Tailor Archive
Thread: Armor Alternatives
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BrekCoronus
Sat Jul 24, 2004 7:23 am
#1
OK, first off, I'm not a tailor, I'm a smuggler. I dump a load of credits on tailored goods every few weeks, but I only get the stuff shot up, I don't make it. After all, I need to look my best while running from CorSec.
What bugs me to no end is that heavy composite armor is pretty much the norm in SWG. It's just not "Star Wars," if you get my meaning. Sure, you get the burly types who can't dodge out of the way of an incoming durni, but those are the type of people that armor was made for; it helps the people who can stand there and take a hit to do so even better. Frankly, armor should reduce the chance for someone to dodge. It's bulky, uncomfortable, and restricts vision as well as movement. However, it's not likely that will ever come to pass as it would alter the game too much.
So, why blather about this on the Tailor forums? Have I been dipping into my own spice supplyagain? No, nothing like that. What I, as a player, would love to see are bio-engineered Dodge and other defense bonuses on jackets and pants. You know, those items of clothing that armored folks can't wear. I don't care if they cost over 100 kilocreds per garment, I'd pay for them. Makethe clothesdecay like armor in combat, I don't care. I am just getting desperate for an alternative to stomping around in 50 kilos of steel and ballistic cloth.
Anyway, that's a few comments from the peanut gallery. Make of them what you will.
BrekCoronus
Mon Sep 13, 2004 7:23 am
#2
OK, first off, I'm not a tailor, I'm a smuggler. I dump a load of credits on tailored goods every few weeks, but I only get the stuff shot up, I don't make it. After all, I need to look my best while running from CorSec.
What bugs me to no end is that heavy composite armor is pretty much the norm in SWG. It's just not "Star Wars," if you get my meaning. Sure, you get the burly types who can't dodge out of the way of an incoming durni, but those are the type of people that armor was made for; it helps the people who can stand there and take a hit to do so even better. Frankly, armor should reduce the chance for someone to dodge. It's bulky, uncomfortable, and restricts vision as well as movement. However, it's not likely that will ever come to pass as it would alter the game too much.
So, why blather about this on the Tailor forums? Have I been dipping into my own spice supplyagain? No, nothing like that. What I, as a player, would love to see are bio-engineered Dodge and other defense bonuses on jackets and pants. You know, those items of clothing that armored folks can't wear. I don't care if they cost over 100 kilocreds per garment, I'd pay for them. Makethe clothesdecay like armor in combat, I don't care. I am just getting desperate for an alternative to stomping around in 50 kilos of steel and ballistic cloth.
Anyway, that's a few comments from the peanut gallery. Make of them what you will.
ASrai
Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:41 pm
#3
Preaching to the choir my friend 
I think more than a few of us has voiced your concerns over and over again, but to deaf ears it seems. I just hope with the combat rebalance, that armor will be made a less enticing (sp?) alternative.
Dayre
Mon Sep 13, 2004 6:39 pm
#4
Yup, yup... I'd love to be able to make clothing that had even a random effect.
/shrug...
Oh well.
/shrug...
Oh well.
RandDarkstar
Tue Sep 14, 2004 4:42 am
#5
The biggest problem with this idea is that we are tailors, not armoursmiths. We start asking for clothing that competes with them, and we are looking at a big fight or at least alot of tension between the two professions. What we would like is an alternative to everyone wearing composite. If you choose to wear armour, then you might get hit more often, and take FAR less damage. Wear clothes, and the teras kasi masters can spin like monkeys all day and not fear slowing down, but if they take a shot, they are going to FEEL it.
Armour was ultimately designed for one purpose, to absorb the shock of the opponents' weapons. It was not to avoid the blow itself. Armour lacks mobility, but makes up for it in pure absorbtion. Having clothes that allow SMALL benefits to mobility and dodge might be a good idea, though in that sense, armour should restrict mobility. Clothes really should NOT make you more mobile. You're already as good as it gets.
When the combat revamp takes place, we can have a look at the new system, but any thoughts on it currently are just going to be wasted if the new system already takes these into account. We might make the suggestions to the devs through the suggestion forms, and hope that they implement things in a manner that everyone is going to enjoy.
I would prefer to see the different varieties of armour all to offer the best against one form of attack, or at least allow them to be similar at master armoursmith, that it's not so much One Armour to Rule Them All, as much as a master armoursmith could make any type as good as composite by making the underlying system of the armour the same for each.
That could be a headache if you had to carry around 4 or 5 suits of armour depending on what you met up with, so the advanced composite being the very best, will still be preferable to everyone, but how about penalties to wearing a military-grade suit of armour through a city street? How often do you see tanks roll up to the McDonald's drive through?
Dayre
Tue Sep 14, 2004 10:58 am
#6
I totally agree with all of the points you just made. And I am not an advocate of competeing with the armorsmiths.
However, what I am in favor of and propose is a small ammount of defense based on the composition of the clothing. Firstly, NO ARMOR RATING!, they are clothes so let us forget that alltogether. Rather, I'd like to see a small ammount of resistance based on the type of clothing or the components used in crafting it... all things within reason.
For example, the reinforced clothing. It's reinforced, so possibly you could get a maximum of 10% kinetic resist, not stackable with armor, more of a traveling gear when the voritors decide to take a shot at you. Or, if an item requires a large ammount of metal, perhaps it can act as a ground and offer a maximum of 10% resist to either energy or electrical damage. Because of the harsh enviornments of sapce, and different planet's atmosphere's flightsuits be nominally resistant to things like stun, acid, heat or cold. Not all, but perhaps 1 or 2, again capped at 10%.
I realize this wish is unrealistic and that the combat aspect of the game is going to change with the CB, as well as have a big effect on crafters. I just wanted to clarify my position.
However, what I am in favor of and propose is a small ammount of defense based on the composition of the clothing. Firstly, NO ARMOR RATING!, they are clothes so let us forget that alltogether. Rather, I'd like to see a small ammount of resistance based on the type of clothing or the components used in crafting it... all things within reason.
For example, the reinforced clothing. It's reinforced, so possibly you could get a maximum of 10% kinetic resist, not stackable with armor, more of a traveling gear when the voritors decide to take a shot at you. Or, if an item requires a large ammount of metal, perhaps it can act as a ground and offer a maximum of 10% resist to either energy or electrical damage. Because of the harsh enviornments of sapce, and different planet's atmosphere's flightsuits be nominally resistant to things like stun, acid, heat or cold. Not all, but perhaps 1 or 2, again capped at 10%.
I realize this wish is unrealistic and that the combat aspect of the game is going to change with the CB, as well as have a big effect on crafters. I just wanted to clarify my position.
Message Edited by Dayre on 09-14-2004 11:00 AM
Robes268
Tue Sep 14, 2004 2:56 pm
#7
i like that idea but one thing.
as an armorsmith, i oviously make armor, im almost techniques 3 and i make about a max of 13% base mabari.
first off, think about bone, it has low resestences when you startmaking itand it has only energy and one more resitence. with engineering 4, you can make up to a low amount of energy. if clothing has reseitences, then they would have to be low, i mean really low, like around 1 to 5%. but with it being low, it wouldnt really need weight (encumberance).
ok this is what might happen:letsjust say someone is wearingt isclothing BE and about 10 to 15% resitence. they are aTKM and Master Fencer wear no armor. so they gain stats quick when hit, already have a good defence, and can wear about their whole body ineither def vs stun,melee def and bleeding def. so they can almost not be hit and dont lose statsquickbut as someone before me said, they FEEL big hits.
my point is thatwearing clothingwithBE andsome badrestence is not technically clothing, its armor since armor is anything that protects the wearer from harm. but basicly its clothing.
the only wayfair waythis could happen would be if armorsmiths made a component for it. since we rely on tailors this might be a good idea.remember its still LOW resistence so a master armorsmith could make about 20% maybe.plus it would only be on kinetic and energymaybe electric (clothing without metal doesnt conduct electricity)
and........if anyone posts that clothing should be high, like 50%because they are a tailor and need moneythen they should relize thatis the point of an armorsmith, so get it if you cant make money (which i highly doubt) 
now with the penaltys with armor...
good idea, but it already has less mobility...encumberance... but with maybe some terain movement negitive 5 or so. but with the dodging thing, i guess so. it does make sence, but we kinda have a GREAT burden already
theadvantage with clothing...
clothing doesnt need any defences from weapons, however a dodge might be good, but again armorsmiths might be involved. and i just want something i can craft with, but still get from place to place on corellia without geting dealt 200 damage from a razor cat. there should be more BE enhancements though, even something like a master would be able to make a defence from ranged thing, but they couldnt make resistences.
P.S. I'm seeing this more and more and people still dont understand that defence in this game icreases your chanceto not get hit! not you get hit for less damage from that weapon
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