CUEmu - Thread Posts

Rikilii

Tue May 04, 2004 4:23 pm

A few weeks ago, I got into a discussion with some of the SL veterans on the forum about the merits (or lack thereof) of including NPC commanding and recruiting abilities in the Revamp. Apparantly there are some strong opinions on both sides.

I proposed that the profession have two distinct pursuits. By example, I suggested that two of the skill trees could be dedicated to player-commanding skills (including all the existing skills and additions proposed for the revamp, just moved to two trees instead of four), and the other two could be for NPC commanding skills.

One result of such a system would be that someone who wants to focus solely on NPC-related aspects, could spend exactly the same number of SP as a Master-CH for two trees of SL to get similar abilities to a master CH without the un-Starwarsy "zookeeper" aspect of being a CH. I mean, who wouldn't rather see STs or rebel marines running around in big PVP battles than a bunch of big monsters?

Someone more interested in pursuing the profession as it is now (obviously improved as proposed for the revamp), would spend the same amount of points, less than currently required for Master SL, leaving more room for the SL to take up combat skills. People who want to use enough SP to Master SL would have the best of both worlds, making him a formidable commander, both in groups, and solo, and rightfully so, considering the significant SP expense required for MSL.

Those who were against the idea argued that having the ability to control NPCs would water down their abilities in other areas directly related to leading player groups, especially when it comes to proposed new abilities like:

1. calling in artillery strikes,
2. combat fortifications,
3. dropships,
4. squad weapons (e.g. EWEB) and the like.

Having all of these things, as well as NPC control, they argued, would make the profession too powerful, and the Devs would never go for it.

This dispute got me thinking. One thing all or most of these proposed abilities have in common is that they imply, directly or indirectly the participation of NPCs. Someone has to fire the artillery guns. Someone has to set up the squad weapon, and someone must pilot the drop ship. Why not combine all these ideas into one united system, which gives the SL the choice of mixing and matching these types of abilities, but never in a combination that is too powerful? At any given moment, the SL could chose to focus totally one set of abilities (like the artillery strikes and drop ships), totally on NPC control, or a balanced mixture of both.

Here's one (roughly constructed) way to do it:

A Master SL (for example), would get "100 SL points." Using each NPC-related ability would require a certain amount of available SLP. For instance, deploying an ATST could require 50, so a Master SL could deploy 2 ATSTs at one time. Setting up various combat fortifications could require various amounts of SLP, as could calling in air or artillery strikes. Thus, the MSL would not be able to do everything at once. If he wants to be able to call in artillery strikes or deploy a combat fortification, he has to put away at least one ATST, and so on. This way, the SL could have a wide menu of skills, but not be too overpowered by bringing them all to the field at once. The ability to switch quickly from one set of abilities to another could be controlled by various mechanisms, including delays, data pad restrictions, etc. to make sure it is properly balanced.

To make things even more interesting and balanced, many of these abilities could require the deployment of concrete objects into the game world to work.

For instance, artillery strikes, instead of just "coming out of nowhere," could require the SL to deploy an artillery piece somewhere in the world, within a certain range of the desired target (e.g. 500m). This would be similar to placing a house, and the item would spawn with a small complement of NPCs to "operate" it and defend it if attacked (of course it would be destroyable). Deploying the artillery peice would require a certain number of SLP, just like deploying an active NPC. This feature could open up a whole new element to combat, where forces could send out squads on search and destroy missions to find enemy artillery emplacements, while the rest of their comrades defend their base, etc.

Similarly, calling in a drop ship for evac would require the SL to "deploy" a drop ship, much like a house, that group members could access to use like a shuttle port. Enemies could destroy this ship, much like we can now destroy turrets, to prevent the enemy from escaping.

Tell me what you think of these ideas, both alone, and in combination. Actually, my favorite part of this has little to do with the NPCs. It's actually the part about "deploying" artillery. Maybe I'll make it a separate post.

---------------------------------------------------

Ahazi: Tekhap Ybrae--Former CM and Homeless Nublar Extraordinaire.

TC: Avaro Tribec--Co-founder of the TC-GCW, and Self Proclaimed Leader of the Imperial Legions

InquisitorPayne

Tue May 04, 2004 6:30 pm

#2

We do not want pets, if we cant havethe rest. Have a look at the Smuggler revamp and then give me a reasonable guess of how many points of our wishlist we will get...

Dogg

Dogg M'ordae-Pitibi
General Rebel Badass (Colonel)

SYN - The Leading Force in Rebel PvP

GadonThek

Wed May 05, 2004 8:40 am

#3

I agree. Give us fortification, perhaps. Enhanceand fix out current abilities, most certainly. But NPC control should be tied to rank, nothing more, nothing less.

Rikilii

Wed May 05, 2004 9:03 am

#4

GadonThek wrote:
I agree. Give us fortification, perhaps. Enhanceand fix out current abilities, most certainly. But NPC control should be tied to rank, nothing more, nothing less.

Tying NPC control to rank won't make it any more useable than it is now. No one uses Faction NPCs under the current system because of the ridiculous FP cost and permadeath. If that was changed, and everyone could use 3 faction NPCs all the time with no permadeath risk, then there would be too many around in big battles for the servers to handle.

Tying NPC control to rankalso eliminates the possibility of neutrals controlling NPCs. My idea includes controlling and recruiting NPCs (as CH's tame animals), which could include non-factionalNPCs.

Other than people claiming that adding NPC control to the profession would cut into other abilities (which I think I've addressed with this idea), I still have not heard one good reason why it should not be part of the profession.

Message Edited by Rikilii on 05-05-2004 12:04 PM

---------------------------------------------------

Ahazi: Tekhap Ybrae--Former CM and Homeless Nublar Extraordinaire.

TC: Avaro Tribec--Co-founder of the TC-GCW, and Self Proclaimed Leader of the Imperial Legions

InquisitorPayne

Thu May 06, 2004 12:51 pm

#5

Rikilii wrote:

GadonThek wrote:
I agree. Give us fortification, perhaps. Enhanceand fix out current abilities, most certainly. But NPC control should be tied to rank, nothing more, nothing less.

Tying NPC control to rank won't make it any more useable than it is now. No one uses Faction NPCs under the current system because of the ridiculous FP cost and permadeath. If that was changed, and everyone could use 3 faction NPCs all the time with no permadeath risk, then there would be too many around in big battles for the servers to handle.

Tying NPC control to rankalso eliminates the possibility of neutrals controlling NPCs. My idea includes controlling and recruiting NPCs (as CH's tame animals), which could include non-factionalNPCs.

Other than people claiming that adding NPC control to the profession would cut into other abilities (which I think I've addressed with this idea), I still have not heard one good reason why it should not be part of the profession.

Message Edited by Rikilii on 05-05-2004 12:04 PM

If you wanna play CH, go play CH.

Just dont do it with my Profession.

Dogg

Dogg M'ordae-Pitibi
General Rebel Badass (Colonel)

SYN - The Leading Force in Rebel PvP

ESD

Sun May 09, 2004 3:05 pm

#6

If you wanna play CH, go play CH.

Just dont do it with my Profession.

Dogg

I have to agree with Dogg.

-------ESD Tiredstorm--Esdii Tyrdstorm--eekabeep-------
Darth DEVer: Obi Wan never told you what happened to your game. Luke Gameplayer: He told me enough! He told me you killed SWG! Darth DEVer: No, Luke... I am your nerfer! Luke Gameplayer: No. It can't be. That's not true. That's impossible! Darth DEVer: Search your feelings Luke... you know them to be true. Luke Gameplayer: NOOoooo!

Yeraze

Sun May 09, 2004 3:25 pm

#7

As do I...

Rebel Colonel Date Sunrunner
RAID Elder
Master Squad Leader - The True Jedi of SWG.
Master Carbineer
Master Alliance Pilot

Fluxxen

Sun May 09, 2004 10:07 pm

#8

I wouldnt mind seeing military based pet NPCs acting more efficient when in a SL controled group, but the SL should primarily be a profession to more effectivly lead and help your fellow players, not a NPC handler. Perhaps Faction pets should get some extra attack and defense bonuses when grouped with a SL who is leading the group? That would encourage people to use those pets when with a SL:

Jirigan "Jinx" Nix
Smuggler and Captain of the Distant Star
Mos Mosel (2764, -3060 on Tatooine) - Roleplaying community
- I support Star Wars Galaxies!

DarkRodianOfDoom

Sun May 09, 2004 10:41 pm

#9

i dont post often....and this is a new name....but i agree with Dextrix. Being a Master SL since October, i loved usingStormtroopers with my group....and i will continue to play as a SL when the revamp is finished. i would like to see a spot for Faction Pets in OUR profession, even if it is something as small as being able to use more than 1 at master...or something as big as being able to purchase troops with XP.

Darkolo - Master Squad Leader/Ranger/Carbine

VADR - Hunt Minister

Tarquinas

Darkolo - VADR - Hunt Minister
Master SL - (again at revamp)
Bounty Hunter - 0/4/0/0
Master Carbine
Master Scout
Tarquinas

RETIRED

Dextrix

Mon May 10, 2004 12:20 am

#10

If you wanna play CH, go play CH.

Just dont do it with my Profession.

Dogg

Umm sorry I know I dont post much but...
When I see statements like this I get a little irritated.
This is my proffesion too Dogg. I played a CH and liked it for a long time, wasnt the perpetual nerf bat that swayed me either, it was the broken aspects of it. Auto store, pets running and the like that if it were to be implamented into SL and broken like that I wouldnt like it here either.

That said I like this idea in general. I think it needs some tweaking and so forth, but overall a good idea. For "OUR" proffesion...

Dex Fay'Scatha
Rua Tactician

ps. This isnt a flame. Just dont be so narrow minded and stingie Dogg

Dex Fay'Scatha

{Leader of Rua Dona }

\ Rua Ardan ~ Dantooine /

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