Tailor Archive
Thread: Tailor Nerf? Colorization for all?
AnitaSWG wrote:Why not just make color samples out of soft undershirts? I can't possibly imagine going through that much synth making clothes that a customer won't buy because the color isn't quite right. Even my worst experience with a color picky customer left me with 2 or 3 tan spec ops dusters that eventually sold off my vendor. And after dealing with him for more than an hour, when he said he wanted to choose some camos next I told him I was out of materials and would have to do it another time (plus I was late for a RP event).Please tell me this isn't something being considered seriously for tailors (since we now have two correspondents who support the idea)?
Ri'a
Soft undershirts may not be the right choice. At least for some colors they turn out a shade darker than other clothes. If there is anything that always makes me wince, it is when someone in a white outfit says to me, "Can you make me a white soft undershirt?"
AnitaSWG wrote:Well considering that the current decay system is useless (BE clothes still work at -500 condition) I doubt that they could come up with anything better for a dye system.
The day some other tailor can recolor something I made is the day I quit tailoring. It's that simple.
Ri'a
You have a good point. What I was originally thinking is that a tailor could recolor an item for an hour or so after it was made without decay and then after that it would decay some significant amount (10-15%) every time it was recolored after that. Unfortunately considering their track record at making clothes decay so far (after all, it isn't armor or weapons so it isn't very important) it would probably end up being a complete disaster.
Gyopi wrote:
Soft undershirts may not be the right choice. At least for some colors they turn out a shade darker than other clothes. If there is anything that always makes me wince, it is when someone in a white outfit says to me, "Can you make me a white soft undershirt?"
Well, they've worked for me the few times I needed them to. I have quite a few items on display in my shop, and can usually point a customer to a particular color. I guess I just can't imagine going through 150 pieces of synth making stuff that no one else will buy, just to satisfy one extremely picky customer. At some point I'd just have to draw the line and tell the customer that I wasn't going to remake the items yet again.
Maybe people need to reconsider the way they approach colors with customers? I can't imagine a customer telling me they want blue pants, and I just start churning pants out in every shade of blue until they find one they like. That *would* be a huge waste of time and resources. Instead I ask them if they want a dark blue or light blue.. dark blue? okay how about this color over here -navy? no? well how about royal? That's close but you want a little lighter - okay well let me make you a sample. This is perfect? Great, let me make those pants now. No muss, no fuss.
Maybe I'm missing something here.. or all the really color picky customers go to other tailors.
Ri'a
AnitaSWG wrote:
Why not just make color samples out of soft undershirts? I can't possibly imagine going through that much synth making clothes that a customer won't buy because the color isn't quite right. Even my worst experience with a color picky customer left me with 2 or 3 tan spec ops dusters that eventually sold off my vendor. And after dealing with him for more than an hour, when he said he wanted to choose some camos next I told him I was out of materials and would have to do it another time (plus I was late for a RP event).
Please tell me this isn't something being considered seriously for tailors (since we now have two correspondents who support the idea)?
Ri'a
This is depending on weather or not I want to clutter my house with hmm... 200+ shirts?
Sorry, but no. I don't have the lots nor the time to do that. On top of that various clothing takes colors differently. Add to that the other color plalets I'd need to place out. Its too much 'work'. 
I shouldn't have to do that, waste lot space waste inventory space and waste housing space to pull that off.
As for weather its being seriously considered or not. There are always new ideas presented. But nothing goes forward without testing the waters. Frankly I think this is a great idea to explore.
Message Edited by Vandessa on 01-16-2004 11:44 AM
Vandessa wrote:Message Edited by Vandessa on 01-16-2004 11:44 AM
I wish I had an edit button.
Part of the reason people come to me is because I have an eye for color and can usually get what they want the first try. I'd hate to see that circumvented, personally--as it is, it's one of the things that distinguishes tailors one from another.
/hit nail on the head
Hear! Hear! Exactly! Eye for color! We don't have working decay, we don't have any kind of stats except on BE clothes and still, even then on the BE clothes, what distinguishes them one from the other besides the bonus is the style and color of the clothing it is put into! But our eye for color, in creating our own combinations or matching to other's, that is one of our best ways to stand out in customer service from tailor to tailor.
I was restocking a vendor in the mall just yesterday when a Master Doctor came up to me and asked if I could make him a few shirts to match some pants he already had. And shoes. He told me he'd been to a few tailors already who said they would not match to something they didn't make. I'm like, "Huh???" (I did briefly consider maybe the guy had a bad rep with tailors and he was getting the brush off?) I asked him to give me his pants so I could match to them easier. When I saw the pants, 4 pair of camos, I blanched a bit . Whoa. Rainbow of colors.
Then he complimented me effusively for having the first tailor vendor he'd seen on the server with more than 20 items in stock. He could not believe there was 700+ items on the one vendor. Said he was in shopping heaven. (I checked my vendor mails. Yeppers. His name was on a lot of 'em.) And he did not want anything with black in it! Wow. Won me over right there. While I crafted a muscle shirt, searching for the right shades of tan and olive to match one pair of his pants, we discussed the deplorable state of empty vendors and holo chasers.
I finally got the elusive shade of tan to match and then made him two pair of two tone casual shoes (alternating the top and bottom colors) and handed him back his pants, new shirt and the two shoes to try on. He flipped out! Couldn't believe I'd matched it just right. And I'm thinking, "Whoa. And I started with the easy one. Heh." I then matched the other 3 pairs of camos, with shoes, matching the shoes exactly on all except for the pair that was done in aquamarine green and bright peach, but I got really close on that one. I handed each outfit to him as I finished and he just got happier and giddy.
Then he wanted another muscle shirt and a two-tone skirt. And jewelry. (We had a long discussion about what jewelry is a default color, which can take all colors, and that bracelets equip to a certain wrist, and how to get a matching one for the opposite wrist.) By the time we were all done, I'd spent over two hours on just this one customer.
He told me he'd been to many, many tailors on multiple servers too, and that he had never had such a successful and enjoyable shopping experience. He said he was just about to log out when he stumbled across my vendor in the mall and now he was never, ever going to any other tailor, he'd be back to see me again a lot, and he was telling all his friends about me too. (Gotta love that word of mouth advertising eh?) Then he ran outside and shouted "I love Qitu!" and "I am the sexiest Doctor in the Galaxy now!" and then ran back inside and asked me to marry him.
I politely declined his marriage proposal. And I asked him, "What is it the other tailors don't do?" He said...
"No eye for color. No concept of color matching."
Please tell me this isn't something being considered seriously for tailors (since we now have two correspondents who support the idea)?
Near as I can tell from keeping an eye on the Armorsmith and Image Designer forums; armorsmiths are confused and irritated that tailors are even a part of their discussion, and after a few brief references to getting recoloring for clothing too, it's not surfaced there again. But on the ID forum, the idea has gained a lot of momentum. That is the one that worries me.
The day some other tailor can recolor something I made is the day I quit tailoring. It's that simple.
Ditto.
So whats the difference between say a player coming to you with a miss-matched set of clothes that he bought and asked you to change the color?
You charge him based on number of times you alter the color. Money is still made and the user gets to decide which tailor has the best color choices?
The tailor still makes money, the user has better options to get the look he wants without going out of his way to wait for a custom job.
I see this scenario:
Dave the brawler is scouring the vendors looking for clothing that has some good bio-tissue stats on them. He finds pieces that he likes on various vendors all over the planet. Once he's bought his ensemble he would love for the look to actualy have decent colors (eg: all black). So he seeks out a tailor and requests the dye change for an extra fee (per item, per time the color is changed)
-----
Is that really so bad to consider? I see this as a great opportunity to get some of the funkier colored stuff purchased off my vendors instead of festering there till I get around to giving up and destroying it.
Vandessa wrote:
So whats the difference between say a player coming to you with a miss-matched set of clothes that he bought and asked you to change the color?
You charge him based on number of times you alter the color. Money is still made and the user gets to decide which tailor has the best color choices?
The tailor still makes money, the user has better options to get the look he wants without going out of his way to wait for a custom job.
I see this scenario:
Dave the brawler is scouring the vendors looking for clothing that has some good bio-tissue stats on them. He finds pieces that he likes on various vendors all over the planet. Once he's bought his ensemble he would love for the look to actualy have decent colors (eg: all black). So he seeks out a tailor and requests the dye change for an extra fee (per item, per time the color is changed)
-----
Is that really so bad to consider? I see this as a great opportunity to get some of the funkier colored stuff purchased off my vendors instead of festering there till I get around to giving up and destroying it.
Since when is tailoring just about making money? I have no desire to recolor cheap bazaar junk and NPC dropped items. I also have no desire to recolor stuff made by the tailor 300m away from my shop who offers only one shade of red on her vendors, and has "conveniently" priced all of her items 150cr less than mine. I'm also not going to recolor items made by the tailor who sells all master items on the bazaar for 3K.
Oh, won't that be nice combined with the new 6K cap on the bazaar? Customers can buy any ugly thing at any price, and have their local tailor turn it into something attractive.
Is that what master tailors really want? To spend time recoloring miscellanous items of clothing that a customer has been carrying around in their pack? It has no appeal to me at all.
As for funky colored stuff that doesn't sell.. well.. as I said earlier, my items are usually made in standard colors that are attractive. If a customer asks for something unattractive and then I have to remake it again, I destroy the first one. I don't put it on my vendor. /shrug
Ri'a
I'm a noob (non-holo) tailor, but I don't think this would be the end of the world at all. I can see a very cool system where clothing dye packs are available from tailors. You get a new schematic with different levels of experimentation, and each dye pack has exactlyONE use, with a slight chance of catastrophic failure ( resulting in either a random color or item destruction ). If you like different sets of the same clothing you'll still have to buy them, and if you prefer a particular color you'll still have to consult with a good tailor, since it is the less expensive alternative. The important thing is that it's a one-time use, and somewhat pricey at that.
Todiscourage grinding, have the ingredients include many small amounts of wildly varying ingredients. Berries, chemicals, water, odd metals, etc. Small amounts so that the total xp for the amount of effort is low, and lots of ingredients so folks wouldn't be making tons of the things easily, and wouldn't ever consider macro-grinding them. Helps to justify a higher price per unit as well.
The tailor's role is the same for most clients, since it will be cheaper to get it right the first time, but for those with precious clothing with BE enhancements and / or skill tapes in them, it would be an attractive option.
Heck, I'd even throw in a complimentary dye pack for big orders - it'd be a nice perk to help build up the busines and bringback the big spenders.
Vandessa wrote:So whats the difference between say a player coming to you with a miss-matched set of clothes that he bought and asked you to change the color?
You charge him based on number of times you alter the color. Money is still made and the user gets to decide which tailor has the best color choices?
The tailor still makes money, the user has better options to get the look he wants without going out of his way to wait for a custom job.
I guess it all depends on what you enjoy doing. I like to make outfits, but I am afraid that I will end up spending most of my time recoloring other people's clothes. Right now my server is full of amazingly underpriced clothing. Most of it is from people who became master tailors because their holocron told them to and they had a few extra resources at the end. Fortunately, most of the time their clothes are really ugly, so it doesn't hurt my business. If someone could buy one of those hideosly colored robes of honor for 2500 credits and then spend a few thousand credits to get it recolored by someone with taste then there is no reason to pay my price!
The other problem is reputation. I have my name on all of my clothes and even if I stopped doing that, you can still examine them to see who created them. If someone had an article of clothing in bright orange and puke green with my name on it (because someone recolored it that way) I would die of shame!
Gyopi wrote:
The other problem is reputation. I have my name on all of my clothes and even if I stopped doing that, you can still examine them to see who created them. If someone had an article of clothing in bright orange and puke green with my name on it (because someone recolored it that way) I would die of shame!
/agree
Every item I make has the color name and "by Ri'a" on it. I want people to know that my colors are standard, and they can easily match items. If someone can change my Navy to something else entirely, that would be more than annoying.
Think of it this way.. we finally get some decent new leather colors. Do you want to spend your time recoloring hundreds of pairs of boots? Not my idea of a good time. We had people saying they didn't like being asked to repair clothes - will recoloring be any better?
Ri'a
Vandessa. Here's the scenarios that I see:
1) It costs tailors little or nothing to color, so they start out doing it for themselves, their friends, and their best customers for free (just we do for schematics, just like DE's do now, and just like CH's do for training animals). Then this becomes the norm. Then customers start to feel cheated that some (few) tailors have the gall to charge for something that costs them nothing, and it becomes a defacto free service regardless of the tailor's philosophy on the subject. Tailors are now forced to spend a portion of their time working for tips, and doing something that is horribly repetitive and menial.
2) Many customers simply choose to bypass this new system entirely when they realize that getting their clothing recolored is akin to finding a doctor to heal them outside of a hospital. They must hunt down a tailor, wait in line, ask very politely to be helped, and then worry about tipping them the proper amount for this "free" service, only to have to repeat this the next time when they want it changed back. They, having lots of money and wanting to flaunt it, and having much better things to do then chase tailors, instead choose to continue to buy multiple colors of the same outfit and bypass all the hassle, not using this sytem at all.
Good points there on the hologrinder's ugly and lowballed goods, and the recoloring of branded clothes.
I brand all my items too, and my name goes with the colors a customer expects to see. It's one thing when you seeyour branded15k Robe of Honorbeing resold on the bazaar for 200 credits. It would be a whole other ball of wax to see it being resold for 200 credits AND it's been changed topuke green and baby-poop muckle-dun yellow. Then the Master Tailor next door to you sends you a mail decrying your pricing is undercutting her business because she assumed if the seller priced it that low, he must have bought it that low too. Grrr.
And no, I do not think I will make just as much money from recoloring. (Though I am not a Tailor for the money or I'd charge more you betcha) If I charged XXX for recoloring, with novice's scrambling for a customer base and two credits to rub together, and the holo-grinders, that customer can and will, always find someone who will do it much cheaper, or even for free.
I am totally against recoloring for clothing. The fact that the profession and market is currently being flooded with holo-grinders and their don't-give-a-dam super-cheap clothes, only exacerbates the problem of tailored goods in general, and tailoring in particular, being devalued. If any version of recoloring is implemented, clothes will be as disposable as camp kits and newbie melons.