Tailor Archive

Why is there this modifier as you go up the Tailoring tree? I have yet to run across a single piece of clothing that I can experiment on. Which makes my new clothing droid useless. And my crafting station. And also kinda ruins the fun in making clothes. Why are we the only crafting profession that can't experiment?

Am I bugged or can none of us experiment?

Sweatpants

Tarquinas Tailor

Experimentation didn't actually do anything the way it was previously implemented, so they removed the option a week or two ago.

So they took out the option to Experiment without removing the text from the skill tree?! Talk about getting your hopes up then crushing them. I would have chosen a different profession if I knew that.

Thats kind of a sore topic. We used to be able to experiment before the last big patch, but they decided that since clothing didn't decay that experimentation was not needed. I personally have a big problem for this since 1) I can not create good quality components for armorsmiths. 2) Experimentation was a good gauge to know how well I was doing and it was kind of like a fun mini-game. 3) When and if they ever do add experimentation back, there is going to be a lot of shoddy clothing with my name on it from this period when I couldn't experiment. I thought seriously about just not selling anything to protect my reputation, but I have to survive!

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Gyopi wrote:
1) I can not create good quality components for armorsmiths.

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Speaking as an armorsmith as well as a tailor, there is no difference in quality of finished armor when using experimented tailored items as opposed to using unexperimented tailored items, so don't worry too much about that issue.

I guess that's the point..

I pounded the technique tree early because there were armorers who came to me rather than other tailors...

Now that advantage is gone..

Worse: Colored Armor required Tailor Skill..

So Armor makers are coming to me asking 'what's the best item to grind at novice tailor... I want colors'... If they're going to go to Technique IV, why not hit Field II along the way and take me out of the picture? They already have the factory...

Being a tailor first and foremost, I made tons of cloth to practice with. Even before they took out experimentation on tailored cloth, I never noticed it actually effecting my armor. I think it just made armorsmiths feel better to see that 80% experimental durability on cloth, because it just didn't do anything to make armor any higher quality. Piece after piece after piece of armor made with unexperimented came out identical to piece after piece after piece of armor made with experimented. The invisible durability rating (because it never actually had any stats at all) of a crate of cloth just didn't have any effect.

Yeah, I think the outcry over the "removal" of experimentation is kinda overblown, like patients in the control group of a medical study complaining afterward that their placebos were taken away, and demanding the doctors give their placebo prescriptions back.

Now, arguing for *real* medicine (i.e., experimentation that has some genuine purpose and reason to exist) is all quite correct and proper, but I've yet to understand what the big deal is about removing a GNDN (Goes Nowhere, Does Nothing) aspect of tailoring....

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SueDenim wrote:

but I've yet to understand what the big deal is about removing a GNDN (Goes Nowhere, Does Nothing) aspect of tailoring....

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Leaving it in sends a message: "It's broken, we know it's broken, we'll fix it someday".

Taking it out sends a message: "We're not going to bother fixing it. Will something replace it? Let us get back to you on that in a few months".

You can experiment with clothing. It just takes 92 skill points more than any other profession, and the mods are still broken. But you can take comfort from your useless but decorative pet jaxes.

Y'know, I actually draw the opposite conclusions.

To me, leaving it in is like saying "Eh, I dunno, maybe it's broken, maybe it's not. Why ask me, I just work here! Go ahead and fiddle around with it, see if it does anything, see if I care...."

And taking it out is more like saying "It's broken, we know it's broken, we'll fix it someday, but it'll be a while, and what we ultimately do might not look much like the current broken implementation, so we're taking it out to eliminate confusion during and after the period we're working on it."

Maybe it's a glass half-empty/half-full sort of thing, or maybe one's reaction depends on how vital one perceives the underlying problem to be. (I.e., should properly implementing tailoring decay and experimentation be an immediate and top priority for SWG development as a whole? Or is it something that could wait a few months.)

I'd like to see it happen, sure, but to be honest, I think it *is* the kind of issue that "Let us get back to you on that in a few months" is a not-unreasonable response given the big picture, even if you're only looking at Tailor-specific problems.

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SueDenim wrote:
Yeah, I think the outcry over the "removal" of experimentation is kinda overblown, like patients in the control group of a medical study complaining afterward that their placebos were taken away, and demanding the doctors give their placebo prescriptions back.

Now, arguing for *real* medicine (i.e., experimentation that has some genuine purpose and reason to exist) is all quite correct and proper, but I've yet to understand what the big deal is about removing a GNDN (Goes Nowhere, Does Nothing) aspect of tailoring....

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Well, the big deal to me is that, as Sam said, is the message that sends us. Look, you don't spend engineering cycles to take OUT experimentation if you intend to make it work (look at all the other broken stuff in the game, that they have been slowly fixing, you don't/didn't see them take any of that out, and experimentation was a lot less broken than most of the other broken stuff). That's just creates more work for them. You take it out only after running up the white flag and admitting that you have no clue how to make it work, or that you'd rather put your development effort into something else (like creating more combat nerfs) rather than working on an issue that they had previously communicated was a top priority for them. The other upsetting thing is that instead of coming onto this forum and posting something like "we've decided against clothing decay and see no need for experimentation. what do you guys think?" they tried to "sneak" this change into a patch. The right way to do it is to give people a heads-up, like they did with the vendor maintenence increase thing. Post a message to the forum, get input, then decide what you're going to decide. At least it gives the impression that they are being responsive.

That's what upsets me about it anyhow.

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CraftyIvy wrote:

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Gyopi wrote:
1) I can not create good quality components for armorsmiths.

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Speaking as an armorsmith as well as a tailor, there is no difference in quality of finished armor when using experimented tailored items as opposed to using unexperimented tailored items, so don't worry too much about that issue.

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I see. I thought it actually did something, but I guess not. I still stand by the other things I said, though.

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SueDenim wrote:
Y'know, I actually draw the opposite conclusions.

To me, leaving it in is like saying "Eh, I dunno, maybe it's broken, maybe it's not. Why ask me, I just work here! Go ahead and fiddle around with it, see if it does anything, see if I care...."

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Sue,

There is just no precidence for this response though. Did they remove the commando stuff that didn't work prior to fixing them? no. Did they remove the BE stuff that is broken (the whole tissues line and all the bugged monsters)? no. Did they remove the broken chef stuff (recipies that can't be made, no eggs, no fish etc)? No. And on and on and on, and you do see these things getting worked on and improved and eventually fixed. Don't you at least wonder what makes this issue so different? Why is there approach on this issue different than on every other issue that they DO intend to fix?