters still seem to think this idea was great. I doubt combat players would have thought it great if they had to buy a temporary move schematic from crafters. Crafters that charged over a million credits just to use a move five times.


The camping begins to happen in earnest. With little to no content what else was left for players to do. The loot economy is born. Where players litterally lived off of looting items for resell.


New dungeons arrise with a high focus on loot. Go to the DWB the corvette the geonosian cave, and then compare with the warren. Notice anything uber loot sells dungeons atleast people camping in dungeons.


Finally the buffs. This all along was a major freaking issue. Players stood up and said look this makes players getting uber loot common place. More common then it should be. People should be fighting nightsisters once a month not twice a day. It should take alot of people to get uber loot not a group of one.


Yes its going to a loot economy, and we have to accept it. Not necassarily because of what the players demanded, but what we sat back and watched happen. The first temp schematic should have been screamed down. We didnt do that we allowed ourselves to be loot mongers just like the combats. Seeing as forking over 5 million to a looter to get a schematic proves how good a weaponsmith you are. Second as the economy spiraled out of control how many stood back and reaped the huge paydays. Guess what thats why credits are near worthless now. Lastly as combat spiraled out of control we did not stand up to add our voice against some things like. Ham irrelevance, speed caps, accuracy caps, melee evasion stacking, and infinite ham regen. These things made our weapons generic. We should have been pushing for these fixes, but instead we were lazy. Well lazy players do not get what they want. The viscious rabid angry players do.


P.S I got three antidecay kits already.


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