Squad Leader Archive
Thread: Squad leader's Vision
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L0llirot
Sun Aug 21, 2005 9:35 pm
#1
Running through my mind are several profession / game changes. But my squad leader revamp is one that strikes me as the most logical for this profession.
Remove the profession, and instead of grinding leadership skills with pistols make it like this.
Squad leader mods are granted gradually based on pvp points.
This means as a character gains skill and prowess in pvp, his leadership abilities also flourish. So with say every 100 pvp skills, a squad leader skill is granted for free. adding say + 5 melee defense for each person in the group.
Mods gained in pvp can be used in pve also, but the only way to level squad leader would be to partake in pvp combat, with the level of squad leader rightfully representing the experiance you have in combat situations. Showing your natural leadership abilities progressing over time in actual special forces combat, than just killing bols with a FWG.
Opinions
Remove the profession, and instead of grinding leadership skills with pistols make it like this.
Squad leader mods are granted gradually based on pvp points.
This means as a character gains skill and prowess in pvp, his leadership abilities also flourish. So with say every 100 pvp skills, a squad leader skill is granted for free. adding say + 5 melee defense for each person in the group.
Mods gained in pvp can be used in pve also, but the only way to level squad leader would be to partake in pvp combat, with the level of squad leader rightfully representing the experiance you have in combat situations. Showing your natural leadership abilities progressing over time in actual special forces combat, than just killing bols with a FWG.
Opinions
_scout_
Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:04 am
#2
Very very very very very very very bad idea .
Reason:
(a) As a squad leader on the PvP battlefield Im not involved in fighting as much as other profession. This may sound pretty odd, but currently I more busy calling targets (yes with /sys and volleyfire) but also on ventrilo, as well as handing out tactics, strategies, objectives, commands and orders via /sys and vent out to my squad. This usually draws away my attention from fighting as Im watching my overhead map, my groups HAM as well as guessing the next move of my opponent, to guide my squad, so as a squad leader Im not always part of every kill of my group.
(b) Further squad leader is as every other profession a neutral profession, thus should be viable in PvE and PvP belonging to a faction, as well as neutral profession. Although a squad leader heavily leans toward an officer role in an factional environment he isnt per se factional. PvE is a part of the game too and we shouldnt restrict the advancement of one profession to PvP only. There are a lot of ppl who are capable of PvP but dont want to meet those l33t pwners on the battle field and all the smash talk and drama thats involved in this and we should force them.
(c) Further more new players who want to advance in squad leader usually are not involved very much in PvP and even if they jumpstart right away with their lvl 34 Master Marksman to advance to Squad Leader or pick a Combat profession before hand and reach level 54 or grind up two combats profession to switch from one to the squadleader he will be in a seriously disadvantage against long time PvPs because of his lower health and well as his lack of experience in PvP. There would be no visible progress for him since he would be pretty easily slaughter on the battlefield.
(d) On top of that you gain just very very slow PvP rating as its a statistical stat based on yours, your opponents and the server total PvP rating and to increase it you have to defeat higher PvP rating players and you can only gain PvP rating once per defeat every 24hours and even that is sometimes bugged.
(e) And an all time other reason not to have such a thing implemented is lag. I have been part of a 80 rebel vs 40 imp capture the flag event yesterday on ahazi and although I had almost perfect conditions (ping 300-400, no packet loss, bandwith low) I only had 1 fps and got booted twice. Everything I did happened about 1 minute later. My toolbar wasnt even reaction to my clicks nor using the F1-F12 keys (good luck I was on vent).
So in the end its just a plain simple
Squad leader XP should be granted by being grouped (yes even with just a pet) and using squad leader commands. It should be based on the weapon exp just like all other combat professions as well on the size of his group.
Something what would work and be a reasonable level would be
In this case he would advance just a little bit slower as a regular combat profession, since he would get 1/2 the amount of SL xp when grouped with his pet, 2/3 if he is grouped with two others, 3/4, .... and in a full group 7/8 of weapon xp. In addition make one skill tree/master box dependent on combat xp and your set.
A similar calculation would be
Combat XP = 10% of the weapon xp you get. In this case the maximum xp a Squad leader in an 8men group gets is 80% of the weapon XP he earns during the same time, again leveling a bit slower than a regular combat profession.
But this is just my opinion and opinions can be exchanged, nothing more.
Reason:
(a) As a squad leader on the PvP battlefield Im not involved in fighting as much as other profession. This may sound pretty odd, but currently I more busy calling targets (yes with /sys and volleyfire) but also on ventrilo, as well as handing out tactics, strategies, objectives, commands and orders via /sys and vent out to my squad. This usually draws away my attention from fighting as Im watching my overhead map, my groups HAM as well as guessing the next move of my opponent, to guide my squad, so as a squad leader Im not always part of every kill of my group.
(b) Further squad leader is as every other profession a neutral profession, thus should be viable in PvE and PvP belonging to a faction, as well as neutral profession. Although a squad leader heavily leans toward an officer role in an factional environment he isnt per se factional. PvE is a part of the game too and we shouldnt restrict the advancement of one profession to PvP only. There are a lot of ppl who are capable of PvP but dont want to meet those l33t pwners on the battle field and all the smash talk and drama thats involved in this and we should force them.
(c) Further more new players who want to advance in squad leader usually are not involved very much in PvP and even if they jumpstart right away with their lvl 34 Master Marksman to advance to Squad Leader or pick a Combat profession before hand and reach level 54 or grind up two combats profession to switch from one to the squadleader he will be in a seriously disadvantage against long time PvPs because of his lower health and well as his lack of experience in PvP. There would be no visible progress for him since he would be pretty easily slaughter on the battlefield.
(d) On top of that you gain just very very slow PvP rating as its a statistical stat based on yours, your opponents and the server total PvP rating and to increase it you have to defeat higher PvP rating players and you can only gain PvP rating once per defeat every 24hours and even that is sometimes bugged.
(e) And an all time other reason not to have such a thing implemented is lag. I have been part of a 80 rebel vs 40 imp capture the flag event yesterday on ahazi and although I had almost perfect conditions (ping 300-400, no packet loss, bandwith low) I only had 1 fps and got booted twice. Everything I did happened about 1 minute later. My toolbar wasnt even reaction to my clicks nor using the F1-F12 keys (good luck I was on vent).
So in the end its just a plain simple
- No, trash that idea.
Squad leader XP should be granted by being grouped (yes even with just a pet) and using squad leader commands. It should be based on the weapon exp just like all other combat professions as well on the size of his group.
Something what would work and be a reasonable level would be
- SL XP = (groupsize)/(groupsize +1) * (weapon xp)
In this case he would advance just a little bit slower as a regular combat profession, since he would get 1/2 the amount of SL xp when grouped with his pet, 2/3 if he is grouped with two others, 3/4, .... and in a full group 7/8 of weapon xp. In addition make one skill tree/master box dependent on combat xp and your set.
A similar calculation would be
- SL XP = sum( total combat xp of his group)
Combat XP = 10% of the weapon xp you get. In this case the maximum xp a Squad leader in an 8men group gets is 80% of the weapon XP he earns during the same time, again leveling a bit slower than a regular combat profession.
But this is just my opinion and opinions can be exchanged, nothing more.
Almightyrastus
Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:16 pm
#3
So the ones of us who have no desire to ever participate in PvP get nothing?
Forced PvP to get anything is always going to be a very bad idea simply because there will always be the large section of the community comprised of people very much like myself who have never enjoyed PvP and only play the game for the social interaction and the PvE content.
BadChef
Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:46 pm
#4
When I'm leading my team I rarely even fire my weapon. Most of my time is spent communicating with my team while fireing up Volley Fire, Rally, Heals, and debuffs. Just as with other games like battlefield and such, I might not pad my own stats but I'l get my team the win. Granting leadership rewards based on pvp rating or points is very misleading and would end up with the wrong sort of leadership.
You'l find that nearly all Squad Leaders dont just grind out the professions and go out and spam a bunch of specials. With what little they give us that work, we work to the fullest and we work for our team.
Darth_Sushi
Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:07 pm
#5
This is an interesting proposal, but it will never fly with the designers, developers or the greater Squad Leader community as it denies advancement to the PvE playstyle. I do believe in the general idea of keying certain game (or profession-based) features to GCW rank and also rewarding high levels of PvP rank, but that's just a personal observation.I can't begin to speculate how theymight go about implementing this inclusively across playstyles.
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