Smuggler Archive
Thread: Quick summary of Caylin's famous 100 page doc
I know many of you have been wondering how things have been going with the Community Doc since Caylin handed the reigns to Geevo on this project. One of the things we who are helping Geevo have been doing is picking apart Caylin's now famous 100 page doc that he sent to TH.
This is what I have done with it so far, and please bear in mind that this is very straight-forward and the beginning of the work to be done. All I have done is review Caylin's compilation and boil each piece down to 1 or 2 sentence descriptions of the proposed change. I have taken the lazy route and simply added these description in on Caylin's table of contents page.
I have also removed all of the proposals dealing with the space expansion as TH explicitely said that he didn't want to see any of the JTL stuff in this doc.
What I would like to gain out of posting this here and now is your input on how the wording may need to be changed to better articulate what the actual skill(s) it is describing. Obviously a knowledge of these skill(s) will be needed so I highly recommend reading Caylin's proposal doc if you haven't already done so.
Kudo's to Caylin for putting together a great proposal.
PS- ignore the number and letter designation...hey, I said i took the lazy way out! 
Here it is:
Community Smuggler Revamp
By the Smuggler Community
Version 1.01
5/20/04
Table of Contents:
Profession overview by the Author.
The Skill Tree:
1-A: Novice Smuggler
1-B: Underworld
1-C: Slicing
1-D: Dirty Tricks
1-E: Profiteer (Privateer)
1-F: Master Smuggler
Important Information and Explanations:
2-C: Smuggler's Luck: This is a stackable Dodge modifier based on level of the Smuggler and applicable to the entire group. It is stackable between multiple Smugglers within the same group.
2-D: Slicing Changes and the Addition of a Slicing Modifier: proposal to implement Slicing in a similar fashion to crafting with experimentation points replaced with slicing points. Scaleable number and types of items to slice based upon skill.
2-G: Slicing Tool Certifications: Re-cert FAN’s and Clamps to Novice and Slicing 3 respectively for use, not crafting to encourage a FAN economy for up and coming Smugglers and prevent the abuse of using Clamps all the time.
2-H: Sensor Deception: An actively used scanner avoidance skill that would allow smugglers to avoid scans and show up as a blue dot on radar. Passive skill sharing would still applicable to group members.
2-I: The Smuggler's Personal Weapon: Gives the smuggler the ability to experiment on their own weapon instead of slicing it to possibly greater affect and access to a broader range of modifications. What can be modified and by how much is dependent on skill level.
2-J: Smuggling Ability: The professions namesake should become an XP type that would allow the smuggler access to some of the changed skills mentioned in this revision doc 9i.e. Personal Weapon, Scanner Avoidance, Luck). A new Smuggling stat would be tracked with increasing skill level conferred with new skill boxes.
2-K: Spice Knowledge and Why I Changed the Spice Skill Tree.: This is a proposal to have Smugglers transport spice in an active, content oriented way, as opposed to producing it. Smugglers would be the middle man between criminal NPC factions and the player base allowing them to "purchase" spice from the NPC and selling or delivering it to the player base.
2-L: Counterfeit Identification: This would be a craftable ID card by smugglers that would allow the smuggler and possibly other players for the purpose of faction avoidance and deception. This could also be usable in the "visibility" system for smugglers to be able to be put on BH mission terminals.
2-M: Language Comprehension: We need to make language useful in this game, one way is to tie language in with mission terminals. JTGAlpha has a great idea on how to do this, but it is not outlined here. Possibly make languages cost SP’s.
2-N: Resilience: This skill provides a reduction in Poison, Disease, and other State based effects due to the smugglers exposure and a built-up immunity. This would also be applicable to spice downers.
2-O: Connections: This represents the smugglers connections in the Underworld. This could be applied when running smuggler missions or avoiding Bounty Hunters by using a checkpoint system within various planets and cities (a sort of safe house) that could temporarily turn the smuggler into a blue dot, or clear a TEF for a limited amount of time based on skill level.
2-P: Fast Talker: This skill allows a smuggler to avoid a combat situation by talking his way out of it. Success would cause an immunity to faction and contraband scanners for an amount of time enough for the Smuggler to get away. Success based on skill and possibly the delay timer could be scaleable by skill level as well.
2-Q: Sell Faction: Allow an increase in the FP limit per transaction.
2-R: Opportunist: Grants the ability to trade with all players regardless of their faction status.
2-S: Purchase Faction: Create the ability to purchase faction from more faction types. These would be criminal factions only, and would tie in well with the spice transport system. This could be based on a "trust level" that would work similar to rank and determine the exchange rate.
2-U: Feign Death: Allow FD to be a scaleable skill that has different effects depending on the smugglers skill level. Also un-nerf it to recreate it’s usefulness against mob AI in the new system, the mob memory is way to high.
2-W: New Combat Skill: Create new combat skills for the DF tree. If possible maybe all the DF skills could be used with both a pistol in hand and unarmed to show our versatility and to honor the prerequisites of the profession. These new skills could have 2 unarmed skills and 1 new pistol skill at master.
2-X: New Spices: A total revamp of the spices needs to take place to make them viable in an economy ruled by chef food and buff packs. New spices can be added for Master level, and all spices should not be replaceable by a newer version.
Content Details and Additional Options
3-A: Lawful Citizen Faction
3-B: Smuggler Missions and Smuggling XP
3-C: Smuggling Items for the Player Base
3-D: Contraband Detection Penalty: The Impound Lot
3-E: The Bounty Hunters, Smugglers and their Missions
3-F: Spice Overhaul Proposal
3-G: Spice Addiction
3-I: Weapons that Smugglers could call their own
3-J: Group Role of the Smuggler
3-K: Sabacc
4-0 Conclusion
I took the ideas and put them in this format to help organize everything the community is looking for. I hope it helps a little......
Keeping it very Simple.
1. player smuggling
a. Simply make the scans better and the troops stronger forcing people to need a smuggler in there group. The crack down would work if it were a true crack down.
b. make more itemslike high end resources and special loot very veryillegal items that never make it off planet with out a smuggler moving it.
c. Sensor Deception: An actively used scanner avoidance skill that would allow smugglers to avoid scans and show up as a blue dot on radar. Passive skill sharing would still applicable to group members.
2. Smuggler bountys
a. If you keep or fail an NPC mission you are a target for the bounty hunters.
b. If you fail in a smuggler mission for a player you become a target as well.
c. Rozhloklightningskull/hotdog/vampirerobot all have great idea's on how to make it work.
Smuggler skill tree's
1. text updates
a. fill in the missing text.
2. Spice re-vamp
a. New Spices: A total revamp of the spices needs to take place to make them viable in an economy ruled by chef food and buff packs. New spices can be added for Master level, and all spices should not be replaceable by a newer version.
b. **OR** Have Smugglers transport spice in an active, content oriented way, as opposed to producing it. Smugglers would be the middle man between criminal NPC factions and the player base allowing them to "purchase" spice from the NPC and selling or delivering it to the player base.
3. Slice re-vamp
a. at master lvl let a smuggler - slice bounty hunter terminals and remove jedi and smuggler names. Leave room for eror so if a smuggler fails he to will be added to the BH term as well.
b. Slicing Changes and the Addition of a Slicing Modifier: proposal to implement Slicing in a similar fashion to crafting with experimentation points replaced with slicing points. Scaleable number and types of items to slice based upon skill.
c. Slicing Tool Certifications: Re-cert FAN’s and Clamps to Novice and Slicing 3 respectively for use, not crafting to encourage a FAN economy for up and coming Smugglers and prevent the abuse of using Clamps all the time.
d. The Smuggler's Personal Weapon: Gives the smuggler the ability to experiment on their own weapon instead of slicing it to possibly greater affect and access to a broader range of modifications. What can be modified and by how much is dependent on skill level.
4. Under World re-vamp
a. givethe a"Smuggler Language" that only we understand
b. We need to make language useful in this game, one way is to tie language in with mission terminals. JTGAlpha has a great idea on how to do this, but it is not outlined here. Possibly make languages cost SP’s.
c. temporary name change's
Under World1 - 2 bogus names, name change lasts 5 min.
Under World 2 - 10 bogus names, name change lasts 5 min
Under World 3 - 20 bogus names, name change lasts 10 min
Uner World 4 - 30 bogus names and faction mask, lasts 20 min
Master - Random name change and faction mask that lasts for 1hr. Thiscould be a craftable ID card by smugglers that would allow the smuggler and possibly other players for the purpose of faction avoidance and deception. This could also be usable in the "visibility" system for smugglers to be able to be put on BH mission terminals.
d. Connections: This represents the smugglers connections in the Underworld. This could be applied when running smuggler missions or avoiding Bounty Hunters by using a checkpoint system within various planets and cities (a sort of safe house) that could temporarily turn the smuggler into a blue dot, or clear a TEF for a limited amount of time based on skill level.
e. Fast Talker: This skill allows a smuggler to avoid a combat situation by talking his way out of it. Success would cause an immunity to faction and contraband scanners for an amount of time enough for the Smuggler to get away. Success based on skill and possibly the delay timer could be scaleable by skill level as well.
f. Sell Faction: Allow an increase in the FP limit per transaction.
g. Opportunist: Grants the ability to trade with all players regardless of their faction status.
h. Purchase Faction: Create the ability to purchase faction from more faction types. These would be criminal factions only, and would tie in well with the spice transport system. This could be based on a "trust level" that would work similar to rank and determine the exchange rate.
5. Dirty Fighting re-vamp
a. Smuggler's Luck: This is a stackable Dodge modifier based on level of the Smuggler and applicable to the entire group. It is stackable between multiple Smugglers within the same group.
b. Resilience: This skill provides a reduction in Poison, Disease, and other State based effects due to the smugglers exposure and a built-up immunity. This would also be applicable to spice downers.
c. Feign Death: Allow FD to be a scaleable skill that has different effects depending on the smugglers skill level. Also un-nerf it to recreate it’s usefulness against mob AI in the new system, the mob memory is way to high.
d. New Combat Skill: Create new combat skills for the DF tree. If possible maybe all the DF skills could be used with both a pistol in hand and unarmed to show our versatility and to honor the prerequisites of the profession. These new skills could have 2 unarmed skills and 1 new pistol skill at master.
Vampirerobot wrote:
Allow me to play Devil's Advocate for a moment and pick some of this apart:
"Smugglers can appear as a Blue Dot"
I take this to mean appear as a neutral on Radar. I believe the Devs said they wouldn't implement any kind of Stealth ability (like not appearing on the radar) because this is something that can be "hacked" client side. Maybe that's no longer the case, but for the same reason that you cannot be invisible to other players, I highly doubt you'll ever be able to be Overt but appear as Neutral on the Radar.
They said we would never be able to vanish off the radar entirely as so many wished to do, never mentioned changing the con color on the radar. Yet you are most likely correct that it would not be implemented. It was however an option that would not be overpowering as the players could still be targetted, and the deception on the radar would theoretically break upon combat engagement.
"Smuggling Ability/Smuggling XP"
Admittedly I haven't read the whole 100 pages, but I skimmed it a while ago. Where is the Smuggling XP coming from?
Missions, etc.
"Spice Tree Changes"
To be honest, having to create a whole NPC Spice acquisition system is a lot of work for very little payout. Is making Smugglers a true middleman between Players and NPCs really worth all the Content creation that would require, just so we can feel better about not actually crafting? I say the answer is a resounding "No."
Idon't think it would bevery little payout, we increase the rareness of spice, increase its power andhave the chance to make itextremely potentdue to it rarity. So I believe having a new system other than what we have is extremely worthwhile. If there is something with some RP value and depthbehind it, it is smuggling spices.
Keep the crafting of spices as the general system, throw in a couple Smuggler Mission acquired spices (precedent for this is inthe looted Adrenal Gland "spices" from the Genosian caves), and put that effort into something more important to Smugglers like Smuggler Missions themselves or a Bounty Hunter system.
Bounty hunter systems just get you killed by other players. Thats an option but all in all, it doesn't add much. I consider it high on what we need, but I don't consider it more important than game involving content. Smuggler missions are infinetly more valuable than any BH hunting system, we can make BH just a consequence of the content that we need.
Other than that I like all the little perks like Personalized Weapons, buying faction from other groups,etc.
One of the Four Horsemen of the Smuggler Apocalypse! 
Vampirerobot wrote:
That's just an example though. My preference would be to have a variety of ways to get Spice, depending on the Spice. Some spices we SHOULD be able to mix up in our own little lab, while others we should have to obtain from an NPC source, and still others we would alter or cannibalize existing chemical or mechanical components (like medical supplies or industrial chemicals) to create.
Vampirerobot wrote:...For instance, changing the crafting requirements for some of the Spices to include player crafted components would make those Spices harder to get (rarer), justify more power, and add dramatically to RP because you'd have to obtain the components from other Players in order to make the Spice. And that would only require changing the crafting recipe for the Spice, not coding any additional NPCs, dialogue, mission terminals, missions, or XP types...
No offense, but isn't that profession already in this game and goes by the name "Chef?" Honestly, the only real difference between the smuggler spice line and the chef profession would be semantics.
I mean if all the devs end up doing in the revamp is making the spices stronger and introducing an experimentation line, they might as well just drop the skill tree into the chef profession. Change a few names. Muon Gold=Corusant chocolate and Neutron Pixie=Ithorian nectar whiskey. Cuz the only thing diferentiating "spices" from "food" is the terminology.
I agree that it would be much easier just to improve the effects and the craftability (is that really a word) of the existing spice tree, but then we're once again in an arms-race w/ chefs for the ultimate consumable buff. There needs to be something more smugglerish (see, i'm inventing words like mad today) about the spice line.
Message Edited by Orcajum on 05-21-2004 04:29 PM
Raanan wrote:
Vampirerobot wrote:
That's just an example though. My preference would be to have a variety of ways to get Spice, depending on the Spice. Some spices we SHOULD be able to mix up in our own little lab, while others we should have to obtain from an NPC source, and still others we would alter or cannibalize existing chemical or mechanical components (like medical supplies or industrial chemicals) to create.
Damn, very nice Vampire. Get the best of all three systems. I would definitely go for that.
2. Spice re-vamp
A total revamp of spices needs to take place to make them viable in an economy ruled by chef food and buff packs. New spices can be added for Master level, and all spices should not be replaceable by a newer version.
1. Lower level in-game spice get change to effect skills notHAM
2 Gold and Pixie stay the same and we still have the new spices. The duration on all 4 Master made "topshelf" spices should be 45minbut keep the 3min maxdowner.
3. Experimentation on spice making its "down time" shorteror its "up time"last longer depending on what you use to make it.
Have Smugglers transport spice in an active, content oriented way, as opposed to producing it. Smugglers would be the middle man between criminal NPC factions and the player base allowing them to "purchase" spice from the NPC and selling or delivering it to the player base.
1.NPC missions (organgs, thugs, what ever)that offer up as reward, say5 to 20crates of some rare supper spice. (how fast you finish the mission is how many crates you get and yes everyone will do the missionsbut the market wont get flooded cause the dev's control the suply)
The smuggler who wants to grind out the best spicecan nowdo that.
The smuggler who wants to run missions and be the middle man, can nowdo that. The old in-game spice get a face liftand spice over all (do to all 3 things) becomes a viable item again.
