Tailor Archive

OK, I'm starting to prepare on the assumption, or at least the hope, that when the next "publish" (Big Patch) goes live, presumably next week, that (a) tissue-enhanced cloth will work, and (b) the tissues will be able to be made in factories. So I started to prepare an order for my favorite Bio Engineer. And then I got to the question, "How are you set for ingredients?"

She said she'd get back to me because she was logging off, so I went and looked a few of them up. Oh, my Ghod. We are so screwed. Well, no, we're not, this is exactly what we've asked for. But oh, my Ghod. Here are a few samples. And remember, this is per panel, not per outfit:

• Tensile Resistance (SC, defense v. melee+stun): 20 Creature Food, 10 Flower Fruit, 25 Bone, 25 Hide


• Active Biosensors (SC, medical): 20 Creature Food, 25 Flora Structural, 25 Insect Meat, 10 Wild Meat


• Myoflex (SC, ent. heal): 20 Creature Food, 10 Flower Fruit, 25 Bone, 25 Hide


• Scent Camouflage (RFP, +maskscent): 20 Creature Food, 20 Floral Structural, 25 Flower Fruit


• Constrictor Cloth (RFP, defense v. bleed): 15 Creature Food, 15 Creature Resource, 20 Flora Resource

Note that unlike what we've been used to, quality matters now. In addition to the BE's skill, the bonuses on these are dependent33% each on Overall Quality, Flavor, and Potential Energy of the ingredients.

Why do I say that we're screwed? Because the market supply of meat and hides is already desperate. High quality hides sell for 10 to 20 credits per hide; so do high quality meats. That's when they're available at all; some Bazaars haven't seen more than tiny scraps of hide in weeks. And on top of that, we're suddenly going to need a whole heck of a lot of bone, which nobody much harvests. And on top of that, we're going to be competing with Doctors and Combat Medics for the meat, as they need the exact same qualities we do.

The resource requirements on these chemicals total up to between 50 and 80 per cloth panel, all of them ones that quality matters on, and many of them already in short supply. I don't see any way that price can come down to below 500 to 800 per panel on these, and it could easily end up being double that.

Want a maxed out Spec Ops Duster with Scent Camouflage and Tensile Resistance? That's 210 more resources, scarce and/or high quality resouces, plus factory surcharge on two of the three panels, on top of whatever you're used to paying for a Spec Ops Duster now. I'd figure that it would have to add at least 2500 credits to the price of a 2000 credit item, just to cover cost of materials. If the BE and the Tailor can't get sweetheart deals on the animal resources, a price of 7000 for that duster is probably not out of line.

How about something totally ridiculous, a Revealing Fleshwrap with Myoflex? That's 5 factory-made cans of Myolfex at 80 units per - so add about 4500 to 5000 credits to whatever you're used to paying now. And that's a minimum. Can you imagine paying 15,000 credits for a Revealing Fleshwrap? It could come to that.

Of course, presumably the high initial demand will drive prices even higher, first on end products, and thereby on raw materials. You thought hides and meatwere scarce and expensivelast week? Wait until week after next.

It'll be interesting to see if customers will pay these rates, won't it? These are sneaking up on armor prices- and maybe then some.

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BradBradley wrote:

Note that unlike what we've been used to, quality matters now. In addition to the BE's skill, the bonuses on these are dependent33% each on Overall Quality, Flavor, and Potential Energy of the ingredients.

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Actually - unless they've changed it on test - that's not exactly correct. The different receipes have different weights - boy, do I wish they were all the same.

Presuming they haven't been changed.

Medic bonus is 53% Flavor 33% Decay Resist 166% Overall quality 63% Potential Energy 83% Unit toughness (totals added)

Scout and Bleed ARE 33% across the board

Sniper is 66% Flavor 33% Decay 99% OQ 66% PE 99% UT (totals added)

Melee/stun, Brawler and Entertainer are 66% Flavor 33% decay, 99% OQ 66% PE and 33% UT (totals added)

Creature Handler - not sure - didn't make notes on that one - no milk.

I've done up an excel spreadsheet where I can list all my applicable ingredients and put the weighted values in as multipers on the various columns.

A resource that's good for one type may or may not be good for all of them - just depends on how the value's fall.

If they've simplified it on test please let us know. I wouldn't be adverse at all to less time staring at a spreadsheet.

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BradBradley wrote:

Want a maxed out Spec Ops Duster with Scent Camouflage and Tensile Resistance? That's 210 more resources, scarce and/or high quality resouces, plus factory surcharge on two of the three panels, on top of whatever you're used to paying for a Spec Ops Duster now. I'd figure that it would have to add at least 2500 credits to the price of a 2000 credit item, just to cover cost of materials. If the BE and the Tailor can't get sweetheart deals on the animal resources, a price of 7000 for that duster is probably not out of line.

How about something totally ridiculous, a Revealing Fleshwrap with Myoflex? That's 5 factory-made cans of Myolfex at 80 units per - so add about 4500 to 5000 credits to whatever you're used to paying now. And that's a minimum. Can you imagine paying 15,000 credits for a Revealing Fleshwrap? It could come to that.

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I was charging 25k for maxed items (25 bonus) and wasn't able to keep things in stock. I had MANY people tell me that price was to low, and they are probably right - but we weren't real sure if any of it even worked for the longest time - or when exactly it would.

My prices for these items would be.....

Drumroll please

Spec-ops

Probably only going to be able to get oh - 28 total synth cloth points into this one piece item - (14/14 it's a double buff)

Takes 2 reinforced cloth so good guess on that depending on the bonus - let's say bleed for example another 28 pts. - but 25 is the cap(13 a sheet - presuming they get the identical stacking working)

Presuming 4 sockets

Final total would be 28.1k

Revealing Fleshwrap is a bad example - that one will take NO bio bonuses - ever, no cloth used.

Now, maybe it's me, but I don't think this is an unreasonable price for something that gives 53 bonus points of skill in one item AND still has 4 open sockets to add even more skill to thru dropped skill enchancers.

Given in many instances I'm likely eating the cost of a sheet here and there bumping into the full cap, and figuring in some buffer for failures (you haven't lived till you've burned up components THIS costly - a new experience for most tailors) I think this is quite a reasonable figure and very very close to my original charge of a flat 25k for any perfect piece - matter of fact it's cheaper - since we've never been able to mix bonuses before and this one would qualify as a double.

Tailors that have never worked with this need to just take a deep breath and actually look at the value of what they are producing, and yes, the component cost is high - not to mention the fiddle factor.

Brad,

First off, the availability of creature resources, at least on my server, is not near as bleak as you make out. I've been hoarding high quality stuff for weeks now, and been either getting it myself (all be's have at least hunting 4 don't forget) or buying it between 3cr-7c4/ea. Even so, I doubt any BE's would sell you a good cloth for under 1k/ea. If you can find one that will, cling to him/her like glue. Personally, as a BE, I think more like 1k-1.5k/tissue is more reasonable. You as a tailor don't sell at market cost of materials do you? I sure hope not anyway.

Second, even if say a tailor were to price BE enhanced clothing at say price of clothing + 2k/cloth (assuming the cloth is of high quality and gives a very substantial bonus) I don't think cost would be prohibitive at all for customers, that's my sense. Have you seen what skill tape enhancers fetch? I've seen them sell for like 10k for a +3 one. Also money is so easy to get in this game, and for the first time these clothing items are going to actually enhance a person's ability to make future earnings AND look good at the same time (assuming they are dealing with a decent tailor). So 10k for a duster? lol, that's an absolutesteal imho if it has substantial skill enhancement in it. 15k for a fleshwrap? Another bargain. Some sell for that much now without any enhancements at all.

Every custom order I've had in the past week I've mentioned to customers I'll be offering BE enhanced clothing when the next patch comes out. The reaction has been amazing. 100% of them have indicated that they'll be buying a new outfit, and not a single one of them has even asked about price. That ought to tell you something right there.

Wire,

Hehe, charging people 25k for clothing that does nothing up until now, and then charging them 28k for a duster after the patch? well, all I can say is we tailors love ya. Would you ever consider making a character on Bria? lol

Also, from what I've heard from people looking at it on TC, and the comments of the BE developer, tissue bonuses don't stack, so you're unlikely to get much above +10 in any single piece of clothing irregardless of how many piece of cloth or RFP it has. Three +5 tissues = +5, not +15, and nobody really knows how these bonuses will interact with socketed bonuses in the same piece of clothing. A lot of people contend right now that socketed bonuses are broken even before the BE ones are introduced, so presuming they'll work well in conjunction with one another is a huge assumption indeed. But hey, you got people to pay 25k when they didn't even work at all, so all things are possible.

For quite some time we didn't KNOW they didn't work.

And I STILL have people that will swear on a stack of bibles it does and did.

The only thing we knew for certain - medical use never let you use higher meds - the rest, well....

I've heard that they won't stack, and in the same place that it will be possible to add them up to get 25 lol.

Honestly I don't know what to think, but I bet anything that people *will* pay 25 or 30k for them, no doubt.

Well different instances stack - the same instance should.

I'm gonna call that a bug unless and untill a dev has the nerve to tell us "Why yes, you did put the value of 6 in there and only got one back out".

From what I've read - and the way it's worked - I'd say it's suppose to. Would also make ALL the tissues valuable, and all levels of BE viable instead of only masters and topend stuff. That was also one of the stated goals for crafters back in beta - all levels should have viable (read sellable) items.

Since there is a cap - I don't see a single reason why they shouldn't.

Anyone on test might want to keep pluggin at that and bugging them if it's not fixed before it slips live that way. Factories working is great - but it's going to make a difficult situation even more messy if it gets that way to live.

WHOOT! This thread got me to thinking - hmmm, maybe I better recheck things.

Indeed - MOST of them have been changed to 33/33/33 - this drops Unit Toughness from most and Decay Resist from all - this is VERY good and will make planning for supplies a ton easier.

It would appear Medic - Active/Passive biosensors are still different, but even that one changed a bit - getting rid of decay resist as a weight and readjusting the others by a bit.

Looks like I need to go change my spreadsheets now, but this should be MUCH simpler to keep up with.

Alrighty - since I had to change my spreadsheets anyway - I added them to the site

http://www.swgbio.com/biorecipes.htmis the tissue recipes and weighted values

The other link will launch excel if you have it - or you can just download the file to yourself local to plug in resources onhand for relative values.