Tailor Archive
Thread: Brainstorm Workarounds for Vendor Limits?
It's fairly obvious an item limit to vendors will be imposed. How much, we don't know yet, but instead of merely reacting negatively to a runaway train we have no hopes of stopping, I suggest we be pro-active and start coming up with ideas to work within the new, impending limitations.
Players have developed ways around the 10 lots limit, the house item storage limits, the personal inventory limits... let's see if we can brainstorm ways around vendor limits.
With Master Merchant I will have 6 vendors available to me. I already have my merchandise separated between a General merchandise vendor and a Wookiee Only Vendor. I have two locations: a main shop with 2 vendors and 2 vendors in our sister city mall. This leaves me 2 vendors to "play with." My general vendors normally carry approximately 1000 items, when I've had time to keep them fully stocked. The Wookiee vendors carry about 300+ items. I could use my remaining 2 vendors to further categorize my general merchandise. My dilemma is: divide my stock into what categories?
Male/Female? Too many items are suitable for both genders. Duplication of clothing types defeats the purpose of working around the vendor limits.
Combat/Entertainer? Same issue. Who's to say who will wear what for any activity? (How many times have you seen a female brandishing an LLC, equipped with a few pieces of armor over a Fleshwrap?)
Cool in Black. Well, one could just take the Best Seller's list, factory run a few crates of each item in black and keep that vendor stocked to max easily enough. (Knowing the best selling colors are all black, black/red, black/white)
Specialization vendors. Now I had thought of doing this before. Qitu's Shoe Store. Qitu's Accessories (gloves, shoes, belts, hats, packs) Qitu's Dress Shoppe. Something like that might actually work better if a few tailors went into a large partnership and each one was responsible for a different vendor. (Of course, allowing for each Tailor to do custom orders of any and all clothing as well, and to operate any extra vendors with all variety stock)
Anyone else have some brainstorms?
The first thing I did is logically try to break my inventory into 100-150 item chunks (I will probably have 4-5 vendors for clothing when I'm done with restructuring, depending on what the item limits are.) Then it would be 1 vendor for shirts, 1 for gloves, shoes, and jewelry, 1 for jackets and skirts, 1 for dresses and robes, 1 for pants blah blah. But that's not really "fun" and it doesn't solve the "wade down 2 pages" issue which is apparently a serious problem (sarcasm). However, I think it's the most viable option because customers are so used to the categories at this point, and are not used to other classification systems, as detailed below.
Then I thought of dividing by casual wear/formal wear/etc... But I would have to recategorize just about everything. Lined shorts are not formal, they're like pantaloons, only tighter. Also mixing and matching happens too often, and footwear is a pretty neutral category with the sameboots being worn for casual formal and field wear. Maybe a separate vendor for dancerwear? I just don't think that customers would say "I'm looking for a smock, so it must be in... err..."
Wookiee wear is a big problem for me, because while I would like to dedicate an entire vendor to it, I don't want to waste a vendor slot for a group where I won't even come close to the cap. Even if wookiee clothes do sell like candy.
What I've decided that I'm NOT doing is naming my vendors according to what's on them. God forbid I decide to reorganize and have to rip the stupid things up (and put my items... where temporarily?). I've decided to name the vendors Zeus, Apollo, Ares, Hera, Athena, Aphrodite (poor Artemis &Hermes, didn't make the cut). Then I can just put a backpack next to each indicating what it sells (i.e. Shirts ----> ) No muss, no fuss.
I'll have mine split among 4 vendors for the regular clothing... skirts, dresses and robes on 1, pants, jackets, vests on 1, shoes, gloves, and hats on 1, Necklaces and braclets and packs on 1. The other 2 vendors i have set up willstay how they are now, one is for Pre-ordered Guild Uniforms, and one that is strictly for customer orders, so i dont have to be at the shop when they come to get the items.
Master Artisan/MasterTailor / Master Merchant
I usually have two vendors - one named "Fine Attire by Ri'a" that is registered on the world map. The second is ladies wear, which isn't registered. The only things that go on the ladies vendor are items that only can be worn by women, or would appeal to women only. I do stock some dresses and skirts on the main vendor, but they are doctor's dresses and skirts that the men would wear. I also think separating those out from the ladies wear vendor helps guys not feel "wonky" about buying them. 
On the women's vendor I do stock some pants (camos, striped slacks) but in the more feminine colors.
When I stock bio-engineered clothing, I have a separate vendor for that. I actually just put one back up the other day, and also included some BE house pets. I used to have a special order pickup vendor, but I took that down so I'd be able to have a food/drink vendor. It didn't get used that often anyhow - I figure I can put special orders on the BE vendor in backpacks or something.
Even if they dropped the vendor limit to 150 I doubt I'd break the clothes down any further. I personally would find it annoying to have fourvendors just to split up my existing stock levels. I'd probably either drop my vendors altogether, or just stock 150 items on 2 vendors.
Ri'a
I have two master merchant chars, but I only use 6 vendors at the moment (lending the use of the second one to a friend). Built up a second because I felt I needed more vendors. I tend to break tailor items by item type (pants, shirts, coats, etc.) largely to spread them out due to the apparenttransparency of that little next button (something they could fix rather than use it as an excuse to slap a 150 item limit).
I have somehow kept going thru all the bugs since the server was opened (tho I did just come out of a two monthcrafting hiatusto focus on other chars and our city). So if they do implement a 150 limit, I will likely just stick it out for now and put up more vendors to break out the item types further to keep them under 150.
If that proves to be not worth the effort involved.... another option for me is toclose up shop and run missions more often with my combat/doc alts. Speaking from a business view, that hasmuchhigher ROI anyway. /shrug Many crafters in my guild have already closed up their shops and followed this route already.
But Ienjoy crafting and merchantingtho and I want to see it improve and become efficient. And I like the uniqueness tailoring offers also.
I only have one store - but it does have 6 vendors. My 'main' clothing vendor carries everything except accessories and wookiee wear. The Rodian carries all the accessories, belts, hats, shoes, boots, backpacks, jewelry belts, bandoliers. I have one vendor devoted to crated components - cloth, tailoring accessories, a few scout/artisan type items in crates, fireworks. One vendor carries decor type item, tools and odds and ends - one carries nothing but wookiee wear and one handles all my pets/petfood/pet meds.
This system has worked fairly well for me - and once folks realize which vendor they need to visit - seems to work fairly well for them too. Most of them usually carry between 250-500 items at any given time, not sure what I'll do if the item limits for master fall below those levels.
The wookiee wear vendor has by far the least amount of stock. IF they ever get the wookiee garb category working - I could bring that one downstairs - mix wookie clothing in with other clothing and perhaps split the clothing up among two vendors.
My guild has specific mall locations where only guild crafters may put their vendors. And these locations are the only places they are allowed to put vendors.
Myworst headache in managingthis is crafter turnaround due to the merchant and crafter bugs, inefficiencies, etc. etc. The eternal problem ofholes to fill up.I see the same turnaround applying to merchants, at least until 1. the vendor interface is overhauled for efficiency, and 2. inventory and expense/income reporting is added. And actually, based on my experience as both a crafter and a merchant, I think merchants will be even more likely to burn out than crafters.
My concern - in my particularsituation -is if i recruit a merchant or two(will be lucky to find one in the beginning) to handle my crafter's vendors atone location, and that merchant burns out or catches the holo-bug and quits. One of my mall operations will completely fall apart or at least a bigger hole will need to be filled until I can find another merchant.
A cooperative idea like above tho will work much better with a looser affiliation of crafters-merchants.The structure I work in ismay be toorigid. I would say it would need to be flexible with multiple merchants that would be willing to fill in if one left. Would let the cooperative operate at any lvl or depth they need to, rather than across the board of crafters like I would probably have to. But then, I am thinking most merchants would be more inclined to handle multiple crafter classesin mall style setups.
Interesting. No two alike. I like that. What do y'all think the 150 limit will do to our individuality of merchanting styles? I hear the toll of the mediocre and conformity bells ringing in my ears. Blech. Did we choose elite professions with the idea of merging into an amalgam of sameness? No. When you go to a mall now, do you expect to see an array of pure merchant vendors, each one stocked with all the same things listed on the bazaar, but all higher level items and higher prices, that they bought wholesale from crafter-suppliers? No. You expect to see an array of crafter's vendors that make it easier to find what you are looking for, and only what your are looking for, without having to "dig through" the thousands of items listed on the bazaar (in their dubiously sorted versions). Even the pure merchants, for the most part, specialize to a degree. Most all vendors in operation now are specialty vendors. Is that what TH meant by "monopolies?" /sigh
The limit will force pure merchants to be choosier about how many varieties of goods they will sell when they are constrained under a 150 limit per vendor. It will force the small-time crafter/merchant who wishes to expand their sales into other locations to seek out a pure merchant who might be willing to contract with the crafter to supply a small but regular amount of goods; effectively creating a mini-bazaar out of pure merchant vendors. I foresee many, many crafters dropping merchant altogether and going to bazaar sales, custom order only, and/or back to barking at the banks and starports.
Putting on the other guy's shoes, I think this is the way the designers intended the merchant class to be played all along. Retailers. Resellers. Buy in bulk, buy low, limit availability, sell high. Interdependence. Going with that premise, it also follows that the apprenticeship system would work better if elite masters actually apprenticed! The vendor limit would make this a viable and desirable arrangement for all involved. Partnerships. They removed schematic revocation in beta because everyone hated it, but it seems to me they may have found a way to still make interdependence the best way to function and operate a business.
Partner up with other masters of your profession. Include a few merchants. Set up a partnership shop in one or several locations.Decide who makes what items and is responsible for keeping that vendorwell stocked. "Employ" apprentices to make the lower level items, components, etc., leaving you more time to make master items, run factories, and so on.In return, your apprentices receive free training, a steady income and a place to "work" that they might not otherwise be able to afford the upkeep on, nor the skill points for the vendors. Your partners free up more time to do custom orders or to just go wayfaring and the pure merchants benefit by having a steady supply of goods to sell without having to scour the galaxy wide on bazaars and vendors and the odd bulk seller for his merchandise.
We've suggested how we might workaround this limit, but all the ideas are unique to each person's situations and needs. There isn't a blanket fix for this. Tailors will be hardest hit, this is true, but since our goods have no stats (at this time, other than BE clothes) we also have no competition amongst ourselves other than level of skill, price, location, and customer service styles. Customers know one master tailor's clotheswill be the same as any other's. Where we differ is on pricing and personalities. Partnerships, I think, might be one way, not the only way or the best way, but one way to live within this limit about to fall on our heads.
I've only just started thinking along these lines so I have not worked out any implications or details, but I intend to mull it over a while longer and see if I or anyone else can punch huge holes into the suggestion.
My business situation now is in a player city/guild. There is one other master tailor and her shop is within line of sight of mine, in the business district by our shuttleport. Our guild has a policy of matched pricing so no one undercuts their neighbor and guildmates. But we each already have business partners, and vendors for their goods. We each have conflicting styles of doing business as well.
But I wonder if tailors can create a workable partnership? Our line of merchandise is so huge, so dependent upon creativity, tastes, customer desires and how to display all that we can make, that I don't know if two or more tailorsin one shop is a good solution or not.
Sorry for the long rambling post. I think better if I type while I think. I've come a long way since my yellow legal pad and pencil days where I used to do my best thinking. I guess the cut to the chase of all this is:
Would Tailor-Merchant partnerships be a viable workaround for the vendor limits?
If I could add my business partners to admin on "our" vendors, so we could all stock and price our own goods, and if I could easily set a designated % of credits owedto a partner from all sales from those vendors or some way to direct payment to the person who listed the item, then I'd feel my vendors were truly efficient. Except for the item cap that will dreadfully impact my tailor business' ability to list my wares toa useful potential.
As it is now, if I utilize a partnership arrangement,I am the only one who can add stock to the vendor, pay it's maintenance, relist from the stockroom; and I am required to keep scads of notes on who gave me what, how much, what price, track sales,make payments, deducting my expenses off the top... yada yada, yuck!
I'm a trustworthy person, but Average JoeSkywalkerdude doesn't know that. Takes a lotta trust to hand over all your goods to a merchant, since only the merchant holds the "keys" to the cash cow? Turnover, players abruptly quitting the game with no notice, bugged vendors eating all mechandise, etc., you and the crafters take big hits you don't even see coming.
Myself, I have two family members and a many years' long-time friend as my business partners, so trust is not an issue. (Master Tailor, Merchant, Artisan, a Master ID, BE, a Master Musician, Smuggler, and a TKA to bring in the odd loot and cash flow.) This is not the case for 99% of the merchants out there. Reputation is all they have.
And with all these holo-grinding merchants out there slapping down a row of smalls with access fees and a vendor in one of them and house signs broadcasting "Please help me! Holo Merchant! Needs XP! Come inside!" (Truly, there's one like that right outside our city limits. /rolleyes) and registered on the planetary map so that customers are constantly arriving to find empty, pointless xp grubbing vendors -- it's hurting all merchants, pure and otherwise. They are tired of it. This is one reason why they are backing the bazaar cap being raised. Gee, you think the holo-grinding idea was a fiasco or what?
So if I go into partnership with another tailor, that hands over a lot of trust to someone who might leave me with the bulk of the work. Work. Umm, I am here to play, not work. Let's say we each have 4 vendors to use and we agree to a system of who stocks what items, etc. Only I keep my vendors full at 150 cap (or whatever it turns out to be), and he/she lets their vendors sit empty over 50% of the time -- this doesn't help me at all; this hurts me worse than staying solo and having to list a broader variety in less colors or vice versa.
Or there's another situation I know of in a mall: the mall owner had a crafter place two vendors in his mall ( a guild hall), in a very prime location in the main room. She then went on a months long hiatus from the game, with no prior notice to him that she was going to do this. So now he is stuck with two empty vendors in a sweet spot that no one else can use and he cannot remove. Sucks, that does.
Oh well. I hope the devs enjoy the backlash ruckus I think this vendor limit and raised bazaar cap will cause when merchats drop off the maps in droves and crafters simply give up and join the GCW and John Q. Consumer wails about not being able to find what he wants to buy unless he slogs through the thousands oflistings on the bazaar. Oh, and wonders why the ore he bought last week at 1000 units for 3000 cr is now 6000 cr. (like... duh!?)
I'm all for them making merchant more of a stand alone profession, and loaded with special skills that make it worth all those skill points, but I deplore what the vendor limit and bazaar cap will do to tailors, and armor and weaponsmiths, but tailors most of all. They really couldn't have designed a more devestating blow to Tailors than this. Not even the poorly implemented 1-5% decay issue hit us THIS hard. (Oh, and did you see where they are changing/getting rid of the 1% decay thing? Hmmm. Whine long, whine loud...)