Smuggler Archive
Thread: Revamp Solution
Hey guys,
I haven’t posted in a awhile but it seems the anger sharks are swimming again. I did a lot on this forum last year while waiting for revamp. (told some jokes, post some ideas about weapons, started my own pro smuggler radical fundamentalist organization) but I think it’s time we looked the matter in the face. We are asking for some of the most difficult expensive and time consuming coding ever to be done in the game. Well for it to be done properly anyways.So why not just do it our selves.I know it sound retarded but here me out.We always new smuggler would be primarily player driven with a few NPC characters to give us our right and left limit.So here is what we can do:
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- Identify specific laws need to control the movement of some goods (ae... Hybrid/elite weapons, Medical supplies, spice, Alcohol) to certain area's (ae... tat can have weapons but the huts control entry of medicine and spice, Cor doesn't allow military grade weapons in through customs but allows free trade of medicine).
- Identify Specific Laws on manufacturing it certain goods (ae... elite weapons, spice, Medical supplies) in specific areas (ae... Jabba doesn't care about weapons manufacturing but like all despots he controls medical supplies and food)
- Identify a regulation system for manufactured goods (ae... Like how in Singapore there are only a set amount of drivers licenses that can be issued. It keeps the amount of vehicles on the island down. This system involved a lease system that once your lease is expired you must release. The lease system is conducted by auction and lottery. If you apply this to the manufacturing of controlled goods in controlled zones it cuts down on over manufacturing, builds up the economy and increased demand)
- Identify an enforcement system that works in the current game (remember the short comings of previous enforcement systems) and can be easily implemented. (ae… All illegal factories are open to attack by imperial crackdown troops or imperial aligned players can dispatch crack down troops for a reward, Not able to use the public transportation terminals if you are carrying contraband and if you use the private terminals you either get attacked or marked for arrest.)
- Identify ways that will allow smugglers to operate around and outside of the rules. (ae… Bribe officials, Jam cargo scanners or ship identification scanners, erroneous ship markings.)
- Identify obstacles for smugglers to encounter when smuggling. (ae… Double cross on a bribe, Imperial tip off, sabotaged hyperdrive, bounty hunters.)
- Identify a penalty system for smugglers. (ae… Bounties for outstanding warrants, level of infamy due to raking up multiple warrants makes it harder to conduct operations, Loss of fame due to failed missions makes it harder to conduct operations.)
- Identify a rewards system that can be implemented easily. (ae… An infamy board for smugglers who are the galaxies most wanted, a fame board for smugglers that are the galaxies most legendary blockade runners)
- Identify a simple and easily implemented bounty hunter program.
- Identify a communication system for other players to find smugglers (ae… a NPC who can e-mail a smuggler that is registered with him, an area where smugglers can be recruited out of like a cantina.)
- Identify a contract program. (ae… a simple screen where the smuggler is task by another player to accomplish a task for a set amount of money.)
Now you have identified everything (11 blocks that need answers) you need to put smuggling in the game.Take a block or two from above, type out an outline on how to address the issue with 3 positive things and 2 negative things.
Submit your idea back into this forum (add the block at the top of your response) and I will track it and catalogue it.When most of the blocks have been answered I will start sending the answers in an organized format to WES.
I will post the revised Solutions for smuggler board approval.After we have all the blocks answered the way we want them I will post them in a new thread.
We then need to work on how the skills will play into the smuggler tree to ensure a balanced profession and to prevent dabbling.
Finally I will combine all the info into an organized format and post it for signing.When we get 1000 signatures I will ask Wes to bring it to the devs.But will be hard for them to ignore a number like that.If they do we can wait until it reaches 3k-5k and submit it to gamers world magazine as I’m sure they will be interested in a unprecedented event like this.
Basically I feel that if we do this we can establish what we want to the devs for a final result in smuggler.And it gives us something to do.Or we can wait for revamp.Basically it’s the difference between asking for what we want or taking what ever they will give us.
i like it, i really do. Although from the offset it sounds extremely complicated its basicaly asking the smuggler community to help build up a proffession that WE want. I can see something like this taking quite awhile to get together and present the finished article complete with signatures. By that time we COULD have smuggler missions in place and i think if you compare that system to whats been outlined above the missions sound drasticaly simple compared to inflation and illiegal tagging of goods and people. Dont get me wrong i would love to get something like whats been outlined above into the game (and i'm talking about the ideas yout ouched upon, i understand this is more of a spark thread).
What strikes me though is that the majority of the things you mentioned we have already planned out months and months and months ago but the devs didnt listen and at the end of the day thats what this all comes down to. Even with 1000 names they can simply say no. Even after the games magazines publish the news about the disgruntled smuggler community SOE cant urn around and weave a million excuses that we know dont cut it but for the majority would be sucked in.
Either Or, count me in mate. If you want to discuss things further send me a pm as this is what we as a communioty need to be doing rather than sitting and waiting for news. The time to get active begins now 
Beer and Pie for all
CyusJ,
There are countless posts in this forum that cover pretty much everything you have outlined here. While you have a noble cause, the veterans here have already done what you have suggested many times over, and at the request of SOE have written documents and submitted them, or have replied with comments to SOE's (GreenMarine's) proposal on how to add a contraband system, Smuggling and a contraband and bounty system.
Here are the links to those threads -- although perhaps you have read them already; you said you have been around a long time. (And if you HAVE been around, you should already know this community has provided an incredible amount of input in the form of whole proposals and detailed comments on GreenMarine's proposals). Most of what you have requested in your post is covered in these threads:
Overview:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=smuggler&message.id=95411&view=by_date_ascending&page=1
Proposal:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=smuggler&message.id=96114&view=by_date_ascending&page=1
Solutions to issues raised during the discussions:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=smuggler&message.id=98219&view=by_date_ascending&page=1
Here is the meat of the proposal:
GreenMarine wrote:
This is the second in a series of posts on a smuggler revamp. The goal of these posts is to discuss ideas that can be integrated into a final profession revamp proposal.
In this thread we're going to talk about the contraband system and the idea of smuggling missions. These two issues will be discussed together, because they affect each other.
I've thought about and written down my own conception of how a contraband system update and a new type of smuggling mission would work. These ideas aren't necessarily refined or complete. I want to create a debate through which we can work out a reasonable approach to improving the smuggler profession.
Everything here is debatable, so feel free to question, discuss, or add any ideas you have.
Contraband
Concept
The game’s contraband system will be changed to include a greater number of illegal items, a range of legality levels, and increased penalties for being found with illegal items.
Legal Ranges & Punishment
Items will now have a range of legality. The following legal ranges will be implemented.
Quasi-legal. A player caught with quasi-legal goods will be attacked.
Banned. A player caught with banned goods will be attacked. The player’s visibility will increase slightly for each violation.
Highly Illegal. A player caught with highly illegal goods will be attacked, the goods confiscated (if the attacked player is defeated), and the player’s visibility will increase. Highly illegal objects cannot be transported via the standard travel system by anyone other than a smuggler. The player must use the new smuggler travel system in order to move highly illegal goods. (This new system will be discussed later.)
Illegal objects will display their legality in the examine properties list.
A faction aligned player who is caught with contraband will lose a percentage of faction appropriate to the degree of the crime.
Imperial aligned players will now only be immune to scans regarding quasi-legal goods if they have the rank of corporal or better.
Old sliced weapons and armor will be converted to have the legality level of “banned.”
Scan Frequency
Contraband scan frequency will be somewhat increased. Scan bottlenecks will be introduced at various locations in major cities, such as starport entries and medical centers.
Contraband Visibility
The game's "visibility" system will be expanded. Any player can now accumulate small amounts of visibility for a contraband infraction. The amount of visibility will be dependent on the severity of the infraction.
Smugglers may attempt to find out or reduce the visibility of any player by slicing a bounty hunter terminal. Failure to successfully slice the terminal will result in the smuggler being immediately added to the terminal. Clamps cannot be used in this form of slicing. (This will be a new type of slicing, not wire cutting.) More information on this is available in the slicing section.
Smuggling Missions
Concept
Various criminal organizations throughout the galaxy have found financial success in moving illegal substances and goods from one place to another. The vehicles of these transfers are the smugglers, men and women who store their morality along side coffers full of questionable goods. The smugglers are brave and often brash individuals who risk their lives for monetary gain on a daily basis.
The smuggler revamp will introduce new missions to simulate the smuggling underworld.
Basic System
Smuggling Missions are received from various underworld bosses, called ‘suppliers’. Jabba, Lady Valarian, and other key criminal characters, as well as new characters, will offer smuggling missions. Smuggling missions are only offered to smuggler characters. The difficulty of the mission will scale to the average tier level of the smuggler’s skills.
At its core, a smuggling mission is similar to a delivery mission. The player is given a crate of illegal goods to move to another contact. The player must then return the payment for the goods to the source of the mission.
Ex: Jabba gives the player a crate of 50 narcostims to deliver to a cantina in Mos Eisley. After the player delivers the narcostims, she receives a payment of 12,000 credits. The player then returns to Jabba and delivers 8,000 credits, pocketing 4,000 as payment for the job.
There are no skill boxes specific to smuggling missions, but the smuggler’s skills in scan avoidance and slicing will come into play.
Cargo Legality
Smuggling mission cargo is highly illegal. Any non-smuggler caught carrying a crate of any item to be delivered from a smuggling mission will be attacked and have the cargo confiscated.
Due to the illegality of the cargo, the authorities may occasionally hear about a particular supplier’s intent to move goods. Smugglers on a smuggler mission may encounter attacks from planetary or Imperial authorities, depending on the difficulty of the mission. Killing these enemies is not necessary to complete the mission.
The target for a smuggling mission will only wait so long to receive the delivery. If the player does not deliver the goods within a reasonable amount of time (dependent on mission difficulty), the mission will be lost and the player will receive some visibility.
Withholding Cargo
The player may choose to withhold part of the delivery. In the above example, the player may choose to only deliver 30 of the narcostims to the contact in Mos Eisley. If the player chooses to withhold cargo, s/he will only be paid a portion of the actual delivery fee. The amount of the payment will be directly proportional to the amount delivered.
In order to split a container of mission supplies, the smuggler must successfully slice the container’s locking mechanism.
The player may also choose to withhold part of the money to be paid to the supplier. For example, the player might deliver all 50 narcostims, but only pay Jabba 6,000 credits.
Withholding cargo or pay will result in the smuggler earning a small bit of visibility. Thus, a smuggler who chooses to defy the crime lords who supply her with jobs faces the possibility of execution at the hands of a hired Bounty Hunter.
The more difficult the smuggling mission, the greater the visibility gained for cheating.
Cargo Contents
Smuggling mission cargo often contains items that are components for smuggler crafting. Narcostims, for example, might be a component used in the creation of the spice, Glitterstim. Thus, a smuggler will need to occasionally withhold some of the cargo from a mission if they wish to enter the spice business.
In the interests of the player economy and current game balance, spices will remain craftable. Now, however, smugglers will "assemble" various components into spice packages, instead of chemically brewing them. Experimentation will be added...more details later in the spices discussion.
Smuggling cargo may also include crates of low or mid level spices. The player may choose to withhold these spices and resell them to other players if they wish.
Space Integration
There will be elements of smuggler missions involving space zones & space gameplay, but I can't discuss many space details. The player may have to pick up or deliver goods in space. Players without JTL will not be required to go to space. This is an "after space ships" feature.
I can't stress enough that this is very preliminary design work. This isn't a guarantee of implementation. There is no timeframe, except "sometime after space." This is all subject to potential change. If we find out one system is going to be more work than expected, we might have to replace it with a different idea. Keep an open mind.
The goal with the changes to visibility is to add more risk to the smuggling profession. Smugglers who play fast and loose with their suppliers will find bounties on their heads. Visibility will scale to the nature of the violation. Sifting a few components off the top of a delivery will only result in a minor increase, where as keeping an entire crate to yourself will result in more. The goal is to allow players a choice and scale the risk to their play style.
Please discuss...
I think if you stop and look, you will see that there are probably hundreds ofsignatures right here on the forums (well ok, I haven't counted them) -- in the responses to GM's posts and in the multitude of well-though-out proposals by players themselves. Petitions will garner no more attention than what we have already done.
We have come up with tons of ideas, ways to use existing systems, etc. I think at this point, as paying customers, we have gone well above and beyond the call of duty with regard to contributing our collective brain power and our creativity to the cause of how to implement a feature of the game that should have been coded prior to launch.
This is all by way of saying... well, good luck to you on this quest. I mean that sincerely. It's just I don't think you will get a lot of response to this idea. Everyone is pretty tuckered out from already having done what you suggest (on the whole) for the past two years.
Message Edited by LM on 09-15-2005 12:35 PM
Welcome back CyrusJ...
but this thread makes me sad. It has, what never will be 