Smuggler Archive
Thread: Enough of the Blaming!
Of course I don't really believe this, but if you're going to throw that at me with BH, it's going to come right back. Master BH and Master Carbs or Pistols do NOT have enough skill points to get past 0100 in ANY novice profession. Only BH3000 dabblers do this. No onw would master BH then go for Feign Death. We're too weak as it is, we need Master Carbs or Master Pistoleer (I've heard of a few Master Rifle) in order for us to stand a chance as our own profession. What you seen was NOT a BH.
If you continue to use that logic, then it is the same as calling anyother dabbler in FD a Smuggler which ultimately means the SMUGGLER PROFESSION exploited the game.
Like I said, I DO NOT believe this, but this is using your logic.
The Smuggler forums have always been a place of respectable people, a community with a maturity level above what most would have given the circumstances. Yet with all of this pointing the fingers and blaming, it is only fueling the fires of anger. Nothing is getting done. You say that you want to boycott us? Go ahead. Most of us have guildmates who'll slice for free anyways. Nothing will change.
The bottom line here is there are more productive things that could probably be done, things with more of an impact on who really did this to you guys, SOE. Too many of you, however are looking through anger and this entire community is in disarray. Come up with a plan to strike out at the true enemy and it's not the people who play the game.
Truth be told, every combat profession has had their hands in the Smuggler skill boxes. Rifleman, Pistoleers, Bounty Hunters, TKM's, Master Fencers, Master Swordsmen, Master Pikemen and Jedi. Since all of those professions can pick up BH3000 as well, I can see why it would be easy to point the blame at just BH. But realize that EVERYONE has used FD and abused it.
Message Edited by yimaz on 02-19-2005 05:22 PM
ShaikeRamjet wrote:
My point was that everyone is to blame if you are going to blame the gamers. Every combat profession had people who dabbled and picked up Novice Smuggler. Everyone of those professions also post on the BH forums because they feel that since they have BH3000 they are all BH. Nevermind the fact that they are a Master at other professions. Master Bounty Hunters make up a very small minority on the BH forums. Not all of us were even capable of using FD. Dabblers used FD and before you say that they were BH if they had BH... also remember that they had Smuggler as well.
The Devs are the ones to blame here. Tanks said it himself that this wasn't what we wanted. Sure he was happy that Jedi couldn't use it anymore... but no ones intentions were to get this nerfed like this. It was asked by Tanksfor a way to either counter it or for it to have a chance to fail. No one said anything about removing it completely from PvP.
I understand your point and yes more over it is once again the Dev's taking the easy roadbut don't you find it a little strange that FD for the most part was a non-issue until the great Jedi vs BH FD war started?
JTGAlpha wrote:
Why do you care? What does it matter who we blame? Like we're gonna sue you guys for it? It's over, we got hosed, you get your changes thanks for dropping by.
Because I am a player just like you. I have been a ranged BH since July 03 and I was here when knockdown first got nerfed. I was here when eyeshot got nerfed and I was here when the Scatter pistol was nerfed. BH has been through many nerfs along the way and it has always been about other players crying nerf. The same thing happenned to Creature Handlers...
No matter what profession it happens to, its impact is felt throughout the community. Why do I care? Because I share the same game that you do. I don't like seeing anyone nerfed anymore than you do. What I want is balance. What I want is fairness. And above all else, I want the community to stop hating each other. We play this game together.
yimaz wrote:
ShaikeRamjet wrote:
My point was that everyone is to blame if you are going to blame the gamers. Every combat profession had people who dabbled and picked up Novice Smuggler. Everyone of those professions also post on the BH forums because they feel that since they have BH3000 they are all BH. Nevermind the fact that they are a Master at other professions. Master Bounty Hunters make up a very small minority on the BH forums. Not all of us were even capable of using FD. Dabblers used FD and before you say that they were BH if they had BH... also remember that they had Smuggler as well.
The Devs are the ones to blame here. Tanks said it himself that this wasn't what we wanted. Sure he was happy that Jedi couldn't use it anymore... but no ones intentions were to get this nerfed like this. It was asked by Tanksfor a way to either counter it or for it to have a chance to fail. No one said anything about removing it completely from PvP.
I understand your point and yes more over it is once again the Dev's taking the easy roadbut don't you find it a little strange that FD for the most part was a non-issue until the great Jedi vs BH FD war started?
Yes... you have a point. But also realize that like I said before, that encompasses a broad range of other professions who happenned to pick up BH3000. Jedi used it, and for the sake of try to avoid an arguement... Hybrid BH used it, which covers nearly every profession out there.
Message Edited by JakobSunrunner on 02-19-2005 03:54 PM
ShaikeRamjet wrote:Because I am a player just like you. I have been a ranged BH since July 03 and I was here when knockdown first got nerfed. I was here when eyeshot got nerfed and I was here when the Scatter pistol was nerfed. BH has been through many nerfs along the way and it has always been about other players crying nerf. The same thing happenned to Creature Handlers...
No matter what profession it happens to, its impact is felt throughout the community. Why do I care? Because I share the same game that you do. I don't like seeing anyone nerfed anymore than you do. What I want is balance. What I want is fairness. And above all else, I want the community to stop hating each other. We play this game together.
I love that post, ShaikeRamjet.
I find sad that the war and rivalty that should be in game only spill that badly out of game.
Most of us are passionate about our profession(s). It is perfectly normal, game would be boring if we weren't. The Smuggler community is a great one to hang with, smart and passionate peoples, who love this game and love their profession, even if we grumble at time.
Right now a lot of peoples are angry and bitter, and that make calm level-headed conversation difficult. I do not blame anyone for their anger, mind you: I am not quite happy myself about how things were done. But just saying, don't let the actual anger taint your view of this community.Ballance and fairness. I'm sure it is what the Devs want too, you know. But it is very hard to achieve, in a MMORPG. We are nerfed, nerfed, nerfed, then they will say "ok now time to stop talking about it and revamp that profession, it is no longer fun" and they will revamp us, then we will be powerful, then some will complain, the devs will say "mmm yeah maybe we did overcompensated a bit" and we will get nerfed again... It usually happen somewhat like that. lol
At first your first post ruffled my feathers a bit, so I forced myself to read it a second time. I guess I am human, and tend to react more negatively to what I read when I am angry.
I understand what you say, that MBH are not thoses using FD, and that calling anyone with any BH skill a BH would be like calling a Jedi with FD a Smuggler.
But I have a problem with blaming dabblers too. Because we are ALL dabblers in a profession or another. This game is about dabbling, about not imposing clear cut "classes" with cookie cutter templates. Picking and choosing skills to create a template you like and fit your gameplay is part of what SWG is about. Blaming BHs and Jedi for the FD outcry and subsequent nerf is not fair: they only took advantage, lawfully, of a possibility they had. Like I would if I was taking Novice Commando to get their Pistol.
So I am unhappy about how the Devs handled the situation. And unhappy with players who don't want fairness or ballance at all and cry nerf instead of looking for solutions. But I see no point in blaming whole professions.
Anyway, you seem to be a fair player able to show sportmanship. Will be a pleasure maybe one day to be hunted by you.
Message Edited by LaughingWolf on 02-19-2005 09:03 PM