Smuggler Archive
Thread: Have a Question/Concern/Idea about Last Ditch? Read this!
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Nicolas_Frost
Tue May 03, 2005 5:02 pm
#1
Last Ditch is now a true Last Ditch. It spends pretty much all of your HAM dropping you to about 5%. If you have less, then you run the risk of incapacitating yourself. Damage with this special is inversely related to your health, meaning the damage is based on how close to death you are. The more health you have, the less damage it does. The less health you have, the more damage it does.
When timed right, you can one-shot someone into incapacitation, after they've beaten the hell out of you. There are reports of well timed Last Ditches doing upwards of 6000 points of damage before armor. This does not mean Last Ditch will do this every time. You can bring them close, they can have exceptional armor, you can miss. It has not become the God of all specials, it has become an attack that you should hold in reserve untill you're about to die, and hope it hits. I repeat, this is not the "best" attack out there. Mainly because you have to wait untill you're almost dead for this attack to be of any use.
Wes, if you would be kind enough to make this a sticky, it might reduce the number of new threads about Last Ditch.
Editing in to place all pertinate information in the original post, because people are now making more threads about this skill.
From reply #7: Not neccisarily. You are not guaranteed a hit. It is a final risk you take before dieing, thusly LAST DITCH. It's either hit or miss.
From reply #30: The incapacitation timer is based on how much health you had below zero, this fact is universal to all professions. Longer than average incapacitations can happen any number of ways. Your Last Ditch can hit you hard, you can get hit the same times as you use Last Ditch, you could have a regen debuff on you, et cetera.
From Reply #35:
From Reply #40:
From Reply #43:
From Reply #49:
When timed right, you can one-shot someone into incapacitation, after they've beaten the hell out of you. There are reports of well timed Last Ditches doing upwards of 6000 points of damage before armor. This does not mean Last Ditch will do this every time. You can bring them close, they can have exceptional armor, you can miss. It has not become the God of all specials, it has become an attack that you should hold in reserve untill you're about to die, and hope it hits. I repeat, this is not the "best" attack out there. Mainly because you have to wait untill you're almost dead for this attack to be of any use.
Wes, if you would be kind enough to make this a sticky, it might reduce the number of new threads about Last Ditch.
Editing in to place all pertinate information in the original post, because people are now making more threads about this skill.
From reply #7: Not neccisarily. You are not guaranteed a hit. It is a final risk you take before dieing, thusly LAST DITCH. It's either hit or miss.
From reply #30: The incapacitation timer is based on how much health you had below zero, this fact is universal to all professions. Longer than average incapacitations can happen any number of ways. Your Last Ditch can hit you hard, you can get hit the same times as you use Last Ditch, you could have a regen debuff on you, et cetera.
From Reply #35:
Nicolas_Frost wrote:
JacobHiggins wrote:
I would still like to know the ramifications of using it, when you use other specials, there cool down and warm up timers don't change everytime. The damage dosen't differ everytime you use a special either. If you use blindshot, it dosen't knock your oppenent down out of the blue. The unpredictability of using Last Ditch dosen't seem normal. I would have thought that Last Ditch would have been very hard to land. Maybe you would have 25 percent change of it hitting your target, not this strange way it differs from shot to shot!Message Edited by JacobHiggins on 05-12-2005 10:02 AM
Last Ditch is not supposed to be predictable. If it were predictable, it would no longer be a "Last Ditch Assault". You're trying to depend on a skill that has no guarantee of working. That's what the problem is. Sometimes it'll hit, sometimes it won't. Sometimes it'll do a good deal of damage if your health is very low, sometimes it won't. Sometimes you'll cap yourself and your opponent will still be up and about. You should only use it to go down in a blaze of glory. You know why it drains your Mind, unlike most other specials? That's so people can't get down to low health, Last Ditch and then heal. Besides the cool down timer, there's also a hidden timer which keeps it from being used quickly if you have someone healing you or buffs to your Mind Regeneration.
Now please, tell me, what is so difficult to understand about this?
From Reply #40:
BaronJuJu wrote:I have tested it with Jedi (Non Master anything) this evening...I tested using full health and was incapped. Immidiately after incap i stand up and try again...incap again and never hit him. Tried a few more times (3 more) at varying health levels and ended up incapped everytime never hitting him once.
One shot kill...yeah, i fire one shot, they kill me.
You fear this?
From Reply #43:
Nicolas_Frost wrote:
darevsool wrote in Last Ditch Test Duel results:
The 'argument' thread got me curious about this skill, which up until now I have been avoiding, because I was using it incorrectly (as an opening attack, thusly draining my health and getting me incap'd)
I have 2 master smuggler toons, which I logged at the same time, and had duel each other. Dolan (zabrak), character #1, wearing Ubese recon armor (5200/7200/5212) with a health bar of 3190 using a DL44xt with max (energy) damage of 889 (no powerup) Also master pistoleer
Blocade (wookiee), character #2, wearing Ceremonial recon armor (4742/6742/5742) with a health bar of 3250 using an assault bowcaster with max (kinetic) damage of 1142 (no powerup) Also master rifleman Here's how the duels went:
Dolan challenges, Blocade accepts and shoots first. Bowcaster does kin damage, wearing Dolan down quickly. Dolan shoots off LD and hits Blocade for a total of 3429. Blocade's armor absorbed 1788 of that damage, and took a hit for 1640, about 1/2 his total health bar. Blocade auto fires ranged shot back at Dolan and incaps dolan.
Round 2:
Blocade challenges, Dolan accepts and shoots first. DL44xt, doing energy damage, is slower to wear Blocade down. Blocade uses LD and hits Dolan for a total of 6837 damage. Dolan's armor absorbed 2838pts of damage, leaving his health bar drained by 3988...exceeding his 3190 max health, one shot incap'ing Dolan.
To me, LD seems to be working as it's intended. There is more to combat now than the DPS your weapon does. You have to know what type of damage your oppenents armor usually is worst at blocking, you have to have a high max damage weapon that does that type of damage (DPS is not the end-all value of weapons, but rather a general guide as to how you'll be able to use the weapon).
Blocade was able to one shot Dolan because of 2 reasons. The assault bowcaster has such a high damage value, and Dolan's armor isn't very useful against kinetic damage.
Dolan was NOT able to one shot Blocade because he had an energy weapon of only average damage output, and Blocade's armor has energy resists as the highest level.
I'm going to re-test round 1 with dolan using a FWG (kin damage) to see how much of a difference that makes.
Ok...round 3...Dolan using the FWG5 pistol with 854 max damage: Blocade shoots first (using energy rifle to give me more time) and Dolan uses LD and hits Blocade for a total of 4139 damage to his health.
For some reason the combat log didn't show any armor/damage absorbing stats....either way Dolan was able to one-shot Blocade with a simple change in tactics...which I think is what the whole CU thing was supposed to promote.Message Edited by darevsool on 05-15-200503:56 AM
From Reply #49:
Nicolas_Frost wrote:
Now, I want everyone to understand me, so I will use bold, italic, underlining, yellow text, a larger text size, numerous exclamiation points(including the number "one" for good measure), and capslock to make certain my point is clear.
LAST DITCH IS NOT A ONE-SHOT KILL!!!1!!!!11!!!
Last Ditch requires the user to have the everlasting piss beaten outta him before it even has a chance of doing moderate damage, that's IF it even lands. If a Bounty Hunter wanted to use it as a one-shot kill, he would need the Jedi he was hunting to initiate attack, and would also need to not return fire untill he reached the point where he's about to die. The closest this scenario would come to would be the Hunter initiating combat, and letting his prey knock him senseless, then try to get it to work, which is not even guaranteed to hit. In both of these situations, the Hunter is being an utter idiot.
Let me re-iterate, the only way Last Ditch becomes a "One-Shot Kill", is for someone to initiate combat with the Last Ditch-user, the Last Ditch user then must not attack in any way, untill he is so close to death, that Last Ditch has the potential to cause a lot of damage, if he can make it hit.
From this point forward, information I deem as important enough for this topic, will be edited into the originating post.
Message Edited by Nicolas_Frost on 05-21-2005 01:42 AM
Doctor_Zaius
Tue May 03, 2005 6:13 pm
#4
yet if you're only target is one single jedi, then who cares about your stats dropping cause they'll be dead...
ApollyonTB
Tue May 03, 2005 9:56 pm
#6
This is ...just what is sounds like...a Last ditch ATTEMPT. If it hits, you have a chance of doing extreme damage against your oponent, you miss....you die.
Ive been hit by a Last ditch that was used too soon, and it DRAINED the guys health from 75%+ to 25% health left, and barely hit me for 100, Ive been hit by by last ditch that was used properly, and got hit by a 4k hit...only thing was, My armor absorbed 2500 of the hit, and I left me with about 500 health left. I promptly killed the guy, cause he had less than 10% HP left.
There is a TACTICAL way of avoiding this Last ditch from being used.....but
Im not gonna post openely what this method is, but Im sure everyone will know what it is eventually.....and yes it is ALL about tactics.
Nicolas_Frost
Wed May 04, 2005 1:35 am
#7
Doctor_Zaius wrote:yet if you're only target is one single jedi, then who cares about your stats dropping cause they'll be dead...
Not neccisarily. You are not guaranteed a hit. It is a final risk you take before dieing, thusly LAST DITCH. It's either hit or miss.
SFXGenesis
Wed May 04, 2005 5:34 am
#8
I have one thing to say:
JEDI AND BOUNTY HUNTERS HAVE GOTTEN SMUGGLERS SCREWED OVER ENOUGH IN THE PAST. LEAVE THE SMUGGLERS ALONE.
Dani
JWing
Wed May 04, 2005 5:38 am
#9
I agree with everything above.
Several times last night in battle I "depended" on Last Ditch to save me.
That was my 1st mistake..
Because when it misses (and it does), your smoked.
Several times last night in battle I "depended" on Last Ditch to save me.
That was my 1st mistake..
Because when it misses (and it does), your smoked.
Nicolas_Frost
Wed May 04, 2005 5:43 am
#10
JWing wrote:
I agree with everything above.
Several times last night in battle I "depended" on Last Ditch to save me.
That was my 1st mistake..
Because when it misses (and it does), your smoked.
At least you didn't need to get rebuffed.
JediArashi
Wed May 04, 2005 9:11 am
#11
Amen Brutha! Nice post.
Seeing the thread in the Jedi forums nearly made me red in frustration over yet another whiney outcry about one of our abilities....it's probably why Low Blow isn't working right....
Anyway, I know better then to post there, unless it is en mass, so I didn't....but I really wanted to.
Thochkored
Wed May 04, 2005 9:37 am
#12
I actually love how LD works now. If my choice in PvE is to LD or FD and I only have one creature argoed I'm gona LD everytime. I haven't PvP in the new system yet, but knowing I can be dbed while Feigned I'll be using LD everytime. If I'm in a GCW situation I'll still use it and try to take someone with me
SwenLaransa
Wed May 04, 2005 9:37 am
#13
JediArashi wrote:Amen Brutha! Nice post.
Seeing the thread in the Jedi forums nearly made me red in frustration over yet another whiney outcry about one of our abilities....it's probably why Low Blow isn't working right....
Anyway, I know better then to post there, unless it is en mass, so I didn't....but I really wanted to.
He he. I was bored at work, so I did
And now that entire thread is deleted
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